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Alternate Griff paradox

posted by 141.62227kmph on - last edited - Viewed by 1.2K users

Assuming Griff's father was born after 1973 (the year Biff married Lorraine in the alternate timeline) Griff wouldn't exist in 2015A, meaning Doc wouldn't have to take Marty and Jennifer to 2015 to sort out their kids, meaning old Biff never got his hands on the Almanac or Delorean so never gave it to his younger self, meaning 1985A wouldn't exist.:):):):):)

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  • Wow I think you're right! Because origionally Biff didn't marry Lorraine and then Griff existed.
    But some other smarter and more intellectual guys like Martin Mcfly or Michael J. Fox is Canadian will prove you wrong somehow. I don't know how but they will.

  • But old Biff didn't exist in the future anyway.

  • @Marty Mcfly III said: But old Biff didn't exist in the future anyway.

    How can he not exist in the future? He didn't die or something.

  • Yes he did. Remember when he stumbled off in pain after landing the Delorian? That is because the intent was for him to fade away, having been shot by Loraine in the 90s. Unfortunatly this point wasnt really got across well on screen, so alot of people missed it.

  • Yea, you're right, but what 141.6227kmph said is still true right? 1985-A would still dissapear. Wait, I just thought of something to prove you wrong! Agh, I forgot it. Thinking about time paradoxes and calamaties makes my head hurt.

  • Well for one thing I think the hot tub scene implies Biff cheats on Lorraine in that timeline. When Lorraine says "the least we could do with all that money is provide a better life for our children" to which Biff says "Marty is your kid, not mine." This implies that Biff has at least one of his own children.

    But anyhow generally the McFly's are the same age as their tannen counterparts; Biff is a year older than George, Marty Jr. and Griff are roughly the same age. Marty is born in 1967 or 1968 so it's very plausible Griffs parent was already born/conceived by 1973.

    It doesn't seem like events of the future are heavily dependent on time travel. By that logic, any time travel initiated with the intent on changing the timeline (Marty going to the future to save his son, Biff going back to 1955 to make himself rich, Doc and Marty going back to 1955 to restore the timeline, Marty going to 1885 to save Doc) should create a paradox if successful. Presumably in the alternate timeline Griff is financially stable enough that he does not need to stage a robbery involving Marty Jr. (hell if they still own the police, they could easily be corrupt enough to get away with a robbery if they wanted to). Likewise if biff is still alive in 2015 (and since the fading scene is deleted, its not a part of the film), he likely wouldn't need to time travel.

    You could also use the theory that changes to the timeline allows a person to travel not only across the fourth dimension (time) but the fifth dimension (timelines).

    So for instance the scene that we see of Biff meeting his younger self takes place in the biffhoric timeline but the old biff would come from the previous timeline. We have no idea how the events of 2015 play out under any other timelines besides the original one of Marty Jr. going to jail. I'd assume the inter-dimension theory has to take place because 'old doc' is still in FCB's pic from 1931 and those 2015 events still have to take place for the current events to transpire (this is how the lightning bolt duplicated the deloreans in 1955).

  • You're right, it is a paradox. Old Biff going back and making himself rich would alter the events we see in 2015 to the point that they likely never occurred. Which is why Doc and Marty don't go directly to 2015 to stop Biff.

    I wonder why old Biff even returns the Delorean to 2015 after he hands off the Alamanac in the first place. The events that got Old Biff the Dolorean won't happen anyways as 141.62227kmph pointed out.

  • Just thought of something else. In part one young Lorraine thinks Marty's name is Calvin Klein (I know he said 'most people call me Marty' or something like that but she still calls him Calvin). But after the enchantment under the sea dance she says 'Marty. That's a nice name.'

    1. Why is she suddenly referring to him as Marty?
    2. Wouldn't Lorraine and George have named Dave Marty instead? After all, Dave was their first born son, and if they were going to name their kids after Marty they would've named their first son Marty, not Dave.

    And i'm timing how long it takes for Michael J. Fox is Canadian to disprove my theory. ;)

    And sorry about the long username, its 88 miles per hour converted into kilometres per hour. Because we Australians measure in kilometres, not miles.

  • @141.62227kmph said: Just thought of something else. In part one young Lorraine thinks Marty's name is Calvin Klein (I know he said 'most people call me Marty' or something like that but she still calls him Calvin). But after the enchantment under the sea dance she says 'Marty. That's a nice name.'

    1. Why is she suddenly referring to him as Marty?
    2. Wouldn't Lorraine and George have named Dave Marty instead? After all, Dave was their first born son, and if they were going to name their kids after Marty they would've named their first son Marty, not Dave.

    And i'm timing how long it takes for Michael J. Fox is Canadian to disprove my theory. ;)

    And sorry about the long username, its 88 miles per hour converted into kilometres per hour. Because we Australians measure in kilometres, not miles.

    1. Marty did tell her from the getgo to call him Marty, she kept calling him Calvin. Notice she does start calling him marty when they are parked in the car and this is what George calls him.
    2. There's any number of theories, one being that Dave was named after somebody or they just liked that name better


    I was going to compliment your user name btw. the USA is one of the only countries which does not use the metric system. Where I'm from we use KMs so i got it :)

  • @MichaelJ Fox isAntarctian said: But some other smarter and more intellectual guys like Martin Mcfly or Michael J. Fox is Canadian will prove you wrong somehow. I don't know how but they will.

    Ego: +1

    @MichaelJ Fox isAntarctian said: 1. Why is she suddenly referring to him as Marty?
    2. Wouldn't Lorraine and George have named Dave Marty instead? After all, Dave was their first born son, and if they were going to name their kids after Marty they would've named their first son Marty, not Dave.

    EDIT: Nevermind. I had this lovely response written out for you but had an errand to do so I saved it to post later. I should have known that MJFIC would be all over this question like a donkey on a waffle.

    And sorry about the long username, its 88 miles per hour converted into kilometres per hour. Because we Australians measure in kilometres, not miles.

    Surprisingly, I got the joke; Canada also uses the metric system.

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