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dead-ends in king's quest

posted by shaygol on - last edited - Viewed by 2.5K users

The thing I remember most about sierra games are the dead ends.

This usually happens when you got to a certain place in the game and you can't move on no matter what you do. Then, when you look at a walkthrough you see you forgot to pick up a certain item and you need to restore or restart to get to that point in the game.

This is something both lucasarts and telltale (till now) avoided.

But if they're remaking king's quest what will happen?

I prefer it if they will continue to avoid those dead ends. I didn't like them - they seemed so unfair, it was the main reason i preferred lucasarts games to sierra.

85 Comments - Linear Discussion: Classic Style
  • e. I think if you missed the meat, however, it actually demonstrates my point that much more. Let's assume we have two versions of the game, the original, and one that doesn't let you give the eagle the pie.

    Um, actually by then you'd be dead. If you don't eat half the lamb early on in the mountains you starve (this leads to another death scene). You die not long before reaching the frozen waterfall/sled hill. You get the first hunger warning shortly after entering the mountains. If you ignored that warning, then its your problem, ;).

    So you won't get far, if you somehow missed the meat in the Inn! Btw, you can return down the mountain to get the meat at any time before the 'starvation trigger'. You were warned, so you better go look for something to eat.

    BTW, I think you lose points if you eat the pie! or at least get zero points for eating the pie. Though it might work for the 'hunger warning', and prevent you from starving.

    You don't receive points for eating the second half of the lamb, though I don't think you lose any either.

    Giving a pie to an eagle would not be my first choice, when I have half a leg of lamb in my inventory, and you know eagles are flesh eaters!

  • I still hate the design with Genie Lamp in kq5. The only way you can figure out what it does is open it and that kills you. Plus in the Bandits den you can miss the gold coin when you leave with no way to get back into it, give madam muska the golden needle, and then have no way to get the cape to survive the cold. Plus you can forget the locket in the roc nest and then Cassima won't help you.

  • You can give the tailor the gold coin instead of the needle and you'll still get the cloak.

    The Roc's nest isn't really fair. You can't do anything in that scene at all except for look and interact. Obviously that's a huge hint. Coupled with the fact that there's an animated glint right next to you there's little chance you'll miss it.


  • I still hate the design with Genie Lamp in kq5. The only way you can figure out what it does is open it and that kills you. Plus in the Bandits den you can miss the gold coin when you leave with no way to get back into it, give madam muska the golden needle, and then have no way to get the cape to survive the cold. Plus you can forget the locket in the roc nest and then Cassima won't help you.

    Let's be fair you won't become stuck if you kill yourself with the genie. You can't save during the death sequence. That's actually one if the more forgiving kind of deaths.

    And there no way to become stuck I you have both gold coin and gold needle. Both can be traded with either character for alternate solutions. Although I think you get more points for returning the needle to it's rightful owner.

    Also the hidden flashy item to be found was part of many early Sierra games! Flashy items are quite obvious. Even to this day games use the flashing to designate important items. See Call of Duty. I always found that if something flashes I need to pick it up!

    Now hidden items those can be annoying! Remember the hidden bridle in KQ4, now that was obscure and not obvious at all! Once you missed it you missed it.

  • @MusicallyInspired said: You can give the tailor the gold coin instead of the needle and you'll still get the cloak.

    I know you can switch who you give the coin and the needle but if you grab the lamp and forget the coin (cause you don't have much time in the treasure room and you might miss it) and give the golden needle to the gypsy, then you're stuck later after you did all the stuff in the forbidden forest. If you saved only one game and you have no way to get that coin cause you can't get back in the treasure room and have to restart the whole game. I had to do something similar when you enter the forbidden forest and not having the lamp cause I gave the gypsy the needle. Then your stuck cause you can't leave. The nice thing there was it was early in the game.

    Let's be fair you won't become stuck if you kill yourself with the genie. You can't save during the death sequence. That's actually one if the more forgiving kind of deaths.

    Yes I know, what I didn't like is that the only way you can figure out it's bad is open it and dying. Normally from Aladdin and all the other genies in lamps grant you wishes. That was far from the worst puzzle in kq5. It's not a stuck puzzle, it's just trial and error.

    Now hidden items those can be annoying! Remember the hidden bridle in KQ4, now that was obscure and not obvious at all! Once you missed it you missed it.

    I hated that one! That was easy to miss and there was no way to come back to it. There at least should have been a warning not allowing you to leave until you picked it up.

  • @techie775 said: If you saved only one game...

    I stopped reading here.


    ...ok not really. But it's a fair point that if you're playing a Sierra game you should know to have multiple saves. Especially by the time you get to KQ5, if you've been playing them consecutively.

    Also, you can't just get swallowed by the whale again and get spit back out at the island?

  • One save, ahahahahahahaha. Sorry.

    They tell you in every Sierra manuals: save early, save often! They go out of their way to warn you these dead ends exist and are intensional!
    Yes I know, what I didn't like is that the only way you can figure out it's bad is open it and dying. Normally from Aladdin and all the other genies in lamps grant you wishes. That was far from the worst puzzle in kq5. It's not a stuck puzzle, it's just trial and error.
    You haven't read very many persian and Arabic myths right? Genie in the legends can be evil! Anyone who has played QFG 2 might remember Iblis, in the original myths aka Shaitan!

    Also, you can't just get swallowed by the whale again and get spit back out at the island

    I'm not sure the whale reappears again after you are swallowed once, it's a scripted sequence. ...and by the way you can get eaten by the whale or end up on the island without all the require items. No warnings. If no feather you will ultimately suffocate. If no fish you will dehydrate in the Desert Island! Take too long to help the bird it will fly off. Alot of things about that island was designed as a dead end.

    Actually it's very possible to use up the love arrows which will lead to another dead end associates with the unicorn!

  • @MusicallyInspired said: I stopped reading here.


    ...ok not really. But it's a fair point that if you're playing a Sierra game you should know to have multiple saves. Especially by the time you get to KQ5, if you've been playing them consecutively.

    Also, you can't just get swallowed by the whale again and get spit back out at the island?


    I didn't do it often where I'd only save in one spot and at the time the only Sierra adventure games I'd played was Quest for Glory series, which I always thought was more forgiving than KQ. Sure you could save your game there and get stuck but I always thought they gave you more of a warning (ex:dryad telling you about the dispel potion being needed). And no KQ5 CD was my first King's Quest Game from the Sierra Originals, I didn't play them in order. I quickly figured out to save often but it was a pain before I did.

  • I will agree that Sierra games aren't as easily approachable mid-stream as LucasArts games. But that just means they've upped the ante. It's a little more hardcore. A little more challenging. You learn to love it.

  • There's certainly room for harder games. Ninja Gaiden has a pretty good reputation in the modern gaming world for its difficulty. I suppose the ultimate test is to make a more challenging adventure game and let the sales determine whether the market.

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