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Mass Effect Thread

posted by WARP10CK on - last edited - Viewed by 3K users

WARNING SPOILERS FOR MASS EFFECT 3

Just finished Mass Effect 3 and was having a great time until the last 5 minutes of the game.

The ending you get is probably the most depressing ending and since this is mass effect that´s probably the bad ending right ?

Nope all the endings are almost identical no matter what you do and the outrage on biowares forums are huge.

I would not mind a sad ending but there is no explanation to what happened this is the gaming equivalent to the sopranos ending.

Nothing is really resolved and there is not even an epilogue.

Oh well just look at biowares forums then you know

http://social.bioware.com/forum/1/category/355/index

359 Comments - Linear Discussion: Classic Style
  • @KuroShiro said: To be fair, in a lot of ways it is actually more like Gateway.

    I've never seen Gateway. Actually though, reading it again, ME3 seems a bit more of some weird love-child of Battlestar Galactica and the Matrix.

  • @Alcoremortis said: I've never seen Gateway. Actually though, reading it again, ME3 seems a bit more of some weird love-child of Battlestar Galactica and the Matrix.

    Gateway is a series of books by Frederick Pohl, wherein humanity discovers an abandoned space station (Gateway) constructed by a mysterious unknown race which allows for interstellar travel. The main crisis of the series is a group of mysterious machine intelligences coming to wipe out all life in the galaxy. ME diverges from it in a lot of ways, but yeah...

  • @KuroShiro said: Don't know how damning this really is, but it certainly does not inspire confidence.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zRRpGlmtws8

    That only proves that the character is in the game, but not the DLC (which, btw, has to download 700 mb of information or something like that, so it's NOT on the disc and it IS downloadable). Which doesn't contradict what BioWare has said. Some people mention that there was a leak of the script regarding the Prothean/DLC stuff last year. Well, that ALSO doesn't cotnradict what BioWare has said. Plus, people already have said that changing the line only adds the character to the party, no missions or out of combat dialogue.

    Game development of a massive game is a very complicated process. The way it could go down is that, having a script and a character ready, people at BioWare have estimated that they may need to push the certification date further so all content would be included. So they took the least complete/important (otherwise known as the most optional) feature they had planned and scheduled to fully develop it during the certification process and release it as DLC. No contradictions or bullshitting there.

    Now, mind you. I do not agree with the fact that it's a PAID DLC. In fact, I REALLY dislike paid DLCs. I think paid DLCs should be more akin to the expansion packs of old, while small DLCs should be more similar to bonus stuff that would be added to patches in the days of old. For free. And Mass Effect 3 Day 1-DLC is not a huge amount of content, it doesn't deserve to be a paid-for-DLC. More than that, I believe that if it would be a free DLC, there would be absolutely no complaints at all from the consumer public. In fact, they'd be HAPPY. Like, 'Whoah, not only do I get a full game, but also a free DLC for no extra fee?! GIVE ME TWO!'.

  • I am not reading this thread because I don't want to spoil the story of ME3 for myself. However, I am in here to say that there are various games which I have played in the past that people hate on., so I'm also going to judge the game for myself after I play it (which I fully intend to do.)

    All I'm really saying is: Haters gonna hate.

  • @Vainamoinen said: Mass Effect Wiki]The Catalyst is the master AI that controls the Reapers [...] When encountered by Commander Shepard, the Catalyst represented itself using a hologram, taking the form of a young boy


    I'm not sure where they got this information. The child acts just like the Protean "personality Imprint" VI at the end of the first Mass Effect.

    The kid is, for the purposes of this story, as I have previously stated, a God. Without this God and his enormous powers inside, the Crucible machine is obviously worth shit.


    Before the kid shows up, you expect to build a machine that can destroy or control the Reapers. After the kid shows up though? You have this weird magical device that can control or destroy the Reapers! Woah! Totally OUT OF NOWHERE.


    The Catalyst serves as the architect and overseer of the Reapers and their cycle of destruction. [...] the Catalyst was tasked with solving a dire problem: the inevitable creation of synthetic intelligence by advanced organic civilizations, and the equally inevitable conflict that results.


    Oh! I see! It's bad because it's able to explain things!

    It is a god-like machine that at will giveth and taketh away the options the Crucible has to offer. It renders to and/or pressures on Shepard a decision that it SHOULD make itself, given that the problem-solving is what it was created to do. Case closed. ;)


    It..."Giveths" the options of the machine that we knew we were building from the first few minutes of the game, giving us the options that are hammered into your head repeatedly every step of the goddamn way. This is like complaining every time Aladdin makes a wish(despite genie mechanics being laid out quite early in the story). The machine we knew we were building was built and gave us the choices we expected. The twist is that it can talk. A computer that can TALK in Mass Effect?! How absurd!

    Synthesis coming from EMS is likely an expression of Sheperd "adding" the option of cooperation through getting a really solid group of guys to work together. It should probably be able to come from making choices that allow the Geth and Quarians to cooperate and/or advancing the Joker/EDI romance, honestly, but the core idea here is actually fine.

    @Vainamoinen said: So wait, they are machines that wipe out organic life to avoid having organic life wiped out by machines? Yes... it all makes sense now :confused:


    Yeah man, that's really stupid. It's like fighting fire with fire, which never works.

    The child hologram quite flatly states that they see themselves as agents of preservation while allowing organic life to continue to exist and grow in variety, which is a very literal evolutionary stance. The way they see it:

    Universe sans Reapers
    Organics live on planets.
    Organics advance, build robots.
    Robot apocalypse happens.
    No more organic life anywhere :(

    Universe with Reapers
    Organics live on planets
    Organics advance
    REAPER ATTACK
    Old organics preserved in Reaper form
    Primative organics get to live

    Synthetic life isn't able to reproduce or change in the traditional evolutionary stance, and if you see the overall goal of organic life as being able to reproduce and change for the better, then yeah, the plan of those who built the Catalyst makes sense, though only IF robot apocalypse is inevitable. The Catalyst is a bit genre-savvy, and realizes that yeah, in sci-fi universes the robots ALWAYS REBEL.

  • @Rather Dashing said:
    Yeah man, that's really stupid. It's like fighting fire with fire, which never works.


    Ah, argument from analogy, we meet again.


    ...
    No more organic life anywhere :(
    ...
    Universe with Reapers
    ...
    Primative organics get to live


    And here is the big logical flaw. Without reaper technology, FTL travel would be impossible in the galaxy as it is so any synthetics created would be confined to a single planet. If FTL travel was developed, what possible reason would synthetics have to go around to primitive worlds squashing all life? It just seems stupid.

  • @KuroShiro said: Ah, argument from analogy, we meet again.


    The analogy works. Just saying "Killing to avoid killing? That's stupid!" is completely idiotic without further clarification. We hunt deer to keep them from assured self-destruction, and that follows the exact same logic being lampooned here.

    And here is the big logical flaw. Without reaper technology, FTL travel would be impossible in the galaxy as it is so any synthetics created would be confined to a single planet. If FTL travel was developed, what possible reason would synthetics have to go around to primitive worlds squashing all life? It just seems stupid.


    You don't need a single race of synthetics, just multiple races of sentient organics. Organic species continue along the same curve, eventually make sentient synthetics, and incite robot apocalypse. The Mass Relays make sure that the Reapers know where everybody is roughly around the time they make these robots because, you know, once you control the trade network, you control the civilization. Otherwise, you'd just have organic species after organic species being destroyed by the genre they inhabit.

  • To me, it all sounds like BioWare is pulling a Molyneux. I mean, they advertise Mass Effect as a series where everything you do has direct consequences to the rest of the game. Which should have included the final ending. Instead it sounds like a cop-out where every action you previously did in all of the three games were for naught. Or at least made as if whatever you did didn't matter.

    I mean, look at it this way. Let's say Notch was a bastard. He let you build up your world, fight monsters to create a Nether Portal, meanwhile building up a huge village. Then, at the end, you fight the Netherdragon and defeat it. Now instead of just spawning a dragon egg and allowing you to see the three(?) minutes long ending sequence it teleports you to your house, which is now ON FIRE. FILLED WITH CREEPERS. AND HALF OF YOUR VILLAGE IS FILLED WITH TNT. Yes, all the work you put into your house, your village, the world itself, it has all been for naught, because now you'll need to clean up the mess the fire and all the creepers and TNT left.

    On second thought, pretend I never written it down. I'm pretty sure Mojang is crazy enough to actually do this.

    Or, in a more extreme case, after the ending of Minecraft it all ends up being a dream. You wake up at your original spawn, and the rest of the world AND your inventory isn't there anymore. It's like you started a new save.

  • @Rather Dashing said: The analogy works. Just saying "Killing to avoid killing? That's stupid!" is completely idiotic without further clarification. We hunt deer to keep them from assured self-destruction, and that follows the exact same logic being lampooned here.


    Arguments from analogy are inherently flawed because no matter how similar two different situations may seem, they are never exactly the same. I.E. we hunt deer to ostensibly keep them from dying from overpopulation, reapers hunt organic life to keep them from being killed by synthetics.


    You don't need a single race of synthetics, just multiple races of sentient organics. Organic species continue along the same curve, eventually make sentient synthetics, and incite robot apocalypse. The Mass Relays make sure that the Reapers know where everybody is roughly around the time they make these robots because, you know, once you control the trade network, you control the civilization. Otherwise, you'd just have organic species after organic species being destroyed by the genre they inhabit.

    This still doesn't address how what the reapers do is in any way different from what synthetics would do otherwise. They wipe out all organic life advanced enough to potentially be capable of wiping themselves out. Low-tech civilizations would be spared either way, and the cycle would continue in the same way regardless of whether the reapers were there or not.

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    Vainamoinen Moderator

    @GaryCXJk said: I mean, they advertise Mass Effect as a series where everything you do has direct consequences to the rest of the game. Which should have included the final ending. Instead it sounds like a cop-out where every action you previously did in all of the three games were for naught. Or at least made as if whatever you did didn't matter.

    Bioware has made a lot of promises for ME3 it could not keep (the "revolutionary battle system" being one of them). I am really disappointed with the ending, but I never thought that it could do that, take every choice of previous games into account and have different endings for each combination.

    I have no doubt that the series Mass Effect is, from the viewpoint of interactive storytelling, a huge achievement that will stay unrivaled for quite some time. But the limitations Bioware's "story algorithms" underlie were always visible since Knights of the Old Republic; I expected to see these limitations most obviously in Mass Effect's finale - and for sure I did.

    I'm in the process of writing a longer article about it, but I might actually start a blog with that. ;)

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