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Derek Karlavaegen

posted by BagginsKQ on - last edited - Viewed by 1.1K users

This is more of an extension to this topic here but a little more specific.

Who would like to see a new guidebook by Derek Karlavaegen as a PDF or bonus item included with the boxed set of Telltale's new King's Quest game?

If anyone doesn't know who Derek is, he is an old explorer and wanderer who landed the Green Isles, nearly twenty years before KQ6. He wrote the Guidebook to the Land of the Green Isles, the manual and pack-in copyright protection for KQ6. This is the thing I wonder if they should create for telltale's KQ to have the feel of the early KQ games that had such manuals, with stories, etc.

He was in his Mid 30s to 40s at the time of Guidebook, and somewhere in his 50 to 60s around the time of KQ6.

Karlavaegen.PNG

I have put together a very detailed biography of him on the KQ wiki (including everything there is to know about his history, personality, and interactions with other KQ characters, and others);

Derek Karlavaegen's biography

The short version (but do please read the long version) is he wrote the Guidebook to the Land of the Green Isles, and decades later, went on to record the events of King's Quest 3, in an interview with Alexander. He moved into Manannan's house, a few weeks later, where he discovered the Eye Between the Worlds.

Prince Alexander's Own Story! Exclusive Interview

Eye Between the Worlds

The eye is a mechanical computer (perhaps built by Pope Sylvester or Manannan) that allowed him to send messages one way to 20th century Earth (he called it the Other World), in hopes that someone would discover them. The Eye was discovered in the bookshelves near Manannan's desk, and can be seen in the game, KQ3.

EBTW.png

Later he recorded the events of KQ5, after visiting and interviewing King Graham. He gave Alexander a copy of the Guidebook to the Land of the Green Isles to help him learn about the kingdom before he got there (Alex lost the copy in the shipreck, but had memorized the Ancient Ones language and myths, allowing him to scale the cliffs, and make his way through the traps of the catacombs).

He was later invited to Alexander's wedding, and wrote the chronicle of KQ6 events to be placed in the archives of both kingdoms.

He is one of Alexander's closest friends (whom he respects and trusts deeply), and had been for a long time. He has spent much time hobnobing around in the royal courts of both kingdoms, and has deep respect for King Graham as well.

54 Comments - Linear Discussion: Classic Style
  • @BagginsKQ said: Also calling KQ8 "periphery", and not part of the "core" of the series...

    It's an action adventure game whose emphasis is on combat, not a point-and-click adventure game whose emphasis is on puzzles. The gameplay and focus is entirely different, so no don't consider it a core title. Though I wouldn't call it periphery so much as simply a spin-off.

    @BagginsKQ said: I think everyone is forgetting that the Guidebook to the Land of the Green Isles is actually IN KQ6. In Alhazred's trunk, actually. It is mentioned by name as being among Alhazred's possessions IN THE GAME, with a comment from the narrator saying that book would've been of aid to Alexander. I think that enough confirms Derek's existence in the KQ universe.

    Hmm. Well okay then, I'll accept that.

  • @Chyron8472 said: It's an action adventure game whose emphasis is on combat, not a point-and-click adventure game whose emphasis is on puzzles. The gameplay and focus is entirely different, so no I don't consider it a core title.


    Hmm. Well okay then, I'll accept that.

    You have to remember though that in the early KQ games you could kill. In every instance with a major bad guy in KQ1 for example, you could either kill them or dispatch them without killing them. You could either stab the dragon in the throat with your dagger, or douse it's flame with water; You could either kill the Giant hoarding the Chest and take the Chest or wait till he fell asleep and snatch it. You had to kill the Witch to survive, no options there. You had to drown the Troll to get to the Island, no options there. And in the adventure genre in general, in the early adventure games, combat was a part of it--killing--in the old text adventures.

    And KQ8 has plenty of puzzles as well. I'd say it's 50/50 puzzles and combat.

  • It's an action adventure game whose emphasis is on combat, not a point-and-click adventure game whose emphasis is on puzzles. The gameplay and focus is entirely different, so no don't consider it a core title. Though I wouldn't call it periphery so much as simply a spin-off.


    Again, your 'intepretation is off".... The emphasis was on adventure, with combat added. Much like Quest for Glory... But that's brought up over and over, in interviews, and on the KQ8 website, and the box even... Combat was an 'addition', not an 'emphasis'...

    It was never meant to be a 'spin-off', and was always stated to be KQ8. It was stated as such on the website...

    Only people who lie or are ignorant claim it was 'meant to be a spin-off'.

    Again check out the thread; Never mind I'll repost her;

    found one of the only captures of the old KQ8:MOE forums, and a capture of the main King's Quest forums on Sierra's defuct website. It's interesting to note that in the forums Sierra officially listed the game as King's Quest VIII: The Mask of Eternity.

    This forum was up for a while it it was shut down in the mid 2000s, when Sierra closed. These archive captures are from about 2004.

    King's Quest VIII: The Mask of Eternity at the Sierra Forums

    640px-KQ8Forum.pngKing's Quest Sierra Forums

    640px-Kingsquestforums.png
    Also another detail I discovered was on the official KQ8 website;

    King's Quest: Mask of Eternity website

    Once may notice that the browser tab for the page is listed as KQ8: Mask of Eternity.

    KQ8websitebrowsertab.png

    If you hover the cursor over the headers of each page, you get popup message like this;

    KQ8websitescrollover.png

    If you go into some of the information on the website as well, there are references from Mark Seibert and links to interviews where he calls the game King's Quest 8 as well.

    So Sierra was actively advertising the game as King's Quest 8 at the time.

    Also an interesting bit of trivia is that in the game files there are two folder groups in each level folder, that are named ''8Bit'' and ''8Gui''. This is a nod to the game being KQ8. The first folder holds the 16-bit bitmap artwork textures, and the second folder holds the 'graphical user interface' files.

    KQ8folders.png

    It's a bit a myth when fans lie (ya some fans are a bunch of liars and cheats) and make the false claim that "Sierra never considered this game "KQ8"". When in fact they were advertising it as KQ8 all over the place (and it even exists in the files).

    To this day Roberta Williams and Ken Williams still refer to it as King's Quest 8/VIII.

    It's interesting to note that the choice to leave off the number on boxart, is shared with other games produced between 1990 and 1998 such as The Beast Within: A Gabriel Knight Mystery (aka GK2), Quest For Glory: Shadows of Darkness (aka QFG4), The Lost Secret of the Rainforest (EcoQuest 2), Police Quest: Open Season (aka PQ4), Police Quest: SWAT (PQ5), Police Quest: SWAT 2 (PQ6), etc.

  • You have to remember though that in the early KQ games you could kill. In every instance with a major bad guy in KQ1 for example, you could either kill them or dispatch them without killing them. You could either stab the dragon in the throat with your dagger, or douse it's flame with water; You could either kill the Giant hoarding the Chest and take the Chest or wait till he fell asleep and snatch it. You had to kill the Witch to survive, no options there. You had to drown the Troll to get to the Island, no options there. And in the adventure genre in general, in the early adventure games, combat was a part of it--killing--in the old text adventures.

    Keep in mind those random encounters have nothing to do with puzzles,and they were as Roberta describes in the KQ1 manual and the hintbook she wrote, "arcade sequence". Just something to get in your way, and avoid! (the mazes in the early games were also considered 'arcade/action' sequences)

    For that matter, "kill character' was a viable action for nearly every enemy in the game. But you got a return message, such as "you're combat skills are insufficient, and blank would pulverize you before you had a chance". So its not like it tells you can't do it, just that you are incapable of fighting off the monster... Infact if you do get into a fight (represented by a cloud of smoke), you get clobbered!

    I think Roberta once said if she had a chance to remake KQ1 with 'todays' (being relative to when she said it) technology (that is if she had features to allow for some combat) it would have been similar to KQ8!

  • @BagginsKQ said: Only people who lie or are ignorant claim it was 'meant to be a spin-off'.

    You're not going to sway me there. It doesn't look or feel at all like the rest of the series.

    @BagginsKQ said: You have to remember though that in the early KQ games you could kill.

    Merely as a solution to a puzzle, yes. The "enemies" have no hitpoints. The only real combat the other titles get into is the sword fight at the end of KQ6, and you have no direct control over Alexander's actions in that case more than to begin and end the fight.

  • You're not going to sway me there. It doesn't look or feel at all like the rest of the series.

    No one is trying to 'sway you' your opinion into liking the game... How you 'feel about the game' is your choice.

    However, I can correct you on if you make false claims about the game. That doesn't necessarily mean you'll still like the game. But that's not the point. It's one thing for you to say "I think it was a poorly made game in the series, I don't like that they added in 'combat'", its another to claim "its not a core game of the series" or falsely claim that 'it's a spinoff'. You can have an honest and justifiable opinion to think it is a "weak member of the series". Just don't insert falsehoods into your opinion, beyond that.

    I for example have many reasons why I thin KQ3 and KQ7 are two of the weakest entries into the series, but I would never make the false claims that they 'spin-offs' or that they are 'not part of the series'.

    An opinion that is based on a falsehood, is still a falsehood, and never the truth. An informed and educated opinion, is neither truth nor false.

    I would agree, that it has its own unique appearance, and feel... But also find KQ8 to have a different look and feel to previous games as well. I found KQ5 and KQ6 to have a different look and feel to previous games as well.

    Each game evolved the series a little in different directions. The earliest included 'arcade sequences' (mazes, and outrunning random encounters), the middle games tended to cut them out in place of simple point and click puzzles. The earliest games rely on a typing interface, that allows many verb noun combinations and will often give messages for even certain combinations that won't work. The first three allowed you action choices such as jump, duck and/or swim (later games took that feature away for the most part).


    Middle games started adding in point and click interface, KQ5 originally had both a run and walk command.

    KQ7 got rid of most of the interface, and simplified the diaologue, cut the narrator...

    I find there being about four different styles that KQ encompasses...

  • "...you can't ignore the Guidebook..."

    Sure you can, if you try real hard! Give it a go!

  • More like "Derek Karlvagina!!"

  • I did not hijack the thread to complain about the KQ companion - I LIKE the KQ companion, but I find the character of Derek Karlavagenan or whatever (I mean, look at that last name. That's pure amateur D&D fan shit right there.) to be a poorly written attempt to connect the real world with The World of King's Quest. It's a bit of Peter Spear's whimsy, and that's all.

    Derek Karlavahoonanoo is lame. The KQ companion isn't; it's a fun read, and a way to enhance the KQ games, but is in no way - to me - any real part of KQ.

    So Alhazered has a Guidebook to the Green Isles? Does it mention Derek K at all? I don't think so. That book could be written by anyone.

    You can easily ignore the guidebook. I've played the game MULTIPLE times without it.


    Bt

    PS Hijacking the thread is arguing about KQ8... yet again. THAT is thread hijacking, just so you're clear.

  • @Chyron8472 said: You're not going to sway me there. It doesn't look or feel at all like the rest of the series.

    Merely as a solution to a puzzle, yes. The "enemies" have no hitpoints. The only real combat the other titles get into is the sword fight at the end of KQ6, and you have no direct control over Alexander's actions in that case more than to begin and end the fight.

    But is not violence still violence? Whether you kill a character as part of a puzzle, or in combat, you're still killing, and in KQ1 at least, it apparently could earn you points. I guess it comes down to whether you dislike killing itself, or the presentation of it in KQ8.

    "Killing the witch gives you points.
    Killing the troll using the goat gives you points. Trying to kill it with your dagger, he realizes the troll is bigger than him, stronger than him, and much meaner than him. He knows better than to even try it.
    Killing the giant (gain two points in original, three points in remake).
    Killing the dragon. With unerring aim, the dagger streaks through the air and pierces the soft, unprotected skin under the dragons throat. (In original, lose 2 points, in SCI remake gain three points)
    Killing the goat (no points lost)."

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