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  • [quote]Lilly didn't even bother to tell us were going missing[/quote]

    She did tell Lee. Plus you kinda both killed her father, Rock114. Your Lee and Kenny, so you don't have the right to complain about that :p

  • @dukeleto said: Hehe, it is weird how everyone reads different things from characters. Maybe this is because we are all playing same scenarios with different dialog choices.
    The Kenny I met is NOTHING closer to your description.
    I myself can not describe him with the words family-Lee-Clem or something like "buddy". For me, it is not going near of a "friendship" with my Lee and that Kenny have between them. And I don't think he sees Lee as a family member.
    I can simply prefer a confused Lilly to a shifty Kenny. :)

    P.S: Man, what kind of a man can still walk around of a person after he has killed his/her father deliberately without no hesitation? Here we talk about company, not walking around though. They could wait and take care of the situation if Larry ever tries to turn. If Larry was about to turn, I'm sure Lilly should have been more reasonable and more brave with the result. But unfortunately Kenny has no brain!
    And that brick is all he understands from the title "family" :)



    here's the thing here:
    some people just want to protect the women to POSSIBLY be "boyfriend girlfriend" sort of relationship.
    some just do because they're like: "ohhh females before males".
    some just do it for the sake of it.
    many women just do it because she seems nice
    ______________________________

    now with Kenny:
    they side with him because he seems like a good guy.
    others for no apparent reason.
    and others for the sake of it or the outcomes.
    ________________________________________

    whatever it is It's because people have different views. :P

  • Touche Yami.

    But in my game I couldn't trust Lilly after she blew someone's head off right in front of Clem based on a hunch. At least Kenny had a reason for smashing Larry, he could very well have turned and killed them all. He "might" have jumped the gun, but Lilly did without question. It's her way or the highway, and I don't like her way of killing anyone she simply doesn't like. Kenny may leave you for dead but he's never pulled out a gun and blown out your brains just because he doesn't like you.

  • @TheNNerdGamer said: here's the thing here:
    some people just want to protect the women to POSSIBLY be "boyfriend girlfriend" sort of relationship.
    some just do because they're like: "ohhh females before males".
    some just do it for the sake of it.
    many women just do it because she seems nice
    ______________________________

    now with Kenny:
    they side with him because he seems like a good guy.
    others for no apparent reason.
    and others for the sake of it or the outcomes.
    ________________________________________

    whatever it is It's because people have different views. :P




    Haha, I don't really want to offend anyone but I watched a friend of mine while he was playing his own scenario; he still stood with the girls and he is gay.
    How do you explain that? :P

    @Rock114- Man, I'm respectful to your angle but from my angle Lilly didn't killed Carley just because she doesn't like her.
    Many complicated feelings were there. She was stressed, confused and mad.(I'm sure she is a bit mental ill, too) There was a situation that she was trying to explain to all others and Carley popped out and seemed like she was the leader of the opposide idea. And when Lilly recognized Lee was listening to her, and after Carley's unfortunate insults, it became to a desperate moment for Lilly. But she was damn guilty, I admit!
    You are right with your angle at certain points. But there is something in the world entitle : Respect. Respect to other people's feelings&sufferings.
    On Walking Dead mini series-on tv, or comics, this kind of situations occured. But have you ever seen a Rick who grabs a rock and throws on Amy's brain in front of her sister Andrea?
    Probably not.

  • @dukeleto said: Haha, I don't really want to offend anyone but I watched a friend of mine while he was playing his own scenario; he still stood with the girls and he is gay.
    How do you explain that? :P



    I'm not a Psychologist but...

    he might just be was it for different out comes.
    or he's changing from being gay (very doubt it though).
    he wants to see romance.
    that's pretty much I've got really :P

  • @Rock114 said: Touche Yami.

    But in my game I couldn't trust Lilly after she blew someone's head off right in front of Clem based on a hunch. At least Kenny had a reason for smashing Larry, he could very well have turned and killed them all. He "might" have jumped the gun, but Lilly did without question. It's her way or the highway, and I don't like her way of killing anyone she simply doesn't like. Kenny may leave you for dead but he's never pulled out a gun and blown out your brains just because he doesn't like you.



    I think it is a bit more complicated than that. When Kenny killed Larry, he popped the bubble. We stopped perceiving ourselves as a functioning group and for Lilly this feeling was heightened tenfold. Why? Because she was the victim. It was her father that got killed because one (or two) man decided to play Gods and took the law into their own hands. In order to counter this tendency she became obsessed with control. It was her way of being sure you won't kill her or somebody else just because you like to.
    In my playthrough there was a lot of trust between Lilly and Lee. In her eyes, our group was Lilly and Clem. Ben was new and unreliable, Katja and Duck was with Kenny (the enemy) and Carley... well she was a sort of an enemy too, with her constantly trying to take no sides and be (the good one). Lilly knew she was already perceived as the bad one, because of all the tough choices she had to make (rationing the food, being in charge, taking responsibility).
    So when we found there was a traitor and the bandits attack, apparently she had her reasons to doubt Carley (things that happened off-screen). Lilly was convinced that Carley was the traitor. It makes perfect sense.
    Carley once again tried to play the good girl card and this time accused Lilly of being the bad one. Carley made herself the enemy in Lilly's eyes.
    There was a traitor and Carley identified herself as the one, not knowing/accepting Lee's discovery. There wasn't anybody else. Ben was always dumb and scared when he talked to Lilly (she has no reason to even consider that he would have the balls to deal with bandits). It couldn't be Kenny too. Even though she hated the guy, she knew he cares about his family and Lilly speaks Family. She knows it can't be him and she knows it can't be Lee (for being a friend, or simply having Clem in his life).
    So it had to be Carley and it still makes perfect sense. Nobody knew anything about her past, she had no ties to any of them and she was female. She was not only trying to make Lilly look bad by not taking sides or doing tough choices ever. She was also trying to charm her way into Lee's heart, which could also indicate she could've been a sly traitor.
    Of course, Lilly was wrong, but if you're not an omniscient spectator as we are, it is perfectly plausable.
    So what happens then? The man once again take law into their hands and ONCE again disregard her opinion. Now that's the moment where her female insecurity kicks in. She was already overpowered by those man once, resulting in her fathers death. She's still traumatized by that accident that occured only a week ago, but now the other pretty girl is trying to take her position as alpha female by making her look bad.
    Well, that results in a bullet in Carley's face.
    You can see that she regrets it the second she does it. She's afraid of what she's done.
    How can you not take back in the RV such a broken poor creature? :D

    Kenny didn't go throw any of this in ep. 2. Heck, even his family was not in the immediate threat of Larry turning. He could've waited a few more seconds, but he chooses his own family over other people's. He doesn't even regret the choice. In ep. 3 he even dares to talk back. All the bad things that happened in ep. 3 are consequences of Kenny's dumb actions in the meat locker and after that.

    P.S I just realized why I hate so much the sequence where if you chose to side with Kenny, Lee holds Lilly's hands behind her back while Kenny kills Larry.
    It has always reminded me of a rape scene. A breach of one's personality.
    Lee overpowers her, because he's bigger and stronger, leaving her powerless, while Kenny does something horrible.
    I think the damage Kenny dealt to Lilly was equal to rape. He could've done it and ep.3 wouldn't have been much different as to Lilly's reactions and behavior.

  • @YamiRaziel said: All the bad things that happened in ep. 3 are consequences of Kenny's dumb actions in the meat locker and after that.



    And that's the point.
    Mark his words. ;)

    I'm sure everyone will see the real Kenny in the last episode, as they pospone.

  • The reason he doesn't seem to regret killing Larry is because he though the man was already dead. If Kenny actually thought the guy could be saved there wouldn't have been blocks of salt flying. And his family WAS in immediate danger. They were held hostage by cannibals who were going to kill everyone in the meat locker, and keep the others alive to slowly cut up and trade as meat. David/Travis actually turned fairly quickly, and by the time Lee acts (or stands there because he's indecisive) She's already been performing CPR for a good long while. He could have turned by then and killed her. And Kenny. And Lee and Clem. Kenny saw it as Lilly putting her father, probably already dead, over his own family and the entire group. And if Lee helps, he sees him as doing the same.

    Then only reason I ever saw for her to doubt Carley was because Carley didn't like her. She gives Carley the death glare when she calls Kenny "Boss" in episode 1 because Lilly knows it means she can't be in charge. Lilly was always about control, and when people didn't fall in line they became the enemy. If she'd had her way, Lee and Clem would have died in front of the drug store in Episode 1. I never once heard ANYONE say "Please lead us Lilly". She put herself in charge, which she made perfectly clear in the drug store, and then wonders why people don't like her.

    Why, exactly, does not picking sides make Carley a wannabe good girl? She chose not to get involved with the Lilly/Kenny power struggle which was actually a good idea! If people begin picking sides the group splits and people get hurt/killed. I tryed to be neutral Lee and never picked sides until the meat locker forced me to because I knew that mediation was the only way to keep the group together. Carley picking a side, ANY side, would have made the situation even worse. I wish everyone else had followed her example and made both Lilly and Kenny see sense. Lilly didn't care she shot Carley, she tried to justify it after it happened. That was cold, calculated murder on her part because Carley talked back and didn't fall in line. Lilly WAS the bad guy because she insisted on playing God right after the group barely escaped the motel alive. I considered us a functioning (if barely) group right up until Lilly blew Carley's head off. Maybe if I'd saved Doug I'd have let her back on, because she didn't intend to kill him at least.

    The straw that broke the camel's back was actually Ben ya know. Lilly and Kenny's arguments caused tension in the group, and Larry's death only made matters worse, but the group was still functioning a week later. In the immediate aftermath of the bandit raid brought on by Ben's secrecy, one person left/got left behind, and three more died. I think Lilly probably would have shot someone anyway if she hadn't been messed up, because stealing from the group is undermining her authority, and that's something she just can't stand. Without Larry to enforce her laws, everything fell apart for her.

  • @Rock114 _ Man, as I said before you are talking in sense.
    All these are predictions like ours' are.

    I like Lilly cause I don't believe her behavior is because of her personality. Or I don't believe she made that one big terrible mistake for a reason different than a sudden nervous breakdown. Her reactions always seemed so desperate to me, maybe I pity her, I don't know. I think she is a common victim, not the evil itself.

    The thing is; I don't guess this game express the characters' personalities to us by our choices. For example I sided with Kenny at first when we entered the drugstore. So, Larry got his heart bad... But even in this situation Lilly didn't treat me like I'm a cruel man. She was all reasonable with the situation which was very unfortunate for her father that he was wrong because Duck was not bitten. And she treated like a grown up; so logical, so honest.
    The thing I'm trying to say is, she is not as that despotic as you mentioned. If you can be kind to her just a little, you'd see she is very cooperative.

    I know that we can't come in an agreement with protagonists that we love;
    But please answer me one last question:

    How many times did Kenny and Lilly brought the things on an edge of a knife? I don't mean messing things in terrible ways. But I'm talking just about negative moments those two brought us face to face? Look for the bad situations. Please be honest to yourself.

    All the Best, I really am tired of this Kenny&Lilly mess... But yes, Kenny is a dumbass! :)

  • The group was shattered because of what happened in the meat locker. Kenny alone is to blame for everthing bad that followed. I did all I could to help Lilly afterwards but even I could see that her father being murdered by Kenny caused severe trauma to her mental well being. What kenny did cannot be overlooked or explained away. Simply put, you cannot murder someone elses family member in front of them and expect to maintain group harmony. That's what Lilly believed Kenny did to her and as YamiRaziel detailed in his post the consequences are upon us.

    Kenny went against me in the meat locker and caused the loss of my friends by his foolish actions. What upset me the most was when he wanted to be thanked for brutalizing Lilly in that meat locker. I was more that happy to tell Kenny to go fuck himself at the end of e4.

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