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  • People are still deaf about the FACT that, it is not the issue here: killing Larry.
    The issue here is killing Larry in cold blood in front of his daughter without leaving any little God damn minute to say goodbye. Lilly would be ok if she could spread her last moments with her most beloved (and only left) family member. Maybe some last words...
    I even don't mention the possibility of saving Larry.
    Such rudeness and selfishness. This is nothing about "hard things must be done sometimes" kinda quote.
    This is all primitive and most unrespectful thing to do.
    If I were Lilly, I'd kill Kenny in that meat locker by my bare hands.

    And please don't try to tell us fairytales, Kenny did not do it for the well of the group but he mostly did it to take revenge from Larry for the argument of Duck's bitten issue. He always wanted to get rid of Lilly-Larry coalition, as he is desperately desiring of that leader role of the group (which I don't know why and with which faculty?), he got the chance and used it precisely.

    And I'm so sad by writing these but, in the end Kenny got what he deserved in his pathetic life, he died knowing that he lost his own family in front of his very own eyes by his very own mistakes.
    I'm so sorry for Katjaa and Duck, no doubt.

  • Ok, I just want to say, people who support Lily don't seem to understand that Kenny isn't a coward or an idiot and they don't seem to understand that Lily is flawed and, imo, even more so than Kenny. People who prefer Kenny seem to understand that he isn't perfect, Kenny haters can't accept the fact that he is a loyal and brave guy (even if he isn't loyal to Lee in your save.) Kenny makes logical choices (except when its understandably about his family), Lily makes choices based on her own emotions. Kenny's choice is the lesser of 2 evils when comparing him to Lily. He knows that, if Larry came back as a zombie, he would most likely kill them all and , therefore, his family would've been in danger. Also, going by how quickly people turn, I believe people start turning as soon as they die meaning that Larry couldn't have been saved anyway.

    Lily is shown not to think things through because she kills Carley/Doug because they don't agree with her; how can you defend that? Its cold hearted and stupid, she ruined the entire group by doing that. Kenny is in no way worse, he did what he did to protect everyone, Lily did it because she was angry and didn't act rationally at all. Even if you don't side with Kenny, he doesn't kill anyone for no reason and he doesn't put the whole group in danger...the only person he can 'betray' is Lee. That is also understandable, Kenny doesn't risk his life to save you 'cause he only saves people who are family or friends and, if you try to save Larry, you are going against him and putting everyone at risk so why should he risk his life to save you when he needs it to save his family?

    People keep saying Kenny was a coward when it came to trying to save Shawn...he wasn't. The apocalypse had only started a few days ago, so Kenny hadn't had a lot of experience with dealing with zombies. He was willing to risk his life to save his son but not risk his life to save a complete stranger who was in a very bad situation; not cowardly

    Also, if Larry had become a zombie, you wouldn't have been able to kill him that easily. People keep saying you could keep him down and manage to kill him...how? The only weapon you have is a salt block that slowed Kenny down and required a Larry who wasn't moving. Larry didn't need to get up straight away to deal some damage, he does have arms; both Lee and Lily were in an easy grabbing distance. Lee would've tried to keep Clem alive, Lily would be panicking and Kenny would have been the only rational one when facing a zombie Larry. He had the right idea, though gruesome, when removing Larry as a threat. Remember how much trouble Lee has with zombies when they grab him, needing help or a weapon, and remember that, if you save Duck, it requires both YOU and KENNY to get him free from a zombie who is reaching over a fence and hasn't got a very good grip on Duck. Mark also mentions that he would hate to be alone in a room with a live Larry who has human moral qualities...being in a room with a stronger, zombie Larry, determined to eat you, would've been horrible. And they are stronger as zombies, they can tear through your stomach and get to your guts quickly.

    Anyway, no matter how loyal to Lily you are...she betrays you and endangers the entire group. However, Kenny won't endanger the group even if you aren't loyal to him and if you are loyal to him (DOESN'T actually need to be 100%) he becomes the best friend you could hope for in a zombie apocalypse.

  • @dukeleto said: People are still deaf about the FACT that, it is not the issue here: killing Larry.
    The issue here is killing Larry in cold blood in front of his daughter without leaving any little God damn minute to say goodbye. Lilly would be ok if she could spread her last moments with her most beloved (and only left) family member. Maybe some last words...
    I even don't mention the possibility of saving Larry.
    Such rudeness and selfishness. This is nothing about "hard things must be done sometimes" kinda quote.
    This is all primitive and most unrespectful thing to do.
    If I were Lilly, I'd kill Kenny in that meat locker by my bare hands.

    And please don't try to tell us fairytales, Kenny did not do it for the well of the group but he mostly did it to take revenge from Larry for the argument of Duck's bitten issue. He always wanted to get rid of Lilly-Larry coalition, as he is desperately desiring of that leader role of the group (which I don't know why and with which faculty?), he got the chance and used it precisely.

    And I'm so sad by writing these but, in the end Kenny got what he deserved in his pathetic life, he died knowing that he lost his own family in front of his very own eyes by his very own mistakes.
    I'm so sorry for Katjaa and Duck, no doubt.

    Larry could have been seconds from turning and biting people, they didn't have any time to talk sense into Lilly and then let her have her goodbyes. It took Kenny a while to accept Duck's fate but he had time, Lilly didn't. Waiting for Lilly would have risked everyone's lives and its not worth it. How stupid would it be if Clem/Lilly/Kenny/Lee got bit just because you wanted Lilly to have her goodbyes.

    And the whole idea that Kenny wanted Larry dead from ep 1 is just speculation with little proof. He was all for getting Larry's heart medicine immediately after what happened with Duck and his face after using the salt lick says it all. Kenny was looking out for the entire group and his family when he stopped Larry from turning, and he definitely didn't deserve to die.

  • @YamiRaziel said: So just kill him because he's handicapped? Is that what you tell yourself to feel better about your choice? It's funny considering people are usually disgusted with Crawford...

    Larry had no pulse and wasn't breathing. That isn't handicapped, that is clinically dead.

    There was absolutely zero chance that Larry's life could have been saved, and he was a walker waiting to happen. In typical Kenny fashion it was done without tact or consideration for Lilly's grief, but he was right when he said that Larry needed to be put down. There was nothing that could be done for him *except* making sure that he didn't become a walker.

  • @dukeleto said: People are still deaf about the FACT that, it is not the issue here: killing Larry.
    The issue here is killing Larry in cold blood in front of his daughter without leaving any little God damn minute to say goodbye. Lilly would be ok if she could spread her last moments with her most beloved (and only left) family member. Maybe some last words...
    I even don't mention the possibility of saving Larry.
    Such rudeness and selfishness. This is nothing about "hard things must be done sometimes" kinda quote.
    This is all primitive and most unrespectful thing to do.
    If I were Lilly, I'd kill Kenny in that meat locker by my bare hands.

    And please don't try to tell us fairytales, Kenny did not do it for the well of the group but he mostly did it to take revenge from Larry for the argument of Duck's bitten issue. He always wanted to get rid of Lilly-Larry coalition, as he is desperately desiring of that leader role of the group (which I don't know why and with which faculty?), he got the chance and used it precisely.

    And I'm so sad by writing these but, in the end Kenny got what he deserved in his pathetic life, he died knowing that he lost his own family in front of his very own eyes by his very own mistakes.
    I'm so sorry for Katjaa and Duck, no doubt.

    Kenny did not want to kill Larry just so he could take control of the group. He didn't want to kill Larry at all. But he did it because he had to do it. I don't doubt he hated Larry for the incident in the drug store, but that's not why he killed the man! What part of Zombie Apocalypse is so hard to understand? The man was clinicly dead. There was no medicine, the group had no weapons, and they were trapped. Lilly had plenty of time to say goodbye to Larry. I can understand why she didn't give up on him, if it were my father, I probably wouldn't have either, but the fact remains that Larry had been on the ground with no pulse, not breathing, for nearly a minute by the time Lee takes action. How many people is it acceptable to lose just for Lilly to be able to say goodbye? What if she gets bitten? What if Lee does? Even Clem was in danger. Is Clem's life worth Lilly saying goodbye? Because I sure as hell don't think so.

    Kenny did handle the situation pretty poorly after the fact, like in the beginning of Episode 3. He really should have acted better toward Lilly and he went about the situation like an ass in my opinion, but he saved everyone in the meat locker. Precious seconds had already been spent trying to revive Larry with zero response. If Larry had come back, the entire group would have been wiped out just so Lilly could say goodbye. My Lee didn't let that happen. He didn;t let Irene turn when she was bitten, he kept reminding Kenny of the fact that Duck was turning and made him see what was actually happenening, and he didn't let himself turn to perhaps harm someone else in the future. He certainly wasn't going to let Larry kill everyone either.

  • @Rock114 said: Kenny did not want to kill Larry just so he could take control of the group. He didn't want to kill Larry at all. But he did it because he had to do it. I don't doubt he hated Larry for the incident in the drug store, but that's not why he killed the man! What part of Zombie Apocalypse is so hard to understand? The man was clinicly dead. There was no medicine, the group had no weapons, and they were trapped. Lilly had plenty of time to say goodbye to Larry. I can understand why she didn't give up on him, if it were my father, I probably wouldn't have either, but the fact remains that Larry had been on the ground with no pulse, not breathing, for nearly a minute by the time Lee takes action. How many people is it acceptable to lose just for Lilly to be able to say goodbye? What if she gets bitten? What if Lee does? Even Clem was in danger. Is Clem's life worth Lilly saying goodbye? Because I sure as hell don't think so.

    Kenny did handle the situation pretty poorly after the fact, like in the beginning of Episode 3. He really should have acted better toward Lilly and he went about the situation like an ass in my opinion, but he saved everyone in the meat locker. Precious seconds had already been spent trying to revive Larry with zero response. If Larry had come back, the entire group would have been wiped out just so Lilly could say goodbye. My Lee didn't let that happen. He didn;t let Irene turn when she was bitten, he kept reminding Kenny of the fact that Duck was turning and made him see what was actually happenening, and he didn't let himself turn to perhaps harm someone else in the future. He certainly wasn't going to let Larry kill everyone either.

    I strongly recommend you to watch TV series - if you haven't seen them yet, so you can see how people (especially the group leaders) react to those who are about to lose their family members.

    Yes, this is a Zombie Apocalypse which means that it is for everyone, every single person is experiencing the same nightmare and NO ONE is different than the other when you check hard situations, griefs, family issues, etc...

    For further information, please watch Andrea&Amy scene and look for Rick's reaction.
    For more further information, please watch Tyreese&Ben's mother scene- look for Carl's reaction.
    A true leader respects people's feelings.
    Different from these examples, in the game our group was trapped in that meat locker I know, but I think even if a little boy like Carl could treat reasonable with family issues, a man with a family should have known better.
    If it WAS the purpose- blocking Larry from harming anyone in that meat locker- I'd put some salt licks on Larry's different body parts to limit his possible zombie movements than instantly busting Larry's head. Because I HAVE A BRAIN which I can use whenever I need.
    But if it was the purpose to kill him, well it depends...

    On the other hand LEEME was there and I really pissed of when Kenny involved the situation which I was already taking care of.

    Never mind, really you or I will not give up from our own angles on Kenny. So, lets end this discussion. Because you'll SURELY continue to defend a man(by saying he did everything for his family) who were [B]DOING NOTHING[/B] to search for an escape while LEEYOU were looking for an exit from that meat locker.
    Pretty please try to remember his words while you were trying to examine the air went and please remember his answer when you asked him if he had any tools on himself suitable to use on those screws.
    Last time I checked he was not looking like a mainstay of a family who was dying by scratching the walls to save his family.

    God forgive Kenny. I hope he has died in that alley (or in dark room) for the well of the universe.

  • Well, Let's be real here, both Larry and Kenny were pretty flawed characters (As well as Lily), and in a lot of ways all were pretty ruthless and self-serving.

    Larry is perfectly happy to let both Duck and Lee die when you first meet him. Much like Kenny would later, Larry did not handle the stressful situation well and made a selfish decision to want to throw a child out to die on the off chance he was bit, then punched Lee, hoping that he would die to zombies, becasue he was selfish and thought to protect himself and his daughter from a perceived threat.

    Kenny was the same as Larry, except he was nicer and more cowardly about it. Odds are that Shawn wouldn't have survived even with Kenny's help, but it would have been a lot more possible. However he freaked out and ran. Now in the meat locker he is presented with the same situation, A potential walker and making sure his family is safe. He made the same choice Larry would have if it had been Kenny laying there. Does this make it right?

    Well, You have to consider the situation. There was really no time. They were in a meat locker being held hostage by cannibals, whom as it is mentioned soon after, were just about to come back there and murder some of them. Not to mention they might have been making a duck stew =/ Pardon the joke. If they had left Lily have any more time, even if he hadn't reanimated by then, The dairy boys would have killed them. Consider the amount of time that scene takes place in, minus the "game time" it was really only a matter of minutes between the two aforementioned events.

    However, Kenny is still a hypocrite and a generally poor person. Let's fast forward to the Duck getting bit, now even though it's a bit absurd. Kenny can actually cause game over becasue of his stubbornness. He puts everyone in danger and possibly kills them all by pushing Lee out after they argue, allowing Duck to reanimate and murder everyone. This is becasue, like Larry, he is a self-serving man who will not even think about the hypocritical nature of his actions. Let's be honest, he is the cause of Katjaa's suicide. He wasn't there for her when she needed him and if he had the strength to handle the situation, she would have been able to find comfort in him. but he was a weak man who didn't want to face reality, and in turn, she couldn't either.

    Speed forward to the attic, Lee is bit, Kenny considers dealing with him. It's pretty crazy that he would entertain the notion after everything that has happened. Even if he doesn't do it.

    Then his final sacrifice. Does his giving his life up make up for his actions? It's hard to say, in the end he was just a human. Is anyone in a position to judge him when they are playing a character who murdered a senator? The game teaches us, if anything, that people are capable of making life ending mistakes. Ben, Lee, Lily, Larry, Kenny, I mean come on, The story is full of characters who make selfish decisions for the good of themselves or the people they care about.

  • @dukeleto said: I strongly recommend you to watch TV series - if you haven't seen them yet, so you can see how people (especially the group leaders) react to those who are about to lose their family members.

    Yes, this is a Zombie Apocalypse which means that it is for everyone, every single person is experiencing the same nightmare and NO ONE is different than the other when you check hard situations, griefs, family issues, etc...

    For further information, please watch Andrea&Amy scene and look for Rick's reaction.
    For more further information, please watch Tyreese&Ben's mother scene- look for Carl's reaction.
    A true leader respects people's feelings.
    Different from these examples, in the game our group were trapped in that meat locker I know, but I think even if a little boy like Carl could treat reasonable with family issues, a man with a family should have known better.
    If it WAS the purpose- blocking Larry from harming anyone in that meat locker- I'd put some salt licks on Larry's different body parts to limit his possible zombie movements than instantly busting Larry's head. Because I HAVE A BRAIN which I can use whenever I need.
    But if it was the purpose to kill him, well it depends...

    On the other hand LEEME was there and I really pissed of when Kenny involved the situation which I was already taking care of.

    Never mind, really you or I will not give up from our own angles on Kenny. So, lets end this discussion. Because you'll SURELY continue to defend a man(by saying he did everything for his family) who were [B]DOING NOTHING[/B] to search for an escape while LEEYOU were looking for an exit from that meat locker.
    Pretty please try to remember his words while you were trying to examine the air went and please remember his answer when you asked him if he had any tools on himself suitable to use on those screws.
    Last time I checked he was not looking like a mainstay of a family who was dying by scratching the walls to save his family.

    God forgive Kenny. I hope he has died in that alley (or in dark room) for the well of the universe.

    Read Dukeleto's post again. He's absolutely right. A true leader knows how to react to such situations. If you're incapable, well, you let somebody else handle it.
    As Dukeleto mentioned, there were plenty of ways to block reanimated Larry from harming people, if he did return as a walker. Lilly was standing closest to him but I'm sure she would rather get bitten than see her father being killed in such a brutal way.
    You have to understand that Kenny wasn't protecting anyone in that meatlocker scene. If that were truly his intentions, then in ep.3 when his son got bitten, he would've have stopped the RV and dealt with it right away. He knew his son was bitten, he knew there wasn't any chance Duck would survive and he knew he was putting everyone in that RV in danger by letting Duck stay. Regardless, he let him stay because those same rules and survival instincts do not apply when his family is concerned. That's why I hate his personality and I can never forgive him for what he did.
    Nobody knew when exactly was Duck gonna turn. It could've happened while everybody was asleep. The least that could have happened was Katjaa getting bitten. She wouldn't let go of her son, no matter whether he turned while in her arms or not.

  • @YamiRaziel said: Read Dukeleto's post again. He's absolutely right. A true leader knows how to react to such situations. If you're incapable, well, you let somebody else handle it.
    As Dukeleto mentioned, there were plenty of ways to block reanimated Larry from harming people, if he did return as a walker. Lilly was standing closest to him but I'm sure she would rather get bitten than see her father being killed in such a brutal way.


    There was no way to restrain Zombie Larry. Salt licks wouldn't have worked anymore than putting bricks on a person's arms or legs would pin them down. Any slight movement is going to send them topling over to the side, and the weight of a couple salt licks wasn't going to keep his arms and legs pinned.

  • @YamiRaziel said: Read Dukeleto's post again. He's absolutely right. A true leader knows how to react to such situations. If you're incapable, well, you let somebody else handle it.
    As Dukeleto mentioned, there were plenty of ways to block reanimated Larry from harming people, if he did return as a walker. Lilly was standing closest to him but I'm sure she would rather get bitten than see her father being killed in such a brutal way.
    You have to understand that Kenny wasn't protecting anyone in that meatlocker scene. If that were truly his intentions, then in ep.3 when his son got bitten, he would've have stopped the RV and dealt with it right away. He knew his son was bitten, he knew there wasn't any chance Duck would survive and he knew he was putting everyone in that RV in danger by letting Duck stay. Regardless, he let him stay because those same rules and survival instincts do not apply when his family is concerned. That's why I hate his personality and I can never forgive him for what he did.
    Nobody knew when exactly was Duck gonna turn. It could've happened while everybody was asleep. The least that could have happened was Katjaa getting bitten. She wouldn't let go of her son, no matter whether he turned while in her arms or not.

    Oh yeh...sorry son time to die. He isn't selfish just 'cause he wants to save his family and not face the truth. Also, he is trying to protect others when he stops Larry from turning, yes...his family IS the priority but he wants to keep as many people alive as possible; he couldn't risk a zombie Larry.

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