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Plot pieces that bugged me

posted by Kangarou on - last edited - Viewed by 325 users

1.) Ben made a good call. This one's a tough one, but hear me out.

The bandits overtook the motel in minutes, guns-to-faces of almost everyone there, the moment they didn't get their supply. It's pretty obvious they had the upper hand/power, Doug's bells or not.

Once Ben started giving them supplies, not only did they not take over the motel, they stayed away entirely, not even attacking.

It seems to me like the bandits were gonna run through the motel any day, and that Ben actually did a good thing supplying them. I got so mad that every speech option towards Ben was negative or hateful.

2.) The Auto Shop escape given the razor wire fence. I can't have been the only one to notice.

The first time Lee and Molly grab the battery, they escape via garage to truck roof to garage roof to adjacent building, twice requiring Hilda/Molly's help. The outer fence is now down, walkers about, and garage raided

The second time Lee goes alone to get the tape, he just picks up the tape, and "magically" teleports back to the school. Walkers were still around and his previous escape avenue was no longer available. The way he came involved having a step over a razor wire fence, with no step on the other side.

He got out of there the second time by...?

3.) I'm assuming Christa's pregnant.

It seems kinda weird how she just downs the Whiskey during the attic segment. As someone so mother-tastic, she was able to instantly tell Lee/Clem weren't related, it's just an odd sight, is all.

4.) About that other fence. The St. John one,

Why does everyone let it slide that the fence turned back on? Lee makes one comment, and then acts like it never happened. The St. Johns didn't know the bandits were attacking, supposedly, and Mark/Lee were doing their part, as expected.

5.) So what if you're from Crawford? It doesn't matter.

Two times Lee's asked whether he's from Crawford or not, both times by people who were from Crawford themselves, and both times with the questioning party assuming Crawford = bad. I never got this.

Let's say a person isn't from Crawford. Fine, that means that they're just a survivor looking to survive. As far as strangers go, the morality one could derive from a non-Crawford person is neutral, at best (and at worst).

Let's say a person IS from Crawford. from the rules of Crawford, that would mean they either escaped or they were exiled. Either way, that person wouldn't be allowed to return to Crawford, as per Crawford rules.

This implies that a person from Crawford is outside is there on their own terms, not working alongside Crawford. In fact, being from Crawford, yet outside it would imply that one either disagrees with Crawford's laws (and exhibits good morality), or isn't eligible (and we're back to being just a random survivor, yet expectedly weaker). Both of these situations are better than a neutral stranger.

Why does being a Crawford outsider make someone a bad person, especially to people who themselves are Crawford outsiders?




There are probably other parts of the plot I'm forgetting, but what other parts bugged you? Or can somebody explain any of these?

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  • @Kangarou said: 1.) Ben made a good call. This one's a tough one, but hear me out.

    The bandits overtook the motel in minutes, guns-to-faces of almost everyone there, the moment they didn't get their supply. It's pretty obvious they had the upper hand/power, Doug's bells or not.

    Once Ben started giving them supplies, not only did they not take over the motel, they stayed away entirely, not even attacking.

    It seems to me like the bandits were gonna run through the motel any day, and that Ben actually did a good thing supplying them. I got so mad that every speech option towards Ben was negative or hateful.



    Hm, I believe the group was lulled into a false sense of security, even going so far as to put Ben on watch duty. They did say they hadn't attacked in weeks. Normally, according to Lee, Carley would do the bulk of the lookout duty (if you saved Carley). Having someone like Carley on watch duty would have been really beneficial, in my opinion. It's also likely that the bandits were put in a fit of rage because they didn't get their opium, which is used to create heroin.

    Ben should have told the group about his dealings though, if they knew Lee wouldn't have taken the bag resulting in the assault. He should have at least told the group after the fact when Lilly was accusing everyone. I know Lilly is one scary chick, but he really he acquitted much too late.

    At the end of the day though, it was Lilly's fault though. They really should have just left the Travelier Motel earlier.


    2.) The Auto Shop escape given the razor wire fence. I can't have been the only one to notice.

    The first time Lee and Molly grab the battery, they escape via garage to truck roof to garage roof to adjacent building, twice requiring Hilda/Molly's help. The outer fence is now down, walkers about, and garage raided

    The second time Lee goes alone to get the tape, he just picks up the tape, and "magically" teleports back to the school. Walkers were still around and his previous escape avenue was no longer available. The way he came involved having a step over a razor wire fence, with no step on the other side.

    He got out of there the second time by...?
    I noticed this too, actually. Perhaps he found a way to cut the barbwire?

    3.) I'm assuming Christa's pregnant.

    It seems kinda weird how she just downs the Whiskey during the attic segment. As someone so mother-tastic, she was able to instantly tell Lee/Clem weren't related, it's just an odd sight, is all.
    It seemed like Christa wanted to make sure no one knew she was pregnant for when she refused the drink Kenny gave her a suspicious look. It's rather odd that she didn't trust the group enough to flat out tell them, perhaps she was afraid that them knowing would only slow down the group?

    4.) About that other fence. The St. John one,

    Why does everyone let it slide that the fence turned back on? Lee makes one comment, and then acts like it never happened. The St. Johns didn't know the bandits were attacking, supposedly, and Mark/Lee were doing their part, as expected.
    You can question Andy St. John, he says something along the lines of:

    "I heard Mark yell, I thought he was giving me the heads up that you were both done."

    5.) So what if you're from Crawford? It doesn't matter.

    Two times Lee's asked whether he's from Crawford or not, both times by people who were from Crawford themselves, and both times with the questioning party assuming Crawford = bad. I never got this.

    Let's say a person isn't from Crawford. Fine, that means that they're just a survivor looking to survive. As far as strangers go, the morality one could derive from a non-Crawford person is neutral, at best (and at worst).

    Let's say a person IS from Crawford. from the rules of Crawford, that would mean they either escaped or they were exiled. Either way, that person wouldn't be allowed to return to Crawford, as per Crawford rules.

    This implies that a person from Crawford is outside is there on their own terms, not working alongside Crawford. In fact, being from Crawford, yet outside it would imply that one either disagrees with Crawford's laws (and exhibits good morality), or isn't eligible (and we're back to being just a random survivor, yet expectedly weaker). Both of these situations are better than a neutral stranger.

    Why does being a Crawford outsider make someone a bad person, especially to people who themselves are Crawford outsiders?
    Eh, just because someone is outside of Crawford doesn't necessarily mean that they were exiles. I'm assuming Crawford has scouts of sorts that go outside the city. How else would they get supplies?

    There are probably other parts of the plot I'm forgetting, but what other parts bugged you? Or can somebody explain any of these?
    One thing that really bugged me is how they used a pillow as a silencer back in episode one, which was so effective that no walkers heard the gunshot.

  • @CarScar said:


    You can question Andy St. John, he says something along the lines of:

    "I heard Mark yell, I thought he was giving me the heads up that you were both done."




    But Mark yelled AFTER the fence was turned on
    He got hit by an arrow when they went outside and put the fance back up

  • I completely disagree with you with number one but regarding number 2, the first time they HAD TO take the roof entrance because there were zombies outside. The second time he could have easily just climbed over the fence the way he came. Even if it was barbed wire...not a plot hole IMO

  • @Argadem said: But Mark yelled AFTER the fence was turned on
    He got hit by an arrow when they went outside and put the fance back up



    I thought that was the point. He turned it on purposefully to knock one or both of them out so they could chop 'em up, but when it failed, he quickly used Mark's yell as defense. Maybe you could say the rest of the group were too caught up in the bandits/Mark with an arrow in his shoulder to remember that Mark yelled afterwards.

  • I thought he turned the fence back on to fry Lee and Mark for dinner.

  • @Kangarou said: 1.) Ben made a good call. This one's a tough one, but hear me out.

    The bandits overtook the motel in minutes, guns-to-faces of almost everyone there, the moment they didn't get their supply. It's pretty obvious they had the upper hand/power, Doug's bells or not.

    Once Ben started giving them supplies, not only did they not take over the motel, they stayed away entirely, not even attacking.

    It seems to me like the bandits were gonna run through the motel any day, and that Ben actually did a good thing supplying them. I got so mad that every speech option towards Ben was negative or hateful.


    There are probably other parts of the plot I'm forgetting, but what other parts bugged you? Or can somebody explain any of these?




    I agree with you on Ben making the deal with the bandits. They could've easily attacked them, but they didn't. It was really stupid of Ben to not tell the group about it though, and because of that, they lost their trust for him. I love Ben, but the dialogue choices seem like they want us to hate him. =.=

    Also, the doggy door on the mansion. When they got attacked, the walker grabbed Lee's foot through the doggy door. Thought it was only accessible with the collar? Damn plot holes *facepalm*

  • What Ben did with the bandit deal, the deal itself, was smart. If he had come forward to the group about it, I would have defended his choice and agreed with him. The bandits stopped attacking, and the group was out of (immediate) danger. What people, including me, hate most about it is the incredibly stupid way he went about his choice. By keeping it from the group, Lilly became extremely paranoid, people were planning on using supplies they didn't actually have, and the bandits could get the upper hand on the group by pretending to come in for supplies but storm the motel. The reason they got into the motel wasn't because they were just outright badasses, kicking asses and taking names from one side of the apocalypse to the other. It was because Ben assumed they wouldn't attack.

    With his deal going, and the supplies being placed where they were, the bandits probably had an easy time sneaking up on the motel. Ben assumed that they were going to get their package, which they were, until they realized it was gone. What if they got their supplies but decided to raid the motel anyway? There weren't infinite supplies in Macon, and once the group ran out of supplies to give the bandits, they likely would have strolled up to the motel like normal, stormed it, and taken everything the group had. Perhaps even followed by executing the group. The group had guns, and without supplies they would be both useless AND have nothing to lose by attacking the bandits for their stuff back. Ben telling everybody what he was doing could have saved the group a lot of grief.

    Or perhaps I'm just thinking about this too hard.

  • #1) It's only a good call if you assume there's always going to be supplies and that the bandits wouldn't eventually attack anyway. Lilly is correct (to a point, atleast) when she says that the theft of those supplies could end up with someone dead, e.g. if Clementine should get sick. Once things like antibiotics are gone, they're gone - nobody's restocking the store shelves. This is excluding that we saw what Lee and Kenny had to go through during their supply run to Macon, they easily could've been killed on their runs into town - and giving up supplies means more time risking their asses outside of camp looking to replace them.

    We saw that the hotel had been attacked prior (the wall was riddled with the proof of such), I'm inclined to agree that if someone more competent than Ben had been on watch, they probably wouldn't have succeeded. Hell, once the bullets did start flying the bandits failed to actually kill anybody from the group - the Walkers did that.

    It's also important to remember that Ben started trading with them because he believed they had his friend. Which is just beyond stupid as I've covered in the past. Even if they did have his friend (and people known for little things like rape and murder would never lie, right?) they have no reason to give him up well, ever - giving them supplies just turns that friend into a golden goose.

    #4) That bugged me too; especially since Andy's excuse didn't hold up. Mark didn't yell until the attack, which occurred after the fence was turned on.

    #5) Crawford did send people outside the walls; we see as much from their markings around town. It's also not like the wall of mutilated zombies built itself.

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