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Ben

posted by Platinumb on - last edited - Viewed by 596 users

Why the constant hatred?

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  • @Platinumb said: Why the constant hatred?

    Because he got 4 different characters killed.

  • I think the major reasons people don't like him is because he led the bandits to invading the Motor Inn, and he ended up leaving Clementine in the street in episode 4.

  • @Toasty said: he ended up leaving Clementine in the street in episode 4.

    How is this different from Kenny not going to help Shawn?

    except, Kenny is a grown man and Ben is a teen boy.

  • @Platinumb said: How is this different from Kenny not going to help Shawn?

    except, Kenny is a grown man and Ben is a teen boy.

    Kenny didn't cause Shawn's death, he just failed to prevent it. And he's a major asset. Saved Lee's life and is the leader of the group.

    Ben's actions can result in the death of up to 5 people. (Duck, Katjaa, Carley/Duck, Chuck, maybe Kenny.) And he does nothing to help the group.

  • @k1ngMe said: Ben destroyed the group.

    Pretty much

  • @Nuked said: Kenny didn't cause Shawn's death, he just failed to prevent it. And he's a major asset. Saved Lee's life and is the leader of the group.

    Ben's actions can result in the death of up to 5 people. (Duck, Katjaa, Carley/Duck, Chuck, maybe Kenny.) And he does nothing to help the group.


    Kenny isn't the "leader of the group." Depending on how you play, Lilly can be, or Lee can claim they're "Democratic." In fact, Kenny seems to argue that the group should be more democratic whereas Lilly wants to run an empire.


    Ben didn't kill anyone. The bandits did. And Ben's actions did get them to stop attacking, so he might have helped bring about a couple weeks of peace. I think Lee should have gone to help Clem, Katja, and Duck prior to Ben and Doug/Carley. That would have prevented Duck from being bitten.

    Katja chooses to kill herself.

    Doug and Carley choose to protect Ben - because he's A TEEN BOY.

    Chuck put himself in harm's way. Ben couldn't have protected Clem, or he might have but then would have wound up getting killed. (He would have run out of bullets. Chuck had a shovel.) At any rate, if anything maybe Ben should have grabbed Clem's hand and tried to run.

    Kenny chooses to give up his life to be with Ben. Ben doesn't cause that.

    It's not that I dislike Kenny. He's one of my favorite characters. But he does choose to be a coward when it comes to helping out anybody but his family and those who go above and beyond to help his family.

    As for Ben - he does contribute to the group. He's often lookout (at the motel, at the train), he gets Lee's gun for him, and especially in Episode 5 he's the last one up the attic stairs and the last one jumping off the balcony. At the end of the day, he is just a teen boy, and expectations of him cannot be the same as that of a grown man.

  • @Platinumb said: Ben didn't kill anyone. The bandits did. And Ben's actions did get them to stop attacking, so he might have helped bring about a couple weeks of peace. I think Lee should have gone to help Clem, Katja, and Duck prior to Ben and Doug/Carley. That would have prevented Duck from being bitten.

    Ben's deal set off the chain of events that got many people killed. He must bear some of the responsibility. In fact, Ben himself feels guilty about getting all the people killed because of the deal for the rest of the game. A guilty conscience needs no accuser, or so the saying goes. He knows what he did was wrong.

    He should've have told the group that he made the deal, so they would have planned accordingly. This is the part I really hate about him. If he was that scared of Lilly, he could have at least told Lee and Kenny because those two saved his life. Lee's investigation proceeded the way it did because Lee and Lilly didn't know about the deal. When the attack came, the group was caught off guard.

    Rommel49 made a really great post elsewhere on this forum too. He explained that by making that deal, Ben placed the entire group at constant risk because Lee, etc. would have to risk their lives more often to do supply runs in Macon. Plus, what if someone got sick and needed medicine that was given to the bandits?

    And really? Lee's not at fault for Duck being bitten. Lee, Carley, and Lilly were the only ones who were able to lay down covering fire against the bandits and walkers. They were in no position to run around and grab people to safety.

    Either way, Ben should have told the group about the deal so they could've planned ahead.

    @Platinumb said:
    Chuck put himself in harm's way. Ben couldn't have protected Clem, or he might have but then would have wound up getting killed. (He would have run out of bullets. Chuck had a shovel.) At any rate, if anything maybe Ben should have grabbed Clem's hand and tried to run.

    We don't have to expect Ben to go walker slaying at that moment. But like you said, the least he could've done is grabbed Clem and run. That way Chuck would not had to sacrifice himself.

    @Platinumb said:
    As for Ben - he does contribute to the group. He's often lookout (at the motel, at the train), he gets Lee's gun for him, and especially in Episode 5 he's the last one up the attic stairs and the last one jumping off the balcony. At the end of the day, he is just a teen boy, and expectations of him cannot be the same as that of a grown man.

    And he's the crappiest lookout in the world. He was sitting on top an RV, and yet the bandits managed to sneak in despite the fact there was a road's width of open space which makes sneaking up very difficult. Remember how Lilly saw movement in the woods before Lee even reached the road in episode 2? Remember how Carley managed to see the St. John's at GROUND level in episode 2? Ben can't even see a large group of bandits from an elevated level. That's pretty useless right there.

    And the whole "he's just a teen" thing isn't something I really buy. This is an ZA, and Ben needs to know how to handle things for the same reason Chuck emphasized to Lee why Clem needed to toughen up. If we look at our own world, there's plenty of "teens" in Third World countries where doing the work of "grown men" is expected because life is tough.

  • @double_u said:

    And really? Lee's not at fault for Duck being bitten. Lee, Carley, and Lilly were the only ones who were able to lay down covering fire against the bandits and walkers. They were in no position to run around and grab people to safety.

    I didn't say Lee was at fault. I said Lee should have helped out Katjaa with the two kids prior to helping Ben and Doug/Carly.

  • @double_u said:

    And he's the crappiest lookout in the world. He was sitting on top an RV, and yet the bandits managed to sneak in despite the fact there was a road's width of open space which makes sneaking up very difficult. Remember how Lilly saw movement in the woods before Lee even reached the road in episode 2? Remember how Carley managed to see the St. John's at GROUND level in episode 2? Ben can't even see a large group of bandits from an elevated level. That's pretty useless right there.

    He was expecting to see bandits, to pick up the supplies. Just saying.

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