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If Lily returns...

posted by That1Guy on - last edited - Viewed by 386 users

Would you forgive her for shooting Carley/Doug if she helped the PC?

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  • @Mornai said: As a (poorly remembered) quote from one of my favorite games says..."There are two things i hate the most in this world: poison and betrayal." The first part isn't applicable here, but the second certainly is.

    Trust becomes one of the most important things in a zombie apocalypse scenario, and if you betray that trust, you're not staying with me or my group(if I'm the leader). Vernon didn't tell us about the thousands of walkers approaching the city in the church tower, and then stole our boat. It doesn't matter if the boat plan was crap to begin with, what matters is that i can't rely on Vernon for anything, because i know he's not above leaving us to die for his own sake(he obviously thought the boat would work, since he took it).

    Vernon of all people knew exactly how dangerous Savannah is, and his group took with them what little food was left. Adding that he knew our method of entrance(and safest exit) was overrun with walkers(the train) and didn't even bother to warn us, he willingly left us all to rot, and is only sorry about Clementine. Those types of people have no place in my group.



    ... It's not that I don't agree with you, and I do not like those who are only for themselves, but Vernon thought of telling you. He either did it so you could leave and he could steal the boat or so you wouldn't freak out. To me, he wasn't part of the group, and he had his own to worry about. He helps save many people; it's only right he tries to save his own. I agree that was selfish and a dikish move, but hasn't Lee's group done basically the same? You steal those supplies from the car which ends up in a family's utter destruction. We didn't know. So... we are no better, yes? We put our group before others, against our better judgement. Yeah, many of us didn't agree to it, but we thought about it. And I bet quite a few of us just didn't want the blame on theirselves.

    In my opinion, he was just looking out for HIS group, and for that, to get his group to safety, he decided to take the boat. I won't outright trust him if he returns, but I don't sespise the guy. So... yeah. Normally I'd agree I wouldn't want people like that in my group, and if he WAS in my group, I'd prob want him dead like Lilly, but he wasn't. So I don't hold it that much against him. That's my standing anyway. I think many of you just have anger directed at other things and are taking it out on him xD

  • You can't compare the station wagon to Vernon's taking the boat. You see, everyone thought the car as abandoned. The group was starving. It was either take that food, or die from slow starvation. If everyone had known that the car was actually NOT abandoned, far less people would have taken the supplies. Hell, even Kenny might have backed off if the family had shown up and said "Hey, that stuff's ours." It's more the Stranger's fault than our own, for leaving his car, full of supplies, with the lights on, in the middle of the woods where the bandits make their base and cannibals come to trap food. It sucks, what happened to him and his family, but he should have expected something like that could happen in the apocalypse.

    On the other hand, Vernon KNEW that the boat was ours. Sure he helped us get into Crawford, but he had his own reasons for doing it. He wanted the medicine for his people, and the only reason the two groups teamed up was because they both needed supplies from the same place. After he helped us get our stuff for the boat, and after we helped him get his meds, he flat out refuses to tell us about the thousands of flesh eating undead monsters that are descending on the town. After that, when Lee goes to look for Clem, he comes back, armed, and steals the boat that he KNEW we were going to use. And anyone left behind gets locked in the shed. If Lee hadn't come back to the mansion, then whoever got locked in the shed would have starved. That's up to four people Vernon could possibly have sentenced to die. He knowingly left our group, which included a 9-year-old he pretended to want to protect, behind to die.

  • Vernon knew very well that the boat had a capacity problem, so I'm guessing that he assumed that Lee would put his group first as priority on the boat and would leave Vernon and his group on ice. I hate him for taking the boat, but on the other hand he was looking out for his own group just like Lee was looking after his. In a way it's karma Lee took willingly or not the supplies from the wagon only to get kicked in the a$$ by losing the one chance of survival with the boat.

  • @That1Guy said: Would you forgive her for shooting Carley/Doug if she helped the PC?



    I would be happy if Lilly returned. If you think about it, Clem and Lilly are the characters that need to appear in season 2 since, by what they say and do, we are reminded of the decision we made in Season 1.

    In my game, Clem might say something like "Lee always liked you Lilly and was sorry for what Kenny did to your dad" in another game she might say "They're all dead Lilly. All because of you. I hope you're happy".

    See, it can be win-win regardless if you are team Lilly or team Kenny.

  • If we want someone else to be with Clem to tell us all of Lee's choices, then wouldn't Kenny be a bit more logical than Lilly? She was with us until Episode 3, while Kenny was with us for nearly the whole way. And since we never saw a body, there is every chance that Telltale can bring Kenny back for an appearance in Season 2!

    ^ (Still in denial)

  • @Rock114 said: You can't compare the station wagon to Vernon's taking the boat. You see, everyone thought the car as abandoned. The group was starving. It was either take that food, or die from slow starvation. If everyone had known that the car was actually NOT abandoned, far less people would have taken the supplies. Hell, even Kenny might have backed off if the family had shown up and said "Hey, that stuff's ours." It's more the Stranger's fault than our own, for leaving his car, full of supplies, with the lights on, in the middle of the woods where the bandits make their base and cannibals come to trap food. It sucks, what happened to him and his family, but he should have expected something like that could happen in the apocalypse.

    On the other hand, Vernon KNEW that the boat was ours. Sure he helped us get into Crawford, but he had his own reasons for doing it. He wanted the medicine for his people, and the only reason the two groups teamed up was because they both needed supplies from the same place. After he helped us get our stuff for the boat, and after we helped him get his meds, he flat out refuses to tell us about the thousands of flesh eating undead monsters that are descending on the town. After that, when Lee goes to look for Clem, he comes back, armed, and steals the boat that he KNEW we were going to use. And anyone left behind gets locked in the shed. If Lee hadn't come back to the mansion, then whoever got locked in the shed would have starved. That's up to four people Vernon could possibly have sentenced to die. He knowingly left our group, which included a 9-year-old he pretended to want to protect, behind to die.



    Let me ask this: We knew SOMEONE left it behind recently, for the lights were on, supplies were left, and the open-door warning sounds were going off. Pretty obvious signs someone was out there. The fact is the group took the supplies because there was noone there to say exactly as you said, "Hey, that's our stuff!" Any excuse that could be made to assume it'd be right to take those supplies, you better bet they would have been taken. Kenny, Katjaa, and Ben would have definitely, and truly if Mark and Larry were alive they'd have been on the same position. Vernon, if you take everyone with you, leaves a note to apologize. At least he had the decency for that.

    Anyway, I'm sure if he knew that taking the boat would have killed anyone he wouldn't have done it either, and guess what? It didn't kill anyone. By the time the group would have gotten back to the Mansion, they would have had no time to get the boat to open water. And what about Clem, who was all alone? In my mind, Vernon unknowingly saved the group from a dumb plan that would have killed them anyway and gave Lee an excuse to go after Clem. Otherwise, everyone probably would have left without him. Yeah, you could say it causes(maybe) Ben's death and Kenny's(if dead). However, you could also say it saves Clementine and Christa and Omid. So... it depends on how you look at it.

  • @Rock114 said: If we want someone else to be with Clem to tell us all of Lee's choices, then wouldn't Kenny be a bit more logical than Lilly? She was with us until Episode 3, while Kenny was with us for nearly the whole way. And since we never saw a body, there is every chance that Telltale can bring Kenny back for an appearance in Season 2!

    ^ (Still in denial)



    Yeah....but Kenny is dead. Unless you're thinking Clem is talking to walker Kenny who has no arms and no lower jaw....kinda creepy. But I guess tha would work...sort of...

  • @Kiel555 said: Yeah....but Kenny is dead. Unless you're thinking Clem is talking to walker Kenny who has no arms and no lower jaw....kinda creepy. But I guess tha would work...sort of...



    Why wouldn't he have...? ... Never mind... I don't want to know. Idk, I just want him to be alive.

  • @Mark$man said: ... It's not that I don't agree with you, and I do not like those who are only for themselves, but Vernon thought of telling you. He either did it so you could leave and he could steal the boat or so you wouldn't freak out. To me, he wasn't part of the group, and he had his own to worry about. He helps save many people; it's only right he tries to save his own. I agree that was selfish and a dikish move, but hasn't Lee's group done basically the same? You steal those supplies from the car which ends up in a family's utter destruction. We didn't know. So... we are no better, yes? We put our group before others, against our better judgement. Yeah, many of us didn't agree to it, but we thought about it. And I bet quite a few of us just didn't want the blame on theirselves.

    In my opinion, he was just looking out for HIS group, and for that, to get his group to safety, he decided to take the boat. I won't outright trust him if he returns, but I don't sespise the guy. So... yeah. Normally I'd agree I wouldn't want people like that in my group, and if he WAS in my group, I'd prob want him dead like Lilly, but he wasn't. So I don't hold it that much against him. That's my standing anyway. I think many of you just have anger directed at other things and are taking it out on him xD



    Couldn't agree more. Having the boat or not they would've died. What makes it more interesting, if we had the boat then the group might have split-up depending on the your choices. For instance Kenny would've gone alone or with Ben on water and Lee is left with Omid and Christa if you show the bite.

  • @Mark$man said: Let me ask this: We knew SOMEONE left it behind recently, for the lights were on, supplies were left, and the open-door warning sounds were going off. Pretty obvious signs someone was out there. The fact is the group took the supplies because there was noone there to say exactly as you said, "Hey, that's our stuff!" Any excuse that could be made to assume it'd be right to take those supplies, you better bet they would have been taken. Kenny, Katjaa, and Ben would have definitely, and truly if Mark and Larry were alive they'd have been on the same position. Vernon, if you take everyone with you, leaves a note to apologize. At least he had the decency for that.

    Anyway, I'm sure if he knew that taking the boat would have killed anyone he wouldn't have done it either, and guess what? It didn't kill anyone. By the time the group would have gotten back to the Mansion, they would have had no time to get the boat to open water. And what about Clem, who was all alone? In my mind, Vernon unknowingly saved the group from a dumb plan that would have killed them anyway and gave Lee an excuse to go after Clem. Otherwise, everyone probably would have left without him. Yeah, you could say it causes(maybe) Ben's death and Kenny's(if dead). However, you could also say it saves Clementine and Christa and Omid. So... it depends on how you look at it.



    Hey, i didn't want to steal from the station wagon either! Christa is wrong, i would never do the same(but the group overrules my opinion so they do it anyway). Vernon knew we would probably try to flee on the train if he stole the boat, and decided to let us kill ourselves by walking into a herd so he could quietly slip away on the water. The least he could have done was warn us about it in the note after he already took the boat, but he didn't even do that. Maybe i would have forgiven him if he mentioned this tiny little detail, but he didn't and that says to me that he doesn't care about anyone other than his own people. Maybe Kenny, Lilly, Carley, Doug, Katjaa, etc would all do the same, but i would stand against them as well.

    My Lee is willing to chop a complete strangers' leg off and patch him up to try and save his life, but Vernon can't even tell the people that helped him get medicine that they're walking into thousands of undead.

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