Tales of Monkey Island hated more than Escape??

[Ash735]

With an article over at Kotaku asking about the chances of a new Monkey Island game done by the original creators (apparently Dave doesn't count), there are actually a lot of comments that seem to show a lot of hatred to TellTale Games and Tales of Monkey Island from the community, which I'm actually surprised at:

I never got into the Telltale installments of "Monkey Island", since the visuals are really.. well, they are not that good (to say it in a polite way) and I read much about the games being too easy.
Yeah i bought the Telltale Monkey Island series on the principle of supporting Monkey Island, played about halfway through the first installment and haven't been back to it. The sub par visual quality is what really let that "Tales" series down and i just couldn't get past it.

I also bought the first MI:SE on principle of supporting more MI games in the future, I tried playing the updated version and hated it, the animation (i know they wanted to keep it the same as the old version but it just didn't work) and the character design were some of the worst I've witnessed considering the wealth of original source material to draw from. MI2:SE is a marked improvement but still, I'd love to see a fresh new adventure game from the original creators, Monkey Island or not.
I concur. The game is good though the graphics aren't, imo. It just seems genetic esp how most of the characters use the same polygon base.

It isn't just MI, but also Sam and Max.
Even though i bought it and tried playing it, in my mind I'd just rather forget they put that 'Tales' series out.
Yeah, but honestly for me it did not feel like an authentic Monkey Island game play and visually wise,
What about TellTale?

inferior.
The people thinking that the Tales of Monkey Island' quality is remotely close to the two originals are strange.
I'd love to see them do a new Monkey Island full length game. No offense to the episodic one, it was good, but it did not compare to the originals (and the best IMHO was the 3rd game, Curse of Monkey Island).

[Ashton]

Wow... just... wow...

and here I thought CG modeled realistically shaded 3D characters with perfectly timed animations were better than pixelated characters who's mouths "blink" instead of open and close (though the pixels do more in the later games iirc)

Sounds to me like somone(s) is(are) pining for the olden days... yeah IN THEIR TIME those games had good graphics, but my today's standards, ToMI is 110% better!

What do these people want? Live actors? (I'd love to see a live-action scene and people complaining "the graphics aren't up-to-par" lol)

But what can you say.....
http://i671.photobucket.com/albums/vv78/Sinsei55/HatersGonnaHatePanda.jpg

[Spadge]

Well, MI is a pretty convoluted series. You had the MI2 ending, then CMI tried explaining it, then EMI came with bad controls, mediocre graphics and a strange plot and almost a decade later we got TMI, a great game that also had a few drawbacks. Plus we all had a issue or two with the Special Editions. The series goes up and down and we get plotholes, differences in artstyle, graphics, odd controls, puzzle difficulty... all kinds of minor issues with this or that... Don't get me wrong. I really, really love all the games, but I won't blame people who don't.

[Admonisher]

It sounds to me like many people played half-way through the first episode, decided they didn't like straying outside their 2D, point-and-click, nostalgia-based comfort zone, and walked away without looking back.

In any case, don't overlook the positive comments alongside the negative ones!

[Gman5852]

yeah most said they didnt play the other episodes which is unfair. The first episode was the worst of tales. In fact it got better as it went.

[DrRocketGenius]

http://planete-aventure.net/shot/monkey4_04.jpg
http://www.videogamesblogger.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/11/guybrush-and-elaine-in-tales-of-monkey-island-chapter-4.jpg

Really, bad graphics? Really?

[Joop]

I had this discussion with a friend of mine yesterday.
We're both big Monkey Island fans, the only difference is that I gave Tales a chance.
I love Tales, even though it has it's drawbacks.
My friend just kept longing for the big bombastic big boxed adventure games of 10-15 years ago.
He didn't like the way the episodic formula worked with Monkey Island, and that's why he didn't give it a chance.

I think this might be one of the main reasons why people dislike it, so much has changed in the adventure gaming community since the last part and people refer Monkey Island to the classic times. The big budget times.

Ah well, we shouldn't worry too much about those people. Tales has a huge fanbase and Telltale an even bigger one. The way things are looking it's gonna be a long time until the second death of adventure games. Let's just enjoy the ride.

[Jenny]

I think this might be one of the main reasons why people dislike it, so much has changed in the adventure gaming community since the last part and people refer Monkey Island to the classic times. The big budget times.

I think that sums it up pretty well.

I have always loved the original two MI games the best, and can come up with a whole host of reasons why I consider them better. But I can't deny that nostalgia is coloring my view (as I'm sure it is with many others).

I guess it comes down to whether someone wants to just replay the old games they remember and love over and over again, or give the current wave of adventure game additions to the genre a chance. I love the enthusiasm that Telltale has created and am thrilled to play the new games. There's much enjoyment to be found in them.

[Bubblechan]

I used to think CMI was the best MI game between MI 1 and 4, but now I like TMI the best, because the graphics is much better than old MI games, the story is more meaningful and Guybrush is more mature. Sure, I found the puzzles in TMI was a little bit easy, but I found it less frustrating. Most importantly, Telltale is the one which gave MI a new life. Without TMI, Lucasarts probablly kept MI series R.I.P. I even wonder if LA made special editions of MI 1 and 2 if Telltale hadn't been making TMI.

[Rather Dashing]

Most importantly, Telltale is the one which gave MI a new life. Without TMI, Lucasarts probablly kept MI series R.I.P. I even wonder if LA made special editions of MI 1 and 2 if Telltale hadn't been making TMI.
Considering that Dominic Armato was contacted about SOMI:SE first (http://www.telltalegames.com/forums/showpost.php?p=126966&postcount=56), even if just by a hair, it seems far more likely that(as Dave Grossman says in this interview (http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/a-tale-of-monkey-island-interview)) it is far more attributable to Darrell Rodriguez at LucasArts than to Telltale Games.

[Leplaya]

My older brother who happens to be a fan of MI has enjoyed the first 3 games but however he hates Escape. He dislikes it so much that he even thinks its not even part of the canon series. He even avoids it like the plaque, even though he has said good things about Telltale's games{He likes Sam and max and Strong bad games if you guys are wondering} he has yet to play Tales. Been too busy on his hands with his job.

Curse of Monkey Island will always remain as my favorite game for the PC, I think it would have been easier just to call off the series with the 3rd game.

[doodo!]

I like all the games about equally but I really don't care for all the damn map puzzles at the beginning of Tales...I started replaying it recently and stopped because I reached my mapium potential...

As for the graphics I thought they were great, better yet the game actually ran on my computer. I'm a happy costumer who ran the game on low quality and played it through. You can't really expect much better from an episodic game either.

There's underlying genius behind the games graphics that critics and Joe and Sally may not realize, but they're not game designers most likely...

Nor am I , but seriously the game was great for an episodic adventure, even if they reused graphics, they clearly had to cut corners and have experienced Lucas Arts staff collaborate with experienced TTG staff to make this project even possible.

Realistically the only reason some people hate Escape is because of it's graphics, it's controls. Well that's how I see it. As for graphics, I grow up with video games, I've seen far worse, in that time everything was going "real" 3D and it may not have been the top of the list but it will never reach the bottom. Either way the "graphics" give me a surreal experience that the 2D graphics didn't offer in the same way.

The controls although difficult at first are rather easy to understand and comprehend. I never really cared that they were different. It just made puzzles more interesting and innovative to me, it was a unique experience again adding to the experience.

The story, I forgive a few plot holes, and stupid ideas, after all I thought the game was funny and it did make me laugh. I had fun playing it. I don't have any real rules for the story, I love the games but they're not sacred to me...

[Bobbin]

Of course then again, Curse was reviled by some fans when it was first released.

http://www.scummbar.com/games/index.php?game=3&sub=info&todo=7

http://www.mobygames.com/game/windows/curse-of-monkey-island/reviews/reviewerId,15940/

[Mermaid]

Well, I can't say that I particularly like Tales's graphic style either. After giving the game a chance I found that the great animations made up for this, though. Yet I'd prefer a style a little less cartoonish for a next game.

[Polychrome]

This thread assumes both games are "hated" in the first place. :P

[Falanca]

It's the first time ever I've seen people nitpicking over something without even completing the 10% of the entire material.

[Cantatus]

The quality of graphics are fairly meaningless to me. I think one of the big faults of the game industry nowadays is how much importance is put on how good the graphics are. As long as the game has great gameplay and a quality storyline, I'm hooked.

And really, I don't think Telltale's graphics are bad in the least. They may not be photorealistic, but they have a nice style to theme.

My friend just kept longing for the big bombastic big boxed adventure games of 10-15 years ago.
He didn't like the way the episodic formula worked with Monkey Island, and that's why he didn't give it a chance.

I've heard the complaints about the episodic formula before, and I've never understood it. If you don't like episodes, just wait until they all come out and play them back to back. Same difference pretty much. It's not like there are huge gaps in the timeline between episodes.

[BlankCanvasDJ]

I still can't wrap my head around how somebody can say the graphics from Tales are bad while proclaiming their love for Monkey Island 1 and 2. So it's obvious that they are capable of looking past graphics and judging the game underneath, they just refuse to do it for Tales for some reason.

I love Tales, personally, I actually rank it higher than the first game when it comes to enjoyment. Sure it wasn't perfect. I agree that the map puzzles got a little tiring (but then, almost every MI game has at least one annoying maze/map puzzle). I was also turned off by the overuse of the same character models, but they got better and better about that as the series went on. It's a shame so many people were willing to cast judgment after playing such a small amount of the game.

[LuigiHann]

I think the graphics in Tales are fine, the writing is nice, and the controls are passable. Overall, I think it's a good game that stands up well next to the other games of the series.

However, one of the interesting aspects of episodic gaming is that the games improve over the course of the series, which is good, but the flipside is also true: the worst parts, generally, are at the beginning. The part of the game where people get their first impression is also, sadly, where the bulk of the flaws are, and I don't think people are being unfair when they point out that Tales makes a pretty terrible first impression. For instance, I understand what they were going for with the generic repeated pirates, but to a new player, or somebody who remembers the series fondly and is suspicious of whether Telltale was qualified to make this sequel, it does come across as a sign of incredible laziness. Even though the move wasn't driven by laziness, it sends a very clear, lazy message. They changed this later, but for a lot of players, the damage was already done.

The only solution I can think of to this would be for Telltale to make a free, short, Episode Zero type of demo for each series, at least a couple of months before the first real episode, in order to gain important feedback regarding the direction that they're going. This allows them to incorporate that feedback, along with whatever other improvements they make, into the first proper episode, so when the game launches it can make a better first impression.

[Trenchfoot]

What do people want? Photorealistic graphics in a Monkey Island game? What's the point in that?? Oh yeah, and they probably want a dark and gritty Guybrush that has internal confilcts when he has to steal something from someone. I don't want "The Dark Brush", thank you.

But it's true that if people don't like something from the start, they won't continue or try it again. I guess that people on the internet are too busy doing other things...
I had a similar problem with the first chapter. I played it all the way through, I laughed, I enjoyed it, I was smiling from ear to ear while playing it, but for some reason I had no rush in playing the next chapter. But when Chapter 2 came, I got hooked. I know that a lot of people dislike this episode, but I love it. Of course, as it went along, it got better. And that's exactly what I loved about the concept of episodic games. I couldn't wait to see what happened next!
So imagine if ToMI would have been one single game, released in one date altogether. Would the twists have had the same effect? Would people connected with the characters as much as they did? Probably not, because the story only works with the episodic format. It's like a TV show: You can't wait to see the next episode and see what happens next.

Just my complicated two cents.

[BlankCanvasDJ]

I think Tales would have worked great as a single standalone game. It has Telltale's best story and every episode flows well together. Every Monkey Island game is broken down into very distinct parts anyway, Tales would fit right in.

[Chyron8472]

But what can you say.....
http://i671.photobucket.com/albums/vv78/Sinsei55/HatersGonnaHatePanda.jpg

This.

[Bubblechan]

Considering that Dominic Armato was contacted about SOMI:SE first (http://www.telltalegames.com/forums/showpost.php?p=126966&postcount=56), even if just by a hair, it seems far more likely that(as Dave Grossman says in this interview (http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/a-tale-of-monkey-island-interview)) it is far more attributable to Darrell Rodriguez at LucasArts than to Telltale Games.

Please Darrell come baaaaaack.

[Hayden]

I like all the games about equally

That's essentially how I feel. Some are slightly better than others, but when it all comes down to it, I love each of the games equally. Yes, even 'Escape...'. I actually didn't realize there was so much negativity towards EfMI before I started hanging around on the forums.

Realistically the only reason some people hate Escape is because of it's graphics, it's controls. Well that's how I see it.

Yeah, I think that this would be true in most cases. Because, in all seriousness, the game really wasn't that far behind the likes of 'Curse...' and 'Revenge...'. The writing was as strong as ever, there were some really cool characters, the puzzles were generally quite enjoyable, the storyline was fine (in my opinion) albeit a little silly, but I can look past the silliness.

It's just that the graphics would have caused an automatic bias towards the game from a lot of players. From the very beginning, they wouldn't have given the game the same chance as, say, Curse. They would have had a negative attitude towards everything in the game. The silliness that you and I mentioned wouldn't have been overlooked, and the slightly weaker jokes would have been hated rather than just ignored, the storyline would have been resented regardless of whether it was good or not, and any changes to the existing canon would have been despised by these players: overall, their opinion of the whole game would have been altered from the beginning just because of the graphics and control system, and that's a sad thing. It may not have been a massive bias, but it would have been enough to ultimately change someone's opinion of the game pretty drastically down the line.

The same thing probably would have happened to many who didn't like the art and graphics in Tales.

Well, I can't say that I particularly like Tales's graphic style either. After giving the game a chance I found that the great animations made up for this, though. Yet I'd prefer a style a little less cartoonish for a next game.

Really? I personally really liked the graphical style of Tales. I actually quite like that whole cartoon-y, non-realistic look and I feel that it suits the style of the game. But, hey, it's just different opinions in the end, isn't it? It's a good thing that you still played the game the whole way through and gave it a proper chance... unlike some people.

It's the first time ever I've seen people nitpicking over something without even completing the 10% of the entire material.

Yeah, this is what annoyed me. If people are going to make a judgment of the game, then they should at least play a substantial amount of the game. Then they go and blast their opinions about without giving the game a proper chance. Ignorant, impatient, idiotic people.

I had this discussion with a friend of mine yesterday.
We're both big Monkey Island fans, the only difference is that I gave Tales a chance.
I love Tales, even though it has it's drawbacks.
My friend just kept longing for the big bombastic big boxed adventure games of 10-15 years ago.
He didn't like the way the episodic formula worked with Monkey Island, and that's why he didn't give it a chance.


That's sad, he really is missing out. I initially didn't like the idea of episodic game distribution. But I decided to give it a chance (hell, I wasn't going to miss out on a new Monkey Island game, episodic or not :)) and as soon as I'd finished 'Launch of the Screaming Narwhal' I was hooked. I loved being left with a cliffhanger, I actually liked looking forward to the next episode, and I really enjoyed being a part of the discussion and speculation that went on here in the forums in between episodes. It resulted in a greater gaming experience. Plus, in the end, I had a gaming experience that lasted over the course of half a year, instead of a few days.

The quality of graphics are fairly meaningless to me. I think one of the big faults of the game industry nowadays is how much importance is put on how good the graphics are. As long as the game has great gameplay and a quality storyline, I'm hooked.

Exactly, except I don't even care that much about gameplay (when it comes to controls and interfaces). People put too much emphasis on the surface of the game - what it looks like, how it plays, which buttons you have to press to make the character do a particular thing and whether or not those buttons are to hard to push. Really, what is really important is the story (as you said), the plot, the characters and their depth and development, etc.

And really, I don't think Telltale's graphics are bad in the least. They may not be photorealistic, but they have a nice style to them.

Much agreed. I don't think realistic graphics would work for Monkey Island games. It just wouldn't suit the whole feel and tone.

I still can't wrap my head around how somebody can say the graphics from Tales are bad while proclaiming their love for Monkey Island 1 and 2. So it's obvious that they are capable of looking past graphics and judging the game underneath, they just refuse to do it for Tales for some reason.

http://likesirl.com/images/logo.png

Haha, yes! A great point, and I agree. I guess the only thing that really separates the two is nostalgia and bias.

[Alcoremortis]

I still haven't gotten my brother to play anything more than the first episode of the series, or, in fact, Monkey Island games besides Escape, which he loves (though he did just start playing LeChuck's Revenge: SE a week ago).

Maybe I'll convince him some day...

[Hassat Hunter]

*cough* Graphic Whores *cough*
Realistically the only reason some people hate Escape is because of it's graphics, it's controls.
Why thank you. I obviously must have imagined the poor humour and annoying puzzles.
It's so good you know exactly what I think and feel, much better than I do myself...
It's the first time ever I've seen people nitpicking over something without even completing the 10% of the entire material.
You must not browse the internet frequently?
Then again, maybe I got a major overdose of it lately being an Alpha Protocol fan. The amount of bias people have against that game with completing 0% of the material (oh yeah) is shocking.

Hell, even one guy came to the official forums, stating he didn't play the game but Obsidian HAD to fix his list of issues, which where totally true because of 3-rd hand info obviously (sarcasm dripping off here!), otherwise the game would remain to suck.
You can imagine he didn't quite get a warm welcome from us all.

[doodo!]

I should have said most people. LOL. Well, some times I do use the wrong words then it looks like I believe one extreme . I do think that being on these forums I've seen people complain mostly about graphics and controls though.

[StarEye]

I like the EMI graphics and controls. It works well, don't see why anyone would have any more problem with them. Grim Fandango controlled worse, being much more clunky, but that didn't stop it from being one of the greatest adventure games ever created. As a matter of fact, I think it controlled better than Tales did - at least it didn't have a ton of unnecessary steps to do something (like combining objects).

Now, an adventure game classic that really controlled badly was Gabriel Knight 3.

[Vainamoinen]

When ToMI was announced, I was really, really upset about graphics and controls, and I wrote rather lengthy texts about this which do not really matter nowadays. Both things have turned out less of a nuisance to me. The episodes were a great experience, and the real nuisances were somewhere else.

I feel that the reception of Tales was a rather positive one. Of course, there are critical voices still, and of course some points are valid (from those who have actually played the episodes). Personally and subjectively, the following things were particularly annoying:


Persistence of cameras. What was that all about? Every episode had supposedly non-painted pictures. Photographs of DeCava, Guybrush, the Voodoo Lady; Guybrush mentions to LeChuck that he "has to get his camera", and in the afterlife, Guybrush is even photographed. That wasn't a targeted anachronism, it was just all over the place!
Yes, the re-use of character models was outrageous! One of the main reason Nipperkin just had to die was that he's just so similar to Winslow.
Noogie was one of the worst characters ever. I found DeSinge OK in my recent game, but Noogie... someone has seen too much "American Pie". It just wasn't funny.
As stated one hundred times: Someone forgot the ending of the game due to lack of time and space. I won't ever get over this. :(



Comparing ToMI to EfMI, of course, really sets things straight. I played EfMI through once and sold it as fast as I could. Escape reproduced the series, brought nothing new, repeating the bad stuff and leaving out the good stuff. This game had next to no pirate flavour, while the Tales achieved really great things in this respect.

I liked the Tales for:


Morgan LeFlay. She wasn't the deepest character ever, but she was the most complex being in a MI game ever.
Guybrush. His irresponsibility and childlike devotion to Elaine were greatly played out.
the great old-fashioned puzzles and great recycling of old ideas in "Lair of the Leviathan". I feared the belly of the manatee was a bad idea, but I was mistaken.
Pirate atmosphere. The pox, nighttime environments, the swordfights, the battles at sea, the carribbean islands.
The music. While I still don't think that iMuse really worked with Tales, some of the compositions really stuck in my brain.
Facial animation. There was some really great stuff in there, including the pirate-face-competitions.



See, I can not remember a single good thing about EfMI, while I could add to the positive points above anytime. My final scores: EfMI not more than 3/10, ToMI at least 8/10. They're just not comparable...

[S@bre]

Remember that the WiiWare size limits prevented TTG from doing astounding graphics. If they wanted graphics a'la Devil's Playhouse, they'd have had to either drop the Wii version or essentially develop two separate visual versions of the game: one for PC and one for Wii. Ultimately, what we got visually was more than sufficient, and still looked brilliant in some areas.

[BlankCanvasDJ]

Persistence of cameras. What was that all about? Every episode had supposedly non-painted pictures. Photographs of DeCava, Guybrush, the Voodoo Lady; Guybrush mentions to LeChuck that he "has to get his camera", and in the afterlife, Guybrush is even photographed. That wasn't a targeted anachronism, it was just all over the place!


I'll give you the complaint about the ending, but really? This? I can see your point but Tales was probably the least anachronistic Monkey Island game to date. The first game had electric lighting, the second had a vending machine, the third had a roller coaster(!) and don't even get me started on the fourth game. The series is built on anachronisms.

[Trenchfoot]

Remember that the WiiWare size limits prevented TTG from doing astounding graphics. If they wanted graphics a'la Devil's Playhouse, they'd have had to either drop the Wii version or essentially develop two separate visual versions of the game: one for PC and one for Wii. Ultimately, what we got visually was more than sufficient, and still looked brilliant in some areas.

But isn't The Devil's Playhouse available for Wii too? Or they have a different version with comprised graphics and music?

No fair, the brilliant music of ToMI deserved live instruments! Just imagine a full orchestral version of "The Swordfight"... Aaaah!
And there I go again praising the soundtrack... Someone out there is rolling their eyes.

[Darkmire]

I think the haters of TOMI are mostly people that are stuck in the past (or are bad at puzzle-based games). It was easily one of the best Monkey Island games yet. Easily. Telltale fleshed out a cast of characters much more than most games ever dream of. It's almost an unfair comparison. The puzzles and hints were perfect, the humor was not only in line with previous games, but very fresh and amusing. And the way they handled the storyline (by relating it to the past games while also moving forward) was perfect. And surely the Tales series will only get better if they make a second season.

[S@bre]

But isn't The Devil's Playhouse available for Wii too?

Nope (http://www.telltalegames.com/games). Was released for PC, PS3, Ipad and Mac, with the two dominant platforms focused on in development being PC and PS3.

[OzzieMonkey]

As stated one hundred times: Someone forgot the ending of the game due to lack of time and space. I won't ever get over this. :(




Wait, what? Forgot the ending? There was an ending, wasn't there? Did you not see the after credits sequence?

[Mataku]

I gonna be honest here, altho i found ToMI to be a fun experience (first time i played an episodic game while it was being released, most of the fun was just talking and theorizing about the plot), I found the game has about zero re-playability factor for me.
It's just a nudge above EMI, that has zero PLAYability factor (started playing it 7 years ago, still stuck in chapter 1 and have no will to continue).
why no re-playability? because there's nothing worth replaying. older MI games have always been incredibly thick and detailed in the trivial. you could talk to people and go into long conversations with them about pretty much nothing that is important to the story, for no other reason except to tell a joke. you can go into a room and have about 20 item hotspots, non of them are usable or important, but each could have a funny response. Tomi pretty much had non of that. the game felt thin and linear. Almost everything you could interact with was either a person, a pickable object or a part of a puzzle. (and before people go "oh, but there's that thing in that episode that was awesome", please look up the word "almost" that i used :))
For me, TOMI is a good story that just happened to have the MI characters in it.

[Vainamoinen]

I'll give you the complaint about the ending, but really? This? I can see your point but Tales was probably the least anachronistic Monkey Island game to date. The first game had electric lighting, the second had a vending machine, the third had a roller coaster(!) and don't even get me started on the fourth game. The series is built on anachronisms.

My problem was that it was so recurring that it stopped being an anachronism. It did not feel displaced any more, it didn't feel targeted. Just thrown in. A minor annoyance, maybe, but one that stuck with me.

Wait, what? Forgot the ending? There was an ending, wasn't there? Did you not see the after credits sequence?

There was a standard, bland and illogical conclusion to the very basic storyline element "Guybrush is dead" clipped at the end of the "Tales". This "ending" lasted 60 seconds and left dozens of painstakingly and carefully established story threads of the episodes untied (as has been discussed to death in this forum). The after credits sequence was meant as a cliffhanger and not as a conclusion to anything.

why no re-playability? because there's nothing worth replaying. older MI games have always been incredibly thick and detailed in the trivial. you could talk to people and go into long conversations with them about pretty much nothing that is important to the story, for no other reason except to tell a joke. you can go into a room and have about 20 item hotspots, non of them are usable or important, but each could have a funny response. Tomi pretty much had non of that.

That's really interesting, because I actually enjoy TTG's love for detail and the possibility of "exploring" a scene by clicking on relatively unimportant hotspots.

[Hayden]

There was a standard, bland and illogical conclusion to the very basic storyline element "Guybrush is dead" clipped at the end of the "Tales". This "ending" lasted 60 seconds and left dozens of painstakingly and carefully established story threads of the episodes untied[...].

This is the sort of problem that will be encountered when it comes to pumping out an episode each month. Having only a month to produce an entire episode is, in my opinion, too short. It's way too restrictive and it can often reflect on the finished episode, which it has done in this case. There would almost definitely have been a longer ending and a more satisfying conclusion to ToMI's story, but the deadline would have most probably disallowed Telltale from creating one. This is why I think that, if Telltale were to make a second season of Tales, that the episodes should be released every two months.

This way, they will be able to flesh out the story more, develop the characters more, expand the environment and locations in which the episode takes place (thus enhancing the game's exploration), put in more dialog options, insert more selectable items into the game, create and integrate more puzzles into the game, give themselves time to write more jokes, as well as allowing themselves to have that extra time that is needed to fix bugs and refine the game.

If the episodes were released every second month, then it would result in a higher quality episode each time, and it would also fix the re-playability issue that Mataku mentioned.

[Spadge]

If the episodes were released every second month, then it would result in a higher quality episode each time, and it would also fix the re-playability issue that Mataku mentioned.

I have to agree. The Devil's Playhouse seemed to suffer because of this too.

[Vainamoinen]

This is the sort of problem that will be encountered when it comes to pumping out an episode each month.

While I find the idea of a bimonthly episode release schedule tempting (imagine that: 6 episodes would be one glorious Monkey Island year!), my original idea was that the way the ending turned out was due to bad planning. When they reached episode 5, they had some dozen story threads dangling in the air, and one episode was just not enough to conclude all of them. The entire season was about building suspense, intrigue, etc. - which was skillfully done; it was a storytelling beginner's mistake to not reveal certain things during other episodes to make a short, sharp ending possible. It wasn't the time left - when the end of the fourth episode was reached, a fitting conclusion in one episode might actually have been an impossibility.

[techie775]

Honestly I got bored with Grim Fandango and have never completed it. The same would have happened with Escape had I not been using walkthroughs. Stupid GRIME controls.
I needed hints with tales but it was alot more enjoyable to play. I loved have access to the mouse again. Episodic formats don't bother me too much cause then you get to play pieces of the game while they're working on the next chapter. The alternative is waiting 6-months to who knows how long for a full game (which can be worth it for alot of games but I'm fine with how tales and sam and max are doing it right now)

[doodo!]

I dont think Grim was boring but I started it a while back and haven't had the motivation to play it again. I still think it's a good game, probably play it during my retirement or something, about 50 years or so from now...maybe 40.

[Ashton]

Personally, I hated the old verb system of LA games (likewise while nto as bad I didnt care for Sierra's icon system... so many times I used HAND instead of EYE and killed myself...), I much prefer the new TTG method

I will agree there's not a lot of replayability until you forget most of the story, it's just too linear. If there were a ton of side-quests (ala Final Fantasy series) then there would be more to go back and do, but as it is... GREAT GREAT GREAT story/storytelling, but once you've heard it, you've heard it...

[mgrant]

So then you don't really like re-reading good books? I do that all the time. Good story is good story, be it a game, a show, movie or book. Just because you know how the story ends doesn't mean you still can't enjoy the ride.

[MonkeyMania]

http://planete-aventure.net/shot/monkey4_04.jpg
http://www.videogamesblogger.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/11/guybrush-and-elaine-in-tales-of-monkey-island-chapter-4.jpg

Really, bad graphics? Really?

Yes, considering there is a 9 year gap between the two.

[FitzoliverJ]

Honestly I got bored with Grim Fandango and have never completed it.

Me too. And to think of the expense and trouble it took to get a copy.... :(

[Ashton]

So then you don't really like re-reading good books? I do that all the time. Good story is good story, be it a game, a show, movie or book. Just because you know how the story ends doesn't mean you still can't enjoy the ride.

I'm not defending the haters, Just pointing out that linear games do tend to have a lower replay value because there's not much new to discover. I do replay games (linear or not) I do rewatch TV/Movies/Anime, and I do re-read books, but like most people, if there is new content, I will be replaying it more often. (I actually have 1 game I've barely re-touched in over 10 years (closer to 15) because of the nature of the plot)

EDIT:
And the only thing "bad" I can say about the graphics is they are rather pointy (low polygon count) but at the same time, I still play IF games (i.e. ZORK) so graphics clearly take a back-seat to plot/puzzles/etc :D)

[StarEye]

The thing about very linear games is that it really has to be something special in order to give me a reason to play through it again. Safe to say, plenty of adventure games does that to me, but there are also plenty of games I'm happy I played through once, but not really interested in playing through again. Monkey Island 1, 2 and 3 are obviously qualified for several playthroughs for ever and ever, but so is Broken Sword, DOTT, Grim Fandango, Beneath a Steel Sky, Indy Fate of Atlantis and so forth.

I'm not entirely sure about TOMI yet, because the first two episodes are forgettable. Thankfully, Episode 3 gets a lot better, and it's really from there I want to play - but I can't really bring myself to start a game from right in the middle of the story, so I will probably pull myself through Episode 1 and 2 anyway.

It probably won't be the most played MI game though. MI1 and 2 will always have that title, as they're alread far far ahead of the others, and for the others to catch up would take me not playing MI1 or 2 again for ten years or so. I think that would be hazardous to my health.

[onionmaster]

I must admit, I love the first 3 MI games and I thought Escape was ok, but I haven't been able to get into Tales. The humour, characters and general plot style is just so different than what I am used to.

However I'm only halfway through the second episode, so I am going on the notion that the best ones are towards the end, as Telltale Series usually are. Still I am thankful to them for keeping the series alive.

[Gryffalio]

I can sympathise with the OP's quotes entirely because I thought the same as them. I still don't like the first ep very much but the difference for me was that the game improved as it went along. From inside the Manatee onwards it was a great game that definitely measured up to LCR/CoMI in most ways.

The visuals left a bit to be desired in the series, mainly early on. I think the difference later on was that the concepts were more enclosed and the visuals benefited from inspired art (like the Manatee or the moody court chapter's Club 41)

[jannar85]

Wow, and here I thought personally that Tales is the best game in the series by now. I loved the way the plot got really deep, deep and dark. In many ways, reminds me of a good mix between MI2 and CMI. Good soup....Goodsoup. Wow.

Griswold Goodsoup.

Anyway, I rate them after this order:
1) Tales (Wow.)
2) MI3 (VOICES! And funny plot.)
3) MI2 (No words can describe this.)
4) MI1 (Off to a good start... I wanna be a pirate!)
5) EMI (first time we could actually interact with Elaine!)

[Edgy Grimdark]

I absolutely loved Tales from the first chapter. 3D was adequate; the rendering engine seemed a bit aged but still well up to the task, and used in good fashion. In fact the body language and facial expressions are pretty much superior by far to any 3D title I can remember off-hand.

The story started out slow, but built up well throughout the chapters. Compared to the cases where the story uses all of it's energy in the first few chapters and then start to succumb, this style is obviously much more preferred. The mood shift at the 4th chapter was absolutely brutal, but well written too. The entire 5th episode was mostly funny, but very very dark. With the whole set-up suddenly turned to pitch black the game was easily the most emotionally involving since Planescape: Torment.

The only real let-down was the quick resolution in the ending. I expected a bit more drama, a bit more comedy and tons of more epic-ness-ity than there was. I just felt rushed. Ah well... the coda was nice though, and hopefully it spawns a sequel.

[Anne26]

I have to agree with what most people seem to be saying. Eps 1 and 2 weren't as good as the later eps.

[mgrant]

...am I the only person who liked "Siege of Spinner Cay" more than "Lair of the Leviathan"?

[alkapel]

...am I the only person who liked "Siege of Spinner Cay" more than "Lair of the Leviathan"?

Yes!

[mightypiratetm]

...am I the only person who liked "Siege of Spinner Cay" more than "Lair of the Leviathan"?
No!

[Hassat Hunter]

Yes?

[VeronicanPlay]

...am I the only person who liked "Siege of Spinner Cay" more than "Lair of the Leviathan"?

I don't think Siege of Spinner Cay is as good as the later episodes, and at the same time I don't think Lair of the Leviathan is as great as the rest does.

And yes, I like Siege more than Lair. :)

[Reaper Lyn]

I admit I haven't played Escape in a long while, but if I remember correctly, the big problem I had with Escape was not the graphics, the writing or the story - they were all acceptable, if not quite up to earlier standards. But the control system was very clunky and difficult for me to control, and that (combined with the merely adequate graphics and story) made completing puzzles annoying rather than appropriately challenging. I also disliked what were, in my opinion, ill thought out plot revisions regarding Herman Toothrot, but that's not really relevant.

Tales was well written, clever, sucked me in and made me believe that these were the characters I remembered from the earlier games. And I enjoyed the hell out of it. As for particular stages of Tales, I liked Lair more than Siege as well, but that's more due to my own personal tastes than anything objective.

[Anne26]

I admit I haven't played Escape in a long while, but if I remember correctly, the big problem I had with Escape was not the graphics, the writing or the story - they were all acceptable, if not quite up to earlier standards. But the control system was very clunky and difficult for me to control, and that (combined with the merely adequate graphics and story) made completing puzzles annoying rather than appropriately challenging. I also disliked what were, in my opinion, ill thought out plot revisions regarding Herman Toothrot, but that's not really relevant.

Tales was well written, clever, sucked me in and made me believe that these were the characters I remembered from the earlier games. And I enjoyed the hell out of it. As for particular stages of Tales, I liked Lair more than Siege as well, but that's more due to my own personal tastes than anything objective.

I played it again about 5 months before tales came out, funny i had just started thinking it was ashame there was no new game and then suddenly there was:D Anyway the controls were the worst part of the game, but I do think that the tales ones were actually worse. The controls of the first three games were far easier to use. It does get annoying when the controls arent right, but I guess you do get used to it after a while.

[Vainamoinen]

I have played Escape once when it came out. I remember the massively weak points being the control system (which even keeps me from playing Grim Fandango again, which was brilliant in every other respect), the senseless waste of time that was "Monkey combat", and the total lack of pirate atmosphere. Escape from Monkey Island was about amusement parks, land owners, Tiki restaurants and giant robots, not about pirates. It's quite incomparable to the Tales.

[coolsome]

Escape from Monkey Island was about amusement parks

To be fair EMI removed the amusment park from Monkey Island.

[Hayden]

Haha, good point Sailorcuteness.


But anyway, on the topic of the lack of piratey atmosphere in EfMI, I think that was sort of intended to a degree. I mean, the game's story was essentially about the pirate world being pushed aside, diminishing and dying as a result of a new world; a new system and regime taking over. The piratey atmosphere was lacking for a reason, but we still saw glimpses of the piratey atmosphere:

- the whole of Melee Island in Act I.
- Jumbeaux LaFeet, his story about his father, and his scheme that took place to remove the hat from his father's statue.
- Pegnose Pete. That guy was pretty piratey, he was just tagging along with the greater power in Ozzie.
- Monkey Island (the actual island). For sure it didn't exactly have a piratey atmosphere, but at least it didn't have all of the bright colours and modern feel of... say, Jambalaya.

For sure, there was less of a piratey feel than the other games, but it was sort of done for a reason. And perhaps the whole story could have been executed better, but I feel that it was told sufficiently.

[mgrant]

^ This.