Plotholes/ continuity errors/ anachronisms in the game (spoilers!)

[Origami]

In the beginning when the DeLorean appears, shouldn't Biff and George be curious as to what that sound is?!

Also when Marty goes downtown is it responsible to leave the DeLorean unattended like that?


Just some minor issues I'd thought I discuss here. Doesn't really bother me though. I think it's because of the pacing of the story, the game only really starts when you arrived in the new era.

[Mino_Dan]

Yes to the first.

2nd isn't really that important. Its 1986 afterall. For the people of Hill Valley its just a pimped up Delorean.
And I'm pretty sure Marty locked the car when he headed into town.

[Ghost Rider LSOV]

In the beginning when the DeLorean appears, shouldn't Biff and George be curious as to what that sound is?!

I think Biff was unconcious from the amplifier at that point.
Not sure about George.

[Rade88]

I've finished the game twice now and love it :D

However, there are one or possibly two problems with the story regarding history being rewritten. Spoilers ahead!




Near the end of the game when Marty goes to break Doc out of jail, he finds him already gone, with Tannen having taken him in a van to kill him somewhere, and the newspaper from the next day changes to reflect the change in events. But what I'm wondering is, what exactly did Marty do that caused this change to happen? As far as I can tell, even if Marty went into the past, did everything he did but then wasn't able to break the Doc out of jail in time, the Doc would have still been released the next day and then killed outside the courthouse. But something was changed, causing Tannen to decide to get the Doc out of jail and drive him out somewhere to kill him. But what was changed?

The second problem isn't as big and can probably be explained easily. At the end of the game Marty finds himself fading away, meaning something must've happened to Arthur. If Marty had never gone into the past, then wouldn't Emmet have still delivered the subpoena to Arty who would have then still testified against Tannen? But they delivered it anyway. My only explanation is that without Marty's help, Emmet was never able to deliver the subpoena to Arty, who then never testified and never got himself (possibly) killed by Tannen.

Does anyone have an explanation or a better one?

[Irishmile]

He served his grandfather papers..... maybe the judge figured they better move the prisoner because he felt they were closing in on Kid and thought Doc was in trouble in there.

[Farlander]

But what was changed?

Well, Marty pissing Kid off probably didn't change anything, but Arthur receiving the subpoena most likely did (the goons are even mad at that fact in the episode 2 preview), so Kid decided to act.

If Marty had never gone into the past, then wouldn't Emmet have still delivered the subpoena to Arty who would have then still testified against Tannen? But they delivered it anyway. My only explanation is that without Marty's help, Emmet was never able to deliver the subpoena to Arty, who then never testified and never got himself (possibly) killed by Tannen.

As far as I gather, without Marty's interference, a) Arthur would never gather the subpoena (but that doesn't stop Kid from being arrested in the future), b) Doc would never meet Edna (have you seen how Edna looked at Doc like Lorraine at Marty?), c) Doc would never be really disillusioned about science, d) And probably there are some things I don't take into account right now. Generally speaking, Marty messed the hell up.

[Rade88]

maybe the judge figured they better move the prisoner because he felt they were closing in on Kid and thought Doc was in trouble in there.

But that would have happened whether Marty was there or not, but the paper from the next day says that the Doc was killed outside the Courthouse after being released, so something was changed that caused them to move him during the night.

As far other stuff Marty did, I agree that Emmet and Edna meeting never would've happened and may have changed something, but I didn't get the impression that he became disillusioned with science.

[Farlander]

As far other stuff Marty did, I agree that Emmet and Edna meeting never would've happened and may have changed something, but I didn't get the impression that he became disillusioned with science.

Well, not with science per se, maybe, but with his own abilities and what he can accomplish. You know, if Marty would never try to talk to him he would never think Marty's a patent officer and there would never be really any downer or ruined expectations, you know (Doc tells that only a few months later there will be an Expo which would pinpoint Emmet's decision to be a scientist).

[CartoonistWill]

He served his grandfather papers..... maybe the judge figured they better move the prisoner because he felt they were closing in on Kid and thought Doc was in trouble in there.

Unless Kid Tannen knocked out the real driver, it seems Judge Brown may not have known about this little moving of the prisoner.

[CartoonistWill]

As far as I gather, without Marty's interference, a) Arthur would never gather the subpoena (but that doesn't stop Kid from being arrested in the future), b) Doc would never meet Edna (have you seen how Edna looked at Doc like Lorraine at Marty?), c) Doc would never be really disillusioned about science, d) And probably there are some things I don't take into account right now. Generally speaking, Marty messed the hell up.

I also take into consideration that Emmet would have never talked back to his father at this point without Marty's interference. This kind of personality/decision/relationship change probably had a GIGANTIC impact on the space-time continuum. I don't think Emmet will be disillusioned with science... But I think he will become disillusioned with friendship and with the law. And I'll leave you with your own imaginations instead of delving further.

[CartoonistWill]

I've finished the game twice now and love it :D

However, there are one or possibly two problems with the story regarding history being rewritten. Spoilers ahead!




Near the end of the game when Marty goes to break Doc out of jail, he finds him already gone, with Tannen having taken him in a van to kill him somewhere, and the newspaper from the next day changes to reflect the change in events. But what I'm wondering is, what exactly did Marty do that caused this change to happen? As far as I can tell, even if Marty went into the past, did everything he did but then wasn't able to break the Doc out of jail in time, the Doc would have still been released the next day and then killed outside the courthouse. But something was changed, causing Tannen to decide to get the Doc out of jail and drive him out somewhere to kill him. But what was changed?

The second problem isn't as big and can probably be explained easily. At the end of the game Marty finds himself fading away, meaning something must've happened to Arthur. If Marty had never gone into the past, then wouldn't Emmet have still delivered the subpoena to Arty who would have then still testified against Tannen? But they delivered it anyway. My only explanation is that without Marty's help, Emmet was never able to deliver the subpoena to Arty, who then never testified and never got himself (possibly) killed by Tannen.

Does anyone have an explanation or a better one?


I think you're dead on correct. I don't think Emmet would have been able to find Artie without Einstein's nose to guide them. And even then he wouldn't have been able to find a way to get Artie to come outside unless he created an invention to help him deliver the subpoena, which is probably not likely with how much he hides his love for science from the public. Whatever put Kid Tannen in prison, it either wasn't Artie or Kid's humiliation at the hands of Marty and Artie going to testify against him probably set him off and may have been what caused him to personally take out Doc Brown. But I think all of this will actually be explained in the second episode.

[Rade88]

But I think all of this will actually be explained in the second episode.

I think you're probably right :)


As for interfering with Emmet's life as a scientist, I actually think it made him believe in himself more. If he was feeling that dejected about it I don't think he would've called after Marty to tell him about the throttle, and wouldn't have smiled like that. I think he was disappointed about the patent, but realised that someone needed him and his invention, and that someone also helped him finally stand up to his father, so he would actually become more confident as a scientist. Also, the way events occurred originally, Emmet never even heard back from the patent company at all, so wouldn't that have left him feeling more dejected?

[Cyphox]

i found another "problem"

its where doc states that marty cant go back and rescue doc before he gets in jail

doc says: "blah, the time continuum would be destroyed, blah" but thats bullsh, what about different timelines that will be created when history is changed?? doc explained this very precisely in bttf part2.

edit: OMG, this means the whole game, all 5 episodes are a lie and would never happen that way in the real bttf-universe.

is it too late to cancel my order??

...

just kidding....

[linorn]

But something was changed, causing Tannen to decide to get the Doc out of jail and drive him out somewhere to kill him. But what was changed?

Could that possibly be what was shown in the trailer for ep 2: the policeman finding the Delorean ?

[BlankCanvasDJ]

As for interfering with Emmet's life as a scientist, I actually think it made him believe in himself more. If he was feeling that dejected about it I don't think he would've called after Marty to tell him about the throttle, and wouldn't have smiled like that. I think he was disappointed about the patent, but realised that someone needed him and his invention, and that someone also helped him finally stand up to his father, so he would actually become more confident as a scientist. Also, the way events occurred originally, Emmet never even heard back from the patent company at all, so wouldn't that have left him feeling more dejected?

Exactly. Emmet stood up to his father AND completed a (relatively) successful invention earlier than he would have before. That will likely have an effect on his performance at the Expo. While the original Doc had a spectacular failure at the Expo, the new more self-confident Emmet may find it a spectacular success. And it may be that lack of a humbling experience that leads to the events hinted at in Citizen Brown.

[Rade88]

i found another "problem"

its where doc states that marty cant go back and rescue doc before he gets in jail

doc says: "blah, the time continuum would be destroyed, blah" but thats bullsh, what about different timelines that will be created when history is changed?? doc explained this very precisely in bttf part2.

edit: OMG, this means the whole game, all 5 episodes are a lie and would never happen that way in the real bttf-universe.

is it too late to cancel my order??

...

just kidding....

The difference this time is that if Marty were to change history in that way, then the DeLorian would never have had to go to 1986, and Marty would never have gone to the past. But if the future changes like that while Marty is still in the past, it would do something where a 1986 would be created that should have a Marty who never went into the past, but it can't be created because Marty is still actually in the past. I'm not sure if that makes sense but it's damn hard to explain lol.

[Farlander]

The difference this time is that if Marty were to change history in that way, then the DeLorian would never have had to go to 1986, and Marty would never have gone to the past. But if the future changes like that while Marty is still in the past, it would do something where a 1986 would be created that should have a Marty who never went into the past, but it can't be created because Marty is still actually in the past. I'm not sure if that makes sense but it's damn hard to explain lol.

That's a paradox that's all over the place in BttF2 and 3, it doesn't seem to do much harm to the time travellers, but Doc still wants to have caution, just in case.

[Cyphox]

i have to think about this.

but still, it should be possible, cause the delorean, marty and so on are from different timelines then and in the "old" timelines they wouldnt exist after travelling back anymore (but who cares...) and so on...

damn, THIINK BRAIN!! THINK!!!

[Rade88]

That's a paradox that's all over the place in BttF2 and 3, it doesn't seem to do much harm to the time travellers, but Doc still wants to have caution, just in case.

I suppose that's true. If you think about it, in the new alternate 1985 from BttF2, Doc and Marty would probably have never gone back in time, or even have created the DeLorian, meaning the events that led to Biff receiving the Almanac would never have happened. However I think that's explained by the fact that it's like an alternate reality that exists on it's own outside of the regular reality, and only people from the regular reality would know about it.

So you would think that if in the game, Marty did change events so that he would never have had to go back in time, it would simply have created an alternate 1986 that, when Marty returned to it, would just be the same as when he left it basically, and Doc would have returned home in the DeLorian. Marty would still remember the events, and the DeLorian would still have come to get him before, because that was in the regular reality, and he would now be in an alternate reality.

[ALV910]

I think Biff was unconcious from the amplifier at that point.
Not sure about George.

He was, but when you go to Edna's, you see Biff at the video store.

[Strayth]

And remember Biff saw the flying Delorean so...

[Ghost Rider LSOV]

He was, but when you go to Edna's, you see Biff at the video store.

Enough time to get up / have George wake him up or something. :p

[picnick]

Has anybody noticed any continuity errors?

I have noticed one: When Marty is in the Soup Kitchen and asks for more salt etc. in the soup, Cue ball puts his paper down. When that sequence finishes and Marty can walk around, the paper is not on the desk where Cue Ball left it.

[Ninja]

Has anybody noticed any continuity errors?

I have noticed one: When Marty is in the Soup Kitchen and asks for more salt etc. in the soup, Cue ball puts his paper down. When that sequence finishes and Marty can walk around, the paper is not on the desk where Cue Ball left it.


Yeah, that's cause a space ninja took it.

[Silverwolfpet]

^ I can confirm that.

[picnick]

yeah, that's cause a space ninja took it.
lmao :d

[Larn_Connor]

Harassment laws did not come into effect until after 1964.

1931 Emmet mentions something about suing Marty for harassment. There are other out of place things, just have to take the time to write them out.

[Mataku]

not really continuity error, but i was expecting people from 1931 to at least be a bit curious about the name Einstein.

[markeres]

not really continuity error, but i was expecting people from 1931 to at least be a bit curious about the name Einstein.If you're implying that nobody would have heard of Einstein, he was known in 1931. He'd won the Nobel Prize in 1921, and his theories of Relativity were published decades before that.

If you're implying that people should have wondered why somebody named a dog Einstein, then I agree with you. :)

[Farlander]

If you're implying that nobody would have heard of Einstein, he was known in 1931. He'd won the Nobel Prize in 1921, and his theories of Relativity were published decades before that.

If you're implying that people should have wondered why somebody named a dog Einstein, then I agree with you. :)

Let's face it, Albert Einstein is not the only Einstein living on this good Earth. Besides, Einstein didn't immigrate to America until... Actually, I don't know when. But after 1931, right? If yes, then there's no reason for everybody to know about Albert Einstein, especially in a small town like Hill Valley (I suppose Einstein immigrating were pretty big news, but heck, I don't know actually)

[linorn]

He's a dog! People name their pets the weirdest things. No-one would think it odd in the slightest.

[ppehrson]

Let's face it, Albert Einstein is not the only Einstein living on this good Earth. Besides, Einstein didn't immigrate to America until... Actually, I don't know when. But after 1931, right? If yes, then there's no reason for everybody to know about Albert Einstein, especially in a small town like Hill Valley (I suppose Einstein immigrating were pretty big news, but heck, I don't know actually)

Einstein fled in 1933 because he was extremely unpopular with the Nazis (he's German) ... and didn't receive citizenship till 1940. In 1931 he would be unknown to most Americans because Americans had little knowledge of, or regard to, what went on in the world outside the US.

[markeres]

Let's face it, Albert Einstein is not the only Einstein living on this good Earth. Besides, Einstein didn't immigrate to America until... Actually, I don't know when. But after 1931, right? If yes, then there's no reason for everybody to know about Albert Einstein, especially in a small town like Hill Valley (I suppose Einstein immigrating were pretty big news, but heck, I don't know actually)Yeah, but Relativity was, um, kind of a big deal. As is the Nobel prize. From Wikipedia (yeah, not the most reliable resource, but still):

However, in May 1919, a team led by the British astronomer Arthur Stanley Eddington claimed to have confirmed Einstein's prediction of gravitational deflection of starlight by the Sun while photographing a solar eclipse with dual expeditions in Sobral, northern Brazil, and Príncipe, a west African island. Nobel laureate Max Born praised general relativity as the "greatest feat of human thinking about nature"; fellow laureate Paul Dirac was quoted saying it was "probably the greatest scientific discovery ever made". The international media guaranteed Einstein's global renown.

Anyway, how many people actually ask about or hear Einstein's name in 1931? Just Young Doc and Edna, right? And Young Doc assumes it's because Marty's a patent officer. So, we're really just asking why Edna doesn't care about the dog's name.

[Farlander]

So, we're really just asking why Edna doesn't care about the dog's name.

Would you care about the name of the dog that tried to bite your ass off? Or you would care more about the 'bite' aspect of the question? :)

[markeres]

Would you care about the name of the dog that tried to bite your ass off?Nope. :D

[Farlander]

Nope. :D

:D Case closed :) No reason for anyone to care about Einstein's name :p

[sethf11]

The second problem isn't as big and can probably be explained easily. At the end of the game Marty finds himself fading away, meaning something must've happened to Arthur. If Marty had never gone into the past, then wouldn't Emmet have still delivered the subpoena to Arty who would have then still testified against Tannen? But they delivered it anyway. My only explanation is that without Marty's help, Emmet was never able to deliver the subpoena to Arty, who then never testified and never got himself (possibly) killed by Tannen.

Does anyone have an explanation or a better one?

I was thinking about this one and maybe this is the main focus of all the events. Since the subpoena was served, Artie had to testify against Tannen and was subsequently killed, resulted in Marty not being born. Because Doc was able to serve the subpoena, Doc became a powerful lawyer and gained fame and money resulting in First Citizen Brown.

Maybe now Tannen gets locked up for stealing the Police Truck and goes after Marty for saving the Doc and the manure incident.

[Rade88]

Because Doc was able to serve the subpoena, Doc became a powerful lawyer and gained fame and money resulting in First Citizen Brown.


I don't think he would become a lawyer because of that. After serving the subpoena he still went home and argued with his father about being a lawyer, so he still wants to be a scientist.

I think we can pretty much guess what happens with Arty, but there's still no explanation for what caused Tannen to take the police van with Doc in and try to kill him out on the road, rather than in front of the courthouse like what originally happened.

[prizna]

The way I see it, The reason Doc will no longer become a scientist is he got really excited when he thought his patent was going to be passed, and after Marty admitted he wasn't from the patent office, Docs hopes dropped (after all you could see he was really disapointed) and thought that he will never become a scientist and chose not to follow it.

[Carlos85G]

Continuity error (Or as I see it...)

Edna wrote for the newspaper, "Hill Valley Telegraph", the name of the newspaper can be seen in the movies -besides the USA Today local version in 2015- and on Edna's apartment when Marty checks for Doc's "whenabouts", but in 1931, Edna says she works for the "Hill Valley Herald"; Isn't this a mistake?...

[Jennifer]

Continuity error (Or as I see it...)

Edna wrote for the newspaper, "Hill Valley Telegraph", the name of the newspaper can be seen in the movies -besides the USA Today local version in 2015- and on Edna's apartment when Marty checks for Doc's "whenabouts", but in 1931, Edna says she works for the "Hill Valley Herald"; Isn't this a mistake?...
Newspapers often changed names in the early 20th century, as the companies were sold to other companies. Our local newspaper changed to it's current name in 1907 due to a merger between two companies.

So, the Hill Valley Harold and Hill Valley Telegraph are most likely the same paper, just under a different name as the parent company changed. :)

[Carlos85G]

Yes, but the newspaper has been named like that since 1885 or before, as BTTF3 shows Telegraph papers, and the name has to change for the next day (June 14th, 1931), as the newspaper that has the news of "Carl Sagan" killed is the "Hill Valley Telegraph", not "Hill Valley Herald".

And I do really hope that they explain why there are no gargoyles on the ClockTower (or why the ledge is too large, by the way :p)

[alorion]

****SPOILERS****


So don't flame me if I'm wrong, but...

Edna's apartment is across the road from the video store/speakeasy. However, when Marty goes to Arthur's apartment in 1931, which is the same apartment as Edna's, it isn't across the road from the speakeasy/video store, but well away from Courthouse Square.

Also, if Edna's aparment was across the road from the video store/speakeasy, that puts it on the park in the centre of Courhouse Square, and there aren't any buildings there in 1986...

Am I missing something?

[Teeth]

It wasn't across the road, her binoculars are powerful.

[alorion]

Ahh, so it was right across the other side of the square... However, that doesn't explain how we can see very close buildings from her window without the binoculars.

[markeres]

However, that doesn't explain how we can see very close buildings from her window without the binoculars.New buildings built since 1931?

[BlankCanvasDJ]

Edna's binoculars are powerful enough that she can spy on most of the town from that second story window. If her apartment were located, say, on a street behind and to a side of the courthouse, she'd be able to see past some buildings and across the square to the video store.

Also...it's a videogame ;)

[gufino2]

Am I overlooking some details, or is it quite strange for a 1931 paddywagon to have an antenna? :confused:

What use could it possibly have? There were no radio in cars back then, AFAIK...

I know this is a game about time travels, but this seems illogical to me, unless it is explained in one of the next episodes...

[Laserschwert]

I would think that ESPECIALLY a police car would have some sort of radio onboard... but well, okay, maybe not in '31

[Guinea]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Car_audio#1930s

[Vainamoinen]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Car_audio#1930s

Wrong kind of radio, sorry. ;)

[Guinea]

Wrong kind of radio, sorry. ;)

I guess I should have read the article before posting ;_;

[Jennifer]

Am I overlooking some details, or is it quite strange for a 1931 paddywagon to have an antenna? :confused:

What use could it possibly have? There were no radio in cars back then, AFAIK...
Motorola (http://www.motorola.com/web/Business/Corporate/US-EN/history/feature-police-radio.html) made a car radio system in 1930 that was intended for general public use, but police departments and city governments across the United States ordered the radios for public safety use. The radios were adapted for police use, and the first Motorola police radios were sold beginning in November 1930.

Yes, but the newspaper has been named like that since 1885 or before, as BTTF3 shows Telegraph papers, and the name has to change for the next day (June 14th, 1931), as the newspaper that has the news of "Carl Sagan" killed is the "Hill Valley Telegraph", not "Hill Valley Herald".
Nice catch, and good memory retention. :) I didn't notice the Hill Valley Telegraph name on the 1931 newspaper. :D

It's also possible she writes for more than one paper. She has trophies for writing cat articles in her room in 1986. She also could have written for the Hill Valley Herald but sold the article freelance to the presumably larger Hill Valley Telegraph because of how huge of an impact it had on the town of Hill Valley.

[Shadowknight1]

It's also possible she writes for more than one paper. She has trophies for writing cat articles in her room in 1986. She also could have written for the Hill Valley Herald but sold the article freelance to the presumably larger Hill Valley Telegraph because of how huge of an impact it had on the town of Hill Valley.

That's what I thought.

Again, my only real continuity problem is with Biff not noticing the DeLorean. And don't say he'd dismiss it as a "pimped out DeLorean" when he saw it take off and fly away.

As for Doc being moved? That's easy. When Marty was reading the paper out loud, it said that the gangsters removed Doc from his cell at night and apparently dragged him to the courthouse steps and pumped him full of lead. What probably happened was Kid wanted it to seem less like the mob was involved, especially since Arthur got the subpoena.

[Nintendo Boy1]

Also when Marty goes downtown is it responsible to leave the DeLorean unattended like that?

He's done it before, but it back fired in the second movie, when Old Biff used it to give his younger self the Sport's Almanac. So we might see a simillar thing happen in the upcoming episodes.

[markeres]

Again, my only real continuity problem is with Biff not noticing the DeLorean. And don't say he'd dismiss it as a "pimped out DeLorean" when he saw it take off and fly away.When the DeLorean first appeared, Biff was still unconscious. When Marty returns to the DeLorean to go to 1931, Biff was either still in town after getting the video, or back at his house. If Biff did notice the DeLorean, it would have been off-camera and while Marty was looking for/talking to Edna.

[Shadowknight1]

When the DeLorean first appeared, Biff was still unconscious. When Marty returns to the DeLorean to go to 1931, Biff was either still in town after getting the video, or back at his house. If Biff did notice the DeLorean, it would have been off-camera and while Marty was looking for/talking to Edna.

Exactly. He would've left Doc's lab to go to the video store and would've seen the DeLorean.

[sVybDy]

Here are some I've been pondering.

(1) The ARS in the DeLorean seems to be capable of things that the DeLorean itself has never been capable of. I presume this is all covered under the added "bells and whistles" Doc mentions, but it's fun to postulate about anyways.

In any case, the ARS must be capable of sending the DeLorean through time without needing the car to accelerate to 88 MPH, or else the car was capable of driving itself. In the latter case, it would be a danger to everything around it (unless it has some kind of intelligent sensor to avoid collisions) and there would be a risk of it being seen by someone, potentially altering the future.

Also, it seems as though the DeLorean can now travel to specific places as well as specific points in time. Of course, the DeLorean was able to do so in the cartoon, but that is obviously considered non-canon, so this is another new development. The alternative is that Doc left the DeLorean parked in his future driveway, which might be possible since Lyon Estates was just being built in 1955. In 1931 it would have been even less developed (though it might've been farmland.)

(2) Since we don't know the exact point in time when the ARS kicked in, bringing the DeLorean and Einstein to 1986, there is a possibility that there are two DeLoreans and two Einsteins in 1931 when Marty arrives. There is also a possibility that there isn't, of course. But if Doc only got tossed in prison the night before Marty arrived (not 100% sure about that, going from memory here) then he had the ARS set to kick in less than 24 hours after his last exit from the DeLorean.

(3) Given that Einstein was in the DeLorean, that means that Doc left him there while he went to go watch what happened at the speakeasy. Since Doc admittedly forgot about the ARS, that means upon capture, he fully planned on leaving poor Einstein locked in the DeLorean until after he was let out of jail. That's approximately 36 hours locked in a car, in California, with no food or drink. Granted, Doc has few options ("Gee officer, there is a problem here. You see, I'm a time traveler and my dog is locked in my futuristic vehicle. Could you go let him out and be careful not to destroy the space-time continuum while you're at it?") Still, poor Einie!

(4) In order to get Arthur McFly to come out of the safehouse, Marty uses his tape-recording of Kid Tannen's voice in plain view of young Emmett. The technology for portable cassette tape recorders was first realized in the 1950s, although they were not successfully marketed until the early 1960s. Emmett should have been very, very interested in Marty's magic talking box. After all, remember how fascinated 1955 Doc was by Marty's camcorder?

[PrivateJoker]

How about in BTTF 1 when Doc flys away in the Dolearn (carelessly) and Biff sees the flying Delorean. So when he sees him in BTTF2 he knows whats up and steals the time machine. According to Doc Griff is up to somthing in the future, so a lot is on the table, and I won't be surprised if Doc has to sacrifice himself by the end of the game.

[Mino_Dan]

With what? Magic? Best not to think about it :)

What are you talking about? The car keys have to be in the Delorean. Otherwise Marty wouldn't be able to drive the car at all.

[Jennifer]

That's what I thought.

Again, my only real continuity problem is with Biff not noticing the DeLorean. And don't say he'd dismiss it as a "pimped out DeLorean" when he saw it take off and fly away.
We don't see if he noticed it or not, so I wouldn't call that a continuity error, especially when we don't know the rest of the story yet. :) He was passed out when the DeLorean first arrived at Doc's.

He most certainly saw it when he left Doc's, but George was there watching Biff so I'm sure he kept him from messing with the car.

We do see Biff exiting the video store with a tape in his hand, so that's got to be foreshadowing something.

[PrivateJoker]

Biff was renting a dirty movie. Edna points that out.

[markeres]

The alternative is that Doc left the DeLorean parked in his future driveway, which might be possible since Lyon Estates was just being built in 1955. In 1931 it would have been even less developed (though it might've been farmland.)Minor point, but Doc doesn't live in Lyon Estates in 1986, he lives on the other side of town, in his lab/garage. It's never really made clear if Doc's garage is in the same place in 1985 as it is in 1955 (i.e. if "Riverside Drive" is the same thing as "John F. Kennedy Drive"), but if it is, it's unlikely Doc would leave the DeLorean in his own driveway in 1931. If he hid it behind the "Car of the Future" sign like Marty does, that means the DeLorean left before June 13.

But if Doc only got tossed in prison the night before Marty arrived (not 100% sure about that, going from memory here) then he had the ARS set to kick in less than 24 hours after his last exit from the DeLorean.Doc says he's been in prison for a couple weeks.

(3) Given that Einstein was in the DeLorean, that means that Doc left him there while he went to go watch what happened at the speakeasy. Since Doc admittedly forgot about the ARS, that means upon capture, he fully planned on leaving poor Einstein locked in the DeLorean until after he was let out of jail. That's approximately 36 hours locked in a car, in California, with no food or drink. Granted, Doc has few options ("Gee officer, there is a problem here. You see, I'm a time traveler and my dog is locked in my futuristic vehicle. Could you go let him out and be careful not to destroy the space-time continuum while you're at it?") Still, poor Einie!I think it's most likely that one of the "bells and whistles" was an automatic door opener/closer for Einstein. Once Doc was in jail, Einstein had to get in and out of the DeLorean somehow to get Edna's shoe and get back to 1986.

(4) In order to get Arthur McFly to come out of the safehouse, Marty uses his tape-recording of Kid Tannen's voice in plain view of young Emmett. The technology for portable cassette tape recorders was first realized in the 1950s, although they were not successfully marketed until the early 1960s. Emmett should have been very, very interested in Marty's magic talking box. After all, remember how fascinated 1955 Doc was by Marty's camcorder?There is a short dialogue between Emmett and Marty about the tape recorder. I think you can trigger it by using the tape recorder on Emmett after the scene where you have to record his muttering. Young Doc asks what it is, and Marty says it's something they're looking at at the patent office.

[Carlos85G]

It's never really made clear if Doc's garage is in the same place in 1985 as it is in 1955 (i.e. if "Riverside Drive" is the same thing as "John F. Kennedy Drive").

I had a debate about that point with other BTTF:HV mod members about Doc's garage being on the same street as his former house, trying to figure out if the garage was moved to other place (Doc's house has number "1640" in 1955 and "1646" in 1985); but then, I found the answer in the least expected place: Doc's keychain. If you freeze the frame when Marty turns the ignition key in the DeLorean, you'll clearly see that says "1646 JFK Drive". So, the garage is just some spaces away from the Brown Mansion's original place on the same street.

[Krohn]

Here are some I've been pondering.

(1) The ARS in the DeLorean seems to be capable of things that the DeLorean itself has never been capable of. I presume this is all covered under the added "bells and whistles" Doc mentions, but it's fun to postulate about anyways.

In any case, the ARS must be capable of sending the DeLorean through time without needing the car to accelerate to 88 MPH, or else the car was capable of driving itself. In the latter case, it would be a danger to everything around it (unless it has some kind of intelligent sensor to avoid collisions) and there would be a risk of it being seen by someone, potentially altering the future.

Also, it seems as though the DeLorean can now travel to specific places as well as specific points in time. Of course, the DeLorean was able to do so in the cartoon, but that is obviously considered non-canon, so this is another new development. The alternative is that Doc left the DeLorean parked in his future driveway, which might be possible since Lyon Estates was just being built in 1955. In 1931 it would have been even less developed (though it might've been farmland.)...

As we already have tests with self driving cars on public roads today, I would assume that by 2025 the technology was perfected, so it is very likely doc integrated that.
(Well, probably self flying)

And for getting to a specific location, what would stop the DeLorean from just flying where it needs to go and then land directly after the time jump?
(Note that this is a DeLorean fixed in the 2020's, so it is most likely a lot more advanced than it was during BTTF II )

[markeres]

If you freeze the frame when Marty turns the ignition key in the DeLorean, you'll clearly see that says "1646 JFK Drive". So, the garage is just some spaces away from the Brown Mansion's original place on the same street.Man, the production crew on those movies thought of absolutely everything, didn't they? As Doc would say: "Unbelievable".

[Carlos85G]

Indeed.

Watching it again, I couldn't read the number, but "JFK Dr" is definitively written there.

You can see it here if you skip to 1:06 (Terribly sorry for the video, but it's the only one I could find with enough resolution to distinguish and Outatime.it isn't working): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ngYwlwxMWwM

[Irishmile]

We have to remember while playing the first episode that there IS somewhere another Marty running around setting the time-line right..... all while trying hard not to be seen by us in the first ep....

[markeres]

We have to remember while playing the first episode that there IS somewhere another Marty running around setting the time-line right..... all while trying hard not to be seen by us in the first ep....Nope. Because Marty going back to 1931 again hasn't happened yet. It's like when Marty goes back to 1955 again in BTTFII. That second Marty wasn't there in the first BTTF.

[Baliame]

So Arthur getting the subpoena almost immediately affected Marty, however why doesn't Doc know about his teenage interactions with Marty?

[Shadowknight1]

So Arthur getting the subpoena almost immediately affected Marty, however why doesn't Doc know about his teenage interactions with Marty?

The same reason that he didn't know about the DeLorean getting struck by lightning and getting sent back to 1885 even though Marty told 1955 Doc. The story dictated it.

[roycejunktion]

i just did some searching on the threads for a topic about this.... came up with nothing.... but does anyone have a theory about the beginning of the game?

where the Delorean doesn't reappear?

how do you figure that will play out?

[redfish]

The same reason that he didn't know about the DeLorean getting struck by lightning and getting sent back to 1885 even though Marty told 1955 Doc. The story dictated it.

More like, its the same reason that Marty didn't know that when he returned to 86 the future would be controlled by Biff making money through the almanac. That's the way time travel works in the series, you aren't cognizant of the changes you're making to your own timeline.

His grandfather getting the subpoena didn't affect Marty or Doc Brown's knowledge of the future, it just affected his existence.

[markeres]

i just did some searching on the threads for a topic about this.... came up with nothing.... but does anyone have a theory about the beginning of the game?

where the Delorean doesn't reappear?

how do you figure that will play out?It's a dream. Just a dream. Maybe some foreshadowing of things that will play out in later episodes, but nothing in the dream actually happened (from the point the DeLorean fails to reappear on).

[speederice]

It's kind of a dead subject, I don't think that Marty's actions in this episode have led to Young Emmett being disillusioned with science. If that were the case, wouldn't that lead to the DeLorean disappearing instead of Marty? Because a disillusioned Doc, who never becomes a scientist, would not create a time machine in the first place.

[markeres]

Because a disillusioned Doc, who never becomes a scientist, would not create a time machine in the first place.Something further will happen in episode 2 that will lead to this happening, if you read the description for episode 3. Or else, you'll have to find out in episode 3 why those changes have taken place.

[serializer]

The main inconsistency I found was this:

When Marty finds Doc in jail, he says something like "why don't I just travel back to before they arrested you, and stop you being near the speakeasy". Doc replies, "that would mean the events that led to you finding out about me being here would never happen, catastrophic end of world etc."

BUT surely saving Doc from jail *by any means* would produce the same result, as the paper would still never have run the story about Carl Sagan getting killed, so Marty would never be able to find out where in time Doc was?

[Falanca]

The main inconsistency I found was this:

When Marty finds Doc in jail, he says something like "why don't I just travel back to before they arrested you, and stop you being near the speakeasy". Doc replies, "that would mean the events that led to you finding out about me being here would never happen, catastrophic end of world etc."

BUT surely saving Doc from jail *by any means* would produce the same result, as the paper would still never have run the story about Carl Sagan getting killed, so Marty would never be able to find out where in time Doc was?

Well, my reasoning on this one is that he learns it from Doc that he was framed of burning the speakeasy. So if he goes back some days and save him then he wouldn't be able to learn it 5 days later. At least this simple logic made me turn from "Wth that does not make sense" to "err... oh welll".

Saving him would cause paradox? Yes. But that's what they always do. I guess just following newspapers does not do a damn thing but when actually someone talks to you, OH BOY you're screwed.

[Jennifer]

The main inconsistency I found was this:

When Marty finds Doc in jail, he says something like "why don't I just travel back to before they arrested you, and stop you being near the speakeasy". Doc replies, "that would mean the events that led to you finding out about me being here would never happen, catastrophic end of world etc."

BUT surely saving Doc from jail *by any means* would produce the same result, as the paper would still never have run the story about Carl Sagan getting killed, so Marty would never be able to find out where in time Doc was?
The paper would have changed to "Carl Sagan escaped from prison", so Marty would still have known to have gone the day before to find Doc. I'd imagine Marty would think it odd that Doc escaped but wasn't in the DeLorean, so he went back to find out why. If he went back any time before one day in either time line, the paper wouldn't print the article on that day and he'd create a paradox, so he'd always go back to the same day.

[serializer]

The paper would have changed to "Carl Sagan escaped from prison", so Marty would still have known to have gone the day before to find Doc. I'd imagine Marty would think it odd that Doc escaped but wasn't in the DeLorean, so he went back to find out why. If he went back any time before one day in either time line, the paper wouldn't print the article on that day and he'd create a paradox, so he'd always go back to the same day.

Not exactly ... Marty wouldn't have known Doc was in trouble, so he'd never have looked at the papers, therefore never have seen the Carl Sagan story to know he had to go back in time.

However you save someone, it creates the paradox. To say that one way of saving him fixes it and one doesn't is crazy when you think about the time stream consequences!

[Jennifer]

Not exactly ... Marty wouldn't have known Doc was in trouble, so he'd never have looked at the papers, therefore never have seen the Carl Sagan story to know he had to go back in time.

However you save someone, it creates the paradox. To say that one way of saving him fixes it and one doesn't is crazy when you think about the time stream consequences!
The time machine went to 1986 because Doc was in prison for too long (he'd been in prison for a week by the time Marty got there). Marty knew Doc was in trouble because the time machine was empty. The time machine would still be empty in the changed time line since Marty freed Doc after the time machine already went to the future, so he'd still check the papers.

[serializer]

The time machine went to 1986 because Doc was in prison for too long (he'd been in prison for a week by the time Marty got there). Marty knew Doc was in trouble because the time machine was empty. The time machine would still be empty in the changed time line since Marty freed Doc after the time machine already went to the future, so he'd still check the papers.

So then, to save Doc all we had to do was go back to before he was arrested, stop him getting arrested, then manually send Doc's Delorean forward to 1986 for Marty to find it and maintain the timeline. Oh, and fix whatever was wrong with the date display so he'd never have to deal with that irritating Strickland woman.

Paradox resolved!

[Jennifer]

So then, to save Doc all we had to do was go back to before he was arrested, stop him getting arrested, then manually send Doc's Delorean forward to 1986 for Marty to find it and maintain the timeline. Oh, and fix whatever was wrong with the date display so he'd never have to deal with that irritating Strickland woman.

Paradox resolved!
As you said, you'd have to fix the time display because otherwise Marty wouldn't know where to go. And considering the time display has been acting up since Back to the Future Part II and is still acting up now even after the Doc had time to repair it, it doesn't seem like it's reliable enough to be counted on to prevent a paradox.

[serializer]

As you said, you'd have to fix the time display because otherwise Marty wouldn't know where to go. And considering the time display has been acting up since Back to the Future Part II and is still acting up now even after the Doc had time to repair it, it doesn't seem like it's reliable enough to be counted on to prevent a paradox.

You could just record a bit extra on the dictaphone to tell Marty when to travel back to. Or leave a sticky note. Point is, there are a whole bunch of ways to resolve the paradox that don't involve first messing with Emmet's own past and then busting a great big hole in the wall of the town jail (both of which actions are *surely* gonna create huge ripples...)

Obviously somewhere along the line we have to ignore one of these possibilities so the game can actually have a story, but my feeling is that the setup could have been just a teensy bit better.

[Farlander]

No offence to you guys, but you're arguing over an (considering the way time travel in BttF works) an unresolvable paradox. BttF original movies are filled with these paradoxes. Like the famous BttF3 tombstone paradox (if the tombstone is destroyed and nobody dies, Marty doesn't have a reason to return to 1885), or Marty being in 1955 even though in the new 1985A Doc would never invent a Time Machine and Marty would never go to 1955, or the fact that with Marty's future changed at the end of BttF3 movies, effectively the whole two sequels would have never occurred (with Marty's future being different, there would be no reason for Doc to come back to Marty to save his kids in the first place).

Those are all unresolvable paradoxes, but there are some things in BttF time travel to make things more consistent. I'm not talking about the ripple effect only, if we take 1955: there will be forever two Martys, two Docs and two Biffs in 1955, even though, even though there is no reason for second Marty/Docs to be there anymore and the Old Biff in 1955 is the only thing that is left of the Old Biff from the timeline with original 2015. So things in the past are implanted as they are, unless you change everything even from a further point in the past (like what we'll do in 1931, creating the 1986A, will effectively cancel out most, if not all, things that happened inbetween 1931 and 1986, and, well, further away in the future).

It's a time travel story. Time travel means paradox. They're kind of symbiotic things - one can't exist without another (Unless it's a one-way time travel to the future, I guess). And whatever idea you think that 'eliminates' a paradox - it's not that way. There still is at least one detail which still makes it retain the 'paradox' factor.

So let's embrace these paradoxes and enjoy them for the fact that they're not illogical and, at the least, consistent with each other.

PS. Not to mention that Doc's theories about the destruction of the universe already have been proven wrong on several occasions, but Doc still likes to be on the safer side.

[serializer]

So let's embrace these paradoxes and enjoy them for the fact that they're not illogical and, at the least, consistent with each other.


No! Telltale must do their research properly. Including building a working time machine themselves, and travelling around history tinkering with things to find out exactly what causes a paradox and what doesn't. Only then are they qualified to make a time travel game!

[Farlander]

No! Telltale must do their research properly. Including building a working time machine themselves, and travelling around history tinkering with things to find out exactly what causes a paradox and what doesn't. Only then are they qualified to make a time travel game!

How do you know that they didn't? :p I mean, after all, being a part of time travellers' surroundings, how would you notice the difference? :p

[Jennifer]

No offence to you guys, but you're arguing over an (considering the way time travel in BttF works) an unresolvable paradox. BttF original movies are filled with these paradoxes. Like the famous BttF3 tombstone paradox (if the tombstone is destroyed and nobody dies, Marty doesn't have a reason to return to 1885), or Marty being in 1955 even though in the new 1985A Doc would never invent a Time Machine and Marty would never go to 1955, or the fact that with Marty's future changed at the end of BttF3 movies, effectively the whole two sequels would have never occurred (with Marty's future being different, there would be no reason for Doc to come back to Marty to save his kids in the first place).
It shows that Telltale is putting a lot more thought into the story than the writers of the sequels did, since Doc never worried about their actions in fixing the problems making paradoxes in the films. :)

[Farlander]

It shows that Telltale is putting a lot more thought into the story than the writers of the sequels did, since Doc never worried about their actions in fixing the problems making paradoxes in the films.

Not true. Doc DID worry to NOT get the almanac BEFORE Old Biff gives it to his younger self and returns to the future (however that works), Doc DID worry to send Marty the day AFTER his 1885 self wrote the letter (you know, things that would possibly cause paradoxes), and that's from the top of my head, Doc DID worry about paradoxes in the movies. And tried to avoid them. And basically the way he tried to avoid them in TT games (well, game, so far) is no different than the way he tried to avoid them in the movies - by not doing the stuff that would cause the biggest paradox. The thing is. It's time travel. Time travel means paradoxes. Especially time travel which allows to travel in any point past and future and change the events of the future from the particular point of time you're in. Paradoxes are there in the movies. They are here in the games. There's nothing we can do about it, because it's how time travel works.

See? Paradox.

[Jennifer]

Not true. Doc DID worry to NOT get the almanac BEFORE Old Biff gives it to his younger self and returns to the future (however that works), Doc DID worry to send Marty the day AFTER his 1885 self wrote the letter (you know, things that would possibly cause paradoxes), and that's from the top of my head, Doc DID worry about paradoxes in the movies.
Your post about Doc always being careful about paradoxes made me think of something. Excuse me while I put my nerd cap on again, because I love thinking of ways that would make things that seem like plotholes in stuff make sense. :)

In Back to the Future III, as you said, nobody dies so the tombstone in the picture disappears. So, it would seem that Marty took a picture of just grass in 1955, which wouldn't make sense. And, without the tombstone he wouldn't go from 1955 to 1885 at all. But I was thinking that since the Doc would be worried about creating a paradox, it would make sense that he put the tombstone saying that he died up at the end of the events of the third movie. It would explain why the photograph of the grass was still there at the end of the movie rather than the whole picture disappearing (since time was still being written). And it would fit with how the town viewed Emmett in 1885. It would be strange for a man to put up a tombstone saying they had died when they hadn't, but the Doc was so eccentric, they'd probably just shrug it off.

As for Marty being in 1955 even though 1985A Doc hadn't invented a time machine, this was explained in the movie by the Doc. Since they came from an alternate timeline, they were not effected by the changes in time. It was further explained in the bonus features of the DVD. Changes in time create a ripple effect. Doc and Marty can exist by rules of the original timeline for as long as it takes for the ripple to hit them. So, by the ripple in time rule, there would now be only one Doc and one Marty in 1955, and no old Biff in 1955, since they came from the alternate reality that was changed by Marty and Doc in Back to the Future Part II, and the ripple would definitely have caught up with them by now.

[Farlander]

Ah, the ripple effect... a.k.a. convenience effect. Because it's used to explain paradoxes, and that can't but help to think that ripple effect goes in (or doesn't) when it's convenient for the plot at a speed which is convenient for a plot, and that's why I don't like the ripple effect explanations. Well, most of them. Besides, the ripple effect doesn't explain the second 1955 travel. With 1985A, there would be no future from which Biff could still the almanac and go back in time to give it to himself. With 1985A Marty would never could go back in time (I mean original Marty), so the second Marty would not meet his other self. But, hey, it's how time travel works in BttF - the past becomes implanted in history even if the future is changed.

And about your explanation: it's kinda sketchy. The main reason: the end of BttF3. As I said, it cancels out everything that happened in the two movies. Different future = no Biff going back with the almanac (and stealing everything) = no Doc getting stranded in 1885 = no Marty seeing the tombstone = total time paradox. Not to mention that Doc from 1955 doesn't know anything about the future bar the fact that he's kinda supposed to die (and that Marty gets in 1955 again), and that's not enough information to try to recreate something.

[Jennifer]

And about your explanation: it's kinda sketchy. The main reason: the end of BttF3. As I said, it cancels out everything that happened in the two movies. Different future = no Biff going back with the almanac (and stealing everything) = no Doc getting stranded in 1885 = no Marty seeing the tombstone = total time paradox. Not to mention that Doc from 1955 doesn't know anything about the future bar the fact that he's kinda supposed to die (and that Marty gets in 1955 again), and that's not enough information to try to recreate something.
Just because Marty's future was changed doesn't mean the events leading up to his son getting involved with Griff were changed. Marty and Jennifer might not live in the same run-down neighborhood, but considering how important Hill Valley is to their pasts and futures, I'm sure they'll still live in the same town. And considering how hung up on Lorraine Biff still is in 2015, and how jealous he still is of George, I'm sure he's told Griff (and Tiff, who probably also talked about it to Griff) all about his rivalry with the McFlys. Which is likely the reason that Griff was so awful to Marty Jr. in Back to the Future Part II.

And, since Doc is so worried about creating paradoxes, he's likely going to be there to remind Marty in 2015 that the events have to take place, and that everything will work out OK.

[markeres]

And about your explanation: it's kinda sketchy. The main reason: the end of BttF3. As I said, it cancels out everything that happened in the two movies. Different future = no Biff going back with the almanac (and stealing everything) = no Doc getting stranded in 1885 = no Marty seeing the tombstone = total time paradox. Not to mention that Doc from 1955 doesn't know anything about the future bar the fact that he's kinda supposed to die (and that Marty gets in 1955 again), and that's not enough information to try to recreate something.What about the whole "past becomes implanted in history even if the future is changed" thing?

[Farlander]

What about the whole "past becomes implanted in history even if the future is changed" thing?

That's my point. That's a paradox that kind of defends the timeline from other paradoxes (the ones that I mentioned in the message you've quoted).

[fabry20]

How come that the same Biff who submissivly washes Marty's pickup, saying "Here's your key, Marty" sporting the biggest and humblest smile and then again acts as the most subdued man on earth, telling him he washed Marty's car twice and making positive comments on his cowboy attire, all of a sudden turns into a jerk, calls Marty butthead, kicks him off when he's trying to play the jukebox and answers harshly to EVERY GODDAMN THING Marty says?

[Origami]

^
Because it's obvious Biff never changed. It was just a mask. He is still the bully he has always been. The game just establishes that Biff drops his mask as soon as George is not around.

[Zamot]

I though it was somewhat unexpected at first, but the more I think about it the more it makes sense. He still does whatever George tells him and it's not like his whole personality changed just because the he and George switched places in hierarchy. He's still a jerk and a bully, it's just that now he has no power.

[Falanca]

He's still raised that way. It's not like he's going to completely forget his entire highschool life as a bully. But if your life is pathetic and you have one way to make your living, you start licking some boots. It does not mean he became a good guy at the end of the first movie (if he did, old Biff wouldn't have done those things in the second movie).

[Shadowknight1]

He's still raised that way. It's not like he's going to completely forget his entire highschool life as a bully. But if your life is pathetic and you have one way to make your living, you start licking some boots. It does not mean he became a good guy at the end of the first movie (if he did, old Biff wouldn't have done those things in the second movie).

Precisely. And for another thing, Biff was getting paid to wax Marty's truck. He wasn't gonna jeopardize a paycheck by being a prick to Marty. At the sale at Doc's, he's not there to earn money, he's there to by some of Doc's stuff. Therefore, unless George rags on him, Biff's gonna be a jerk. And remember, 1985 "good" Biff DID call Marty a butthead. Sure it was because Biff didn't recognize him, but it did show that Biff hasn't changed.

[redfish]

I think Biff feels humiliated that George has more money than him and is married to the girl he wanted to marry himself. Not able to pick on George, because he wants to suck up to him, he's getting his frustration out on his son, Marty.

[Grunty]

I got the impression that as kid growing up, Biff realized George McFly was the one person too weak to ever stand up to him so he bullied him big time........plus its a Tannen tradition to pick on a McFly lol. When George, biggest wuss in Hill Valley since his old man, finally stands up to Biff and slug him good Biff becomes the town joke. The McFly's are probably one of his few customers, at least his biggest paying customers, which they probably just do to humilate Biff even more..........that may seem harsh, but remember he bullied George all their childhood and he tried to rape Lorraine once.

Biff will always be Biff. He hates the McFly's but is afraid of George. Also like how he gets smarter when he gets older

Teenage Biff: stupid idiot that needs help tying his shoes but has his scary malevolent moments.

Middle Aged Biff: Sorta intelligent and knows how to run a business.

Elderly Biff: Evil twisted mastermind, only his 1986A self is anywhere near as intelligent and sadistic.

[Falanca]

Well, he didn't really pick on Marty at the end of the first movie but I wouldn't say it's a wise choice to bully your boss' son because of some grudges you hold onto. And in the game, he doesn't really pick on Marty, he's just enthusiastic yet he lacks manners. So he has to be warned by George each time he pushes the line, which he oftenly does.

[pheonix_102]

I played through the game, but I don't understand the intro. I understand the Delorean was duplicated, but why, in front of twin pines mall, did the Delorean not reappear? What got messed up?

[Farlander]

I played through the game, but I don't understand the intro. I understand the Delorean was duplicated, but why, in front of twin pines mall, did the Delorean not reappear? What got messed up?

Uhm... the intro was a dream.

[Andorxor]

Or it was something else that will be resolved later.We will know for sure when the season ends.

[Farlander]

Or it was something else that will be resolved later.We will know for sure when the season ends.

It may be a foreshadowing of things to come (well, it most likely is), but it's stated pretty much straight away (and straightforwardly) that the intro sequence itself was a dream.

[pheonix_102]

It just didn't seem like a dream. I know he wakes up right after, but it still seemed important. I just thought the car goes through time with einstein in it, and then, later, at Doc's house, the car shows up with einstein. My first thought was an alternate timeline or something. i guess I was looking too far into it.

[BrendanK]

I thought it was put in to quickly establish a back story and existence of the time machine, for those who may not be as familiar to the films. This way the story of the game holds up on it's own without requiring the player to have seen/followed the movies.
It also shows that the story of the game is going to "sway" from the story of the movies.

[Cyphox]

It just didn't seem like a dream. I know he wakes up right after, but it still seemed important. I just thought the car goes through time with einstein in it, and then, later, at Doc's house, the car shows up with einstein. My first thought was an alternate timeline or something. i guess I was looking too far into it.

i thougt about this too, but it just doesnt make sense at all. or does it? we'll find out in the next episodes....

[Zamot]

Not a big thing, but I find it odd that Doc would risk going back to a time when his younger self is around, just for the nostalgia and getting his wife books for her birthday. It doesn't really fit in with what he said about the dangers of time travel and using it for personal gain. But then again, if he hadn't, we wouldn't have had this story which started out great. So I'm not complaining.

[Carlos85G]

Doc was O.K. with Time Travel again since he built another time machine and has become more responsible from the time Marty went back to 1985 and Doc married Clara. So, really not out of character, but character development.

[Shadowknight1]

It just didn't seem like a dream. I know he wakes up right after, but it still seemed important. I just thought the car goes through time with einstein in it, and then, later, at Doc's house, the car shows up with einstein. My first thought was an alternate timeline or something. i guess I was looking too far into it.

You're supposed to read too much into it. It's what we refer to as a "red herring." ;)

[Cyphox]

thats too weird to even think about it (or is it not)

where does the shoe and the tape come from?

thats how the story went, and its insane:

eini travelled back to 1931 by accident. he found his owner (doc from another timeline) which was just visiting the same time period by coincidence and stayed with him. then, when the building burnt down, eini realized that his owner is in trouble, and because he's such a smart dog and because he knows the time cuircuits display is f*ucked up, he stole the shoe and went back into the delorean, just in time for the homecoming device to be activated and bring him back to 1986 to help marty finding the owner of the shoe. such a smart doggie.

and thats also the reason the 1985's doc dissappears, BECAUSE after the events of back to the future the game doc, marty and einstein that are in 1931 travel back to a time BEFORE the first testing of the time machine and prevent all this time machine stuff from ever happening and THATS why the 1985's doc dissappears and marty's "dream" ends the way it ends....

*brainexplodes*

[Bravo]

One thing that I find interesting:

The delorean pops out in 1931 in the middle of a car chase where the villains get away. Perhaps the cops should have caught the villains at that point and this is the Marty disappearing paradox.

[Shadowknight1]

One thing that I find interesting:

The delorean pops out in 1931 in the middle of a car chase where the villains get away. Perhaps the cops should have caught the villains at that point and this is the Marty disappearing paradox.

Actually, I think that's what happened. At least one of those guys should have been caught, there would've been no need to subpoena Artie, and Kid would've still gone to jail.

[rembem]

Continuity error: Whe you have done everything except subpoena Arthur, it's 4:20 according to the clock tower. When you then subpoena him you get a cut scene where it's 4:00.

[Origami]

But it's the goof that is easily overlooked and probably happened in a lot of movies.

When Marty arrives in 1931 and gets caught up in a police chase the DeLorean drives around 70 mph....and so do the other two 1931 cars!
But back then cars weren't able to go that fast.

[CVOLVO]

We can likely poke a thousand logical holes in the entire storyline but I for one just enjoy the entertainment value and escapism of the successful reprise of my most favourite movie trilogy.

Questions: Although we may find out in subsequent episodes, why did Einstein return to Doc's home and at precisely the same time Marty was there (impossible coincidence) and not to the Lone Pine Mall, several months after the coming home device was set? Obviously this was not Einsteins first time travel event? Even if the opening sequence was Marty's dream, do we know the date, from the original movie that Einstein was sent? Likely not 1931. I realize the Lone Pine Mall sign started to disappear but as someone surmised, wasn't that just a dream? No doubt when Doc said "I've made a horrible mistake!" this may be an ominous clue to help us unfold the answers to these questions. We also know there will be further interactions with Miss Striklin. It's fun to speculate and make us more eager to see all future episodes. I can hardly wait :confused:

[Origami]

^
Einstein wasn't sent there from the events that happened at Lone Pine Mall in 1985. Einstein was with Doc at the end of the trilogy. Doc probably traveled with Einstein through time and when he send it to 1986 he send Einstein along.

[Krohn]

But it's the goof that is easily overlooked and probably happened in a lot of movies.

When Marty arrives in 1931 and gets caught up in a police chase the DeLorean drives around 70 mph....and so do the other two 1931 cars!
But back then cars weren't able to go that fast.


First 1931 car I found: http://www.crossley-motors.org.uk/history/1930/golden/Golden.html

You wil note that it's top speed is listed as 72mph, so driving at around 70 mph is possible at the time :)

[Shadowknight1]

First 1931 car I found: http://www.crossley-motors.org.uk/history/1930/golden/Golden.html

You wil note that it's top speed is listed as 72mph, so driving at around 70 mph is possible at the time :)

Interesting.

[linorn]

Even if the opening sequence was Marty's dream, do we know the date, from the original movie that Einstein was sent?

He was sent a minute into the future

[Shadowknight1]

He was sent a minute into the future

More specifically, 1:21 AM, October 26, 1985. :p

A friend of mine, who is over-anal about some details that no one in their right mind would care about, expressed concerns that the clothing in the 1931 Hill Valley is inaccurate to the times. Can anyone help me prove him wrong?

[Vainamoinen]

More specifically, 1:21 AM, October 26, 1985. :p

A friend of mine, who is over-anal about some details that no one in their right mind would care about, expressed concerns that the clothing in the 1931 Hill Valley is inaccurate to the times. Can anyone help me prove him wrong?

No, I don't think either way could be "proven". The game doesn't offer enough detail to prove or disprove that it might be authentic 30's clothing.

[Carlos85G]

Something I thought:

Doc got sent back to January 1st, 1885 from November 12th, 1955. That's 70 years, 10 months and 12 days back (25,882 days, counting 16 leap years and that by 9:30-ish p.m., that day had almost ended), right?.

Now, 70 years, 10 months and 12 days forward should be around September 22, 2026 (25882 days added to the time jump: Tuesday, September 22th, 2026, 19:00-ish, supossing time travel ocurred after 21:30 and before 22:00), shouldn't it?

If the DeLorean is a "mirror" duplicate, shouldn't it appear on that date instead of 2025?

So, either that's a plothole or Griff already made a trip back in time with a functional DeLorean Time Machine (either it arrived functional -not likely- from 1955 or someone else/duplicate-Doc fixed it).

Another possibility: Could the time circuits had only taken the year to calculate fourth-dimensional coordinates before the microchip burned out, leaving everything else default, like 1885-01-01-0000/2025-01-01-0000?

[markeres]

Another possibility: Could the time circuits had only taken the year to calculate fourth-dimensional coordinates before the microchip burned out, leaving everything else default, like 1885-01-01-0000/2025-01-01-0000?That was my thought. That he just ended up on January 1, 2025. I guess it's possible that the temporal duplication was based solely on the year, not the exact time. I think it's more likely, however, that Telltale either didn't think about the exact amount of time involved or they simplified it for the lay audience.

[tope1983]

how do the AM and PM clocks actually work?
i am from austria and we do have here the 24h time format.
so it beginns with 0:00:00 and ends with 23:59:59.

is 0:00:00 - midnight - >> 12:00pm? or >> 12:00am?

am is "ante meridiem" and pm is "post meridiem"....
pre-noon and after-noon... So midnight would be both: 12 hours before noon and 12 hours after noon...

what about noon itself? it hardly can be pre or after... I thought it is 12:00am although that wouldn't make sense...

Is that a huge problem for the time circuits because it would mean that you can not set the destination time to noon?
Plus: as there is no "minus" on the keypad the earliest point in history you can travel to should be JAN-01-0000-12:00am. So no ancient egypt or dinosaurs or whatever....
(I BET carlos will have an answer to all this!:D)

[unicornfoal]

how do the AM and PM clocks actually work?

12am is midnight and 12pm is noon. That's just how it works and we don't question it. :)

[Carlos85G]

(I BET carlos will have an answer to all this!:D)

Already answered by unicornfoal, but yes :o:

00:00 (or 24:00) = 12:00 a.m. = Midnight, first minute of the day.

12:00 = 12:00 p.m. = Noon.

The next minute after 11:59 a.m. (morning) is 12:00 p.m. (noon).

The next minute after 11:59 p.m. (late night) is 12:00 a.m. (midnight, early morning of a new day).

Most likely, the date input format for the DeLorean uses military time:

01-01-1885-0000 for January 1st, 1885, 12:00 a.m.

11-12-1955-0600 for November 12th, 1955, 6:00 a.m.

10-26-1985-2100 for October 26th, 1985, 9:00 p.m.


There's no switch, light or readout in the DeLorean suggesting "B.C." time travel, so it remains a mistery.

[Michael J Fox is Canadian]

minor goof: Marty eats soup in the game with his left hand but in the films, Marty is right-handed

[unicornfoal]

minor goof: Marty eats soup in the game with his left hand but in the films, Marty is right-handed

Ha, well spotted! xD Of course, something like that should be expected in animation, especially games, because often they have to cheat things or just don't notice things like that while animating. Just look at the Monkey Island games. I'm convinced Guybrush is ambidextrous considering how many times he switches his dominant hand! xD

[Michael J Fox is Canadian]

Ha, well spotted! xD Of course, something like that should be expected in animation, especially games, because often they have to cheat things or just don't notice things like that while animating. Just look at the Monkey Island games. I'm convinced Guybrush is ambidextrous considering how many times he switches his dominant hand! xD

Yeah truthfully I don't consider that sort of thing a goof in animation, you can probably assume most characters are ambedixtrous.

[Krohn]

minor goof: Marty eats soup in the game with his left hand but in the films, Marty is right-handed

Is that why he could only hit targets when using the colt with his left hand?
(At the Colt stand in BTTF III)

[oberlerchner123]

Marty is right handed in the movies.
And he only shoots the colt with his left hand once because the guy is being a smartass and wont let him use the right one.

[unicornfoal]

Marty is right handed in the movies.
And he only shoots the colt with his left hand once because the guy is being a smartass and wont let him use the right one.

I read somewhere that the Colt was designed to be used with the non-dominant hand, which explains why the salesman pushed it into Marty's left... and whoever it was also added that Marty seemed to miss that shot as much from the recoil of a real gun as from using his "off hand" from endless hours of Wild Gunmen.
I thought that was interesting, anyway. xD

[Michael J Fox is Canadian]

I read somewhere that the Colt was designed to be used with the non-dominant hand, which explains why the salesman pushed it into Marty's left... and whoever it was also added that Marty seemed to miss that shot as much from the recoil of a real gun as from using his "off hand" from endless hours of Wild Gunmen.
I thought that was interesting, anyway. xD

Why would they do that?

And yes I remember that scene fairly well; he puts the gun in marty's left hand. Marty moves his right hand towards the gun (probably to switch it to his proper hand) and the guy said "no no no" and pulls his right hand back and marty makes the bad shot. He then switches hands and starts firing properly.

[unicornfoal]

Why would they do that?

Something to do with using the gun while on a horse. I presume you'd be using your dominant hand to keep control of said horse while you were riding, leaving only the other one for firing a gun. *shrugs*

[oberlerchner123]

Something to do with using the gun while on a horse. I presume you'd be using your dominant hand to keep control of said horse while you were riding, leaving only the other one for firing a gun. *shrugs*

Well no idea, I think on foot i would hold such a gun with my right and support it with my left.
Never thought about how somebody would shoot while on a horse...

I was never really sure about that scene anyway.
The shot is so off that it always looked like he fired it by accident before even aiming to me.
And Marty is right handed, he wrote the letter with his right hand in the first movie too.

[Michael J Fox is Canadian]

Well no idea, I think on foot i would hold such a gun with my right and support it with my left.
Never thought about how somebody would shoot while on a horse...

And Marty is right handed, he wrote the letter with his right hand in the first movie too.

Just so you know, that's not always a valid assumption. There are plenty of people who's dominant hand is not the same as their dominant arm. For instance Will Ferrell and Seth Rogen write and eat with their left hands but their right arm is stronger (they throw and use guns with the right). Sylvester stallone is the other way around.

But Michael J Fox is completely right handed. We see him write with his right hand and in the next scene when he throws the frisbee at Buford, he does so right handed. He also uses the gun in part II right handed when playing the video game.

This is just something i notice usually on people because I'm ambidextrous for hand writing and eating but strictly left handed for sports (left arm is stronger)

[Michael J Fox is Canadian]

At the end of the episode it seems that Doc disappears as soon as they drive the delorean back to 1986 (good thing marty was driving although i guess it makes no difference). Given that we know doc is not dead, how on earth does this fit the rules of BTTF time travel? I'm assuming it happened because his timeline changed but we've now seen 2 instances of doc and marty returning to the present with an alternate timeline (part II and episode 2) and they did not disappear. And even if they are writing new rules, why did doc disappear and not Marty since his timeline would have to have changed as well?

[Kamagawa]

I think it is because by travelling to the present, the fading out increases speed.

Also, The new doc probably never evented the time machine. The only problem is why the new deLorean is unaffected.

Also from the movie2 and episode2, why don't we ever see any alternate Marty? does he always become a time-traveller, no matter what the time-line, as long as he exists?

You also have an issue of destiny. Maby marty is the speakeasy arsonist. If he is, he can't dissappear until he has blown up the speakeasy and planted the dinomite in in the second speakeasy.



Just remembered. In BttFI, past Doc comments on a stranger helping him help marty (I think he was fixing the DeLorean). Only in BttFII do we learn that it was future Doc that helped him. In the game, Doc can't do anything and makes sure he doesnt do anything to alter the timeline. Marty on the other hand seems to be helped in getting Kid to leave the speakeasy. Doc only helped free Einstien off the roof (which is why he never dissappeared when returning to 1986 at the beginning). Now I am about 80% sure Marty is the arsonist.

[Michael J Fox is Canadian]

I think it is because by travelling to the present, the fading out increases speed.

Also, The new doc probably never evented the time machine. The only problem is why the new deLorean is unaffected.

Also from the movie2 and episode2, why don't we ever see any alternate Marty? does he always become a time-traveller, no matter what the time-line, as long as he exists?

It's never revealed but it seems the rules had been there can only be one of you in each timeline. At the end of part 1, he returns to an alternate timeline and there isn't 2 of him (well there is for 11 minutes but that is due to him returning before he left).

But the point is that why is doc fading out at all? The only time this happens in the BTTF franchise is when you erease yourself from existance or change the timeline to die before your point in time (deleted biff scene). We know doc can't be dead. According to the rules of BTTF, doc should have been intact.

[Kamagawa]

It's never revealed but it seems the rules had been there can only be one of you in each timeline. At the end of part 1, he returns to an alternate timeline and there isn't 2 of him (well there is for 11 minutes but that is due to him returning before he left).

Perhaps the first point: only one per timeline, though that brings the question of BttF II, during which there were 2 Docs and Martys for half the movie.

As for your second point, Maby Doc does die before his current age as a result of being a dictator-like figure.

[daeva0123]

"At the end of the episode it seems that Doc disappears as soon as they drive the delorean back to 1986 (good thing marty was driving although i guess it makes no difference)."

I worried about this too, I did have a bit of a hunch that it meant something more sinister that would play out in the next episode... That is when I thought back to them both seeing the 'Frankenstein' movie.

[church1138]

But they both didn't SEE Frankenstein! Edna pulled Emmett away from the theater! She must have swayed his interests by swaying her...well, you know.

The only question I have is why the DeLorean didn't disappear as well. This is why BTTF2 is so confusing to me in Alternate 1985. Because Doc was committed back in 1973, he never made the time machine, thus causing the events of BTTF1 and 2 to not happen.

I spose the general answer to this is the same as in Movie2.....that it's a movie and for the sake of a movie (in this case, a game) you just gotta ROLL with it.

[daeva0123]

Good points. Hmm who knows then, its such a break from the logic of the films it seems like it may be something that is explained later on in the game series. Hopefully we'll find out a bit more next ep - and only another month to wait lol.

[Sinaz20]

We have very elaborate and headaching conversations in brainstorming meetings and conference calls with Bob Gale about these things.

The mechanic here is that when they ditch 1931, the timeline in which Doc (and maybe Einstein, too) has gone through rejuvination in 2015 is gone. So, Doc, in this new timeline, has not lived a preternaturally long life. First instinct is to say, "ahah! But Doc would have been alive at age 72 by 1986!" And that's the case for Citizen Brown. But the Doc we have been spending time with has probably lived over a hundred years by now through various time travelling escapades with Claire and the kids. Without the rejuvination, he has ceased to exist. Being retroactively-dead comes with different rules than being uncreated.

Ultimately... I don't think there is anything that we could do in a BttF story, constantly twisting and turning, that wouldn't have some sort of temporal ruleset violations. But we do the best we can to tell a good story.

Ok... can I stop explaining this now? :P

As for how all of this effects the characters and gets resolved... well... 3 more episodes to go!

[Michael J Fox is Canadian]

We have very elaborate and headaching conversations in brainstorming meetings and conference calls with Bob Gale about these things.

The mechanic here is that when they ditch 1931, the timeline in which Doc (and maybe Einstein, too) has gone through rejuvination in 2015 is gone. So, Doc, in this new timeline, has not lived a preternaturally long life. First instinct is to say, "ahah! But Doc would have been alive at age 72 by 1986!" And that's the case for Citizen Brown. But the Doc we have been spending time with has probably lived over a hundred years by now through various time travelling escapades with Claire and the kids. Without the rejuvination, he has ceased to exist. Being retroactively-dead comes with different rules than being uncreated.

Ultimately... I don't think there is anything that we could do in a BttF story, constantly twisting and turning, that wouldn't have some sort of temporal ruleset violations. But we do the best we can to tell a good story.

Ok... can I stop explaining this now? :P

As for how all of this effects the characters and gets resolved... well... 3 more episodes to go!

Okay I think I get where you're coming from. Let's just assume the following timeframes (which I am making up, just doing so for example purposes)
Doc is born in 1913 making him 72 in 1985
to make it easy, lets say Doc spends 28 years on his varous time travels meaning at this point in the game, he's lived for 100 years.
In the newest timeline (citizen brown) he does no time travelling and dies somewhere between 1986 and 2013 (or ages 73 and 100) hence why the 100 year old doc disappears?

That would make sense to me and I appreciate your explanation.

And church you are right that Doc indicates that Frankenstein had a profound effect on his life so no surprise not seeing it changes his future whether he remains with edna or not.

[zounds!]

I appreciate that explanation also, and I realize that this series makes its own rules.... I guess I'm still confused. If Doc never gets the rejuvenation that means he also never goes to the old west, the Delorean doesn't get struck by lightning, he doesn't build the time train, doesn't marry Clara, doesn't travel back to 2015 to "rescue" the new Delorean, and Marty never does anything...ever. This is actually still assuming that the events of BttF1 still transpire, which in this explanation (and the way episode 3 starts) makes it seem like they wouldn't. If they didn't happen either than there is no original Delorean or time traveling to 1955, in which case none of the events portrayed in any movie or episode would ever happen.

[silverstreakusa]

We have very elaborate and headaching conversations in brainstorming meetings and conference calls with Bob Gale about these things.

The mechanic here is that when they ditch 1931, the timeline in which Doc (and maybe Einstein, too) has gone through rejuvination in 2015 is gone. So, Doc, in this new timeline, has not lived a preternaturally long life. First instinct is to say, "ahah! But Doc would have been alive at age 72 by 1986!" And that's the case for Citizen Brown. But the Doc we have been spending time with has probably lived over a hundred years by now through various time travelling escapades with Claire and the kids. Without the rejuvination, he has ceased to exist. Being retroactively-dead comes with different rules than being uncreated.

Ultimately... I don't think there is anything that we could do in a BttF story, constantly twisting and turning, that wouldn't have some sort of temporal ruleset violations. But we do the best we can to tell a good story.

Ok... can I stop explaining this now? :P

As for how all of this effects the characters and gets resolved... well... 3 more episodes to go!



Seems feesable only error is you called Clara "Claire"

[Sinaz20]

Seems feesable only error is you called Clara "Claire"

That's because I can type faster than I think.

[daeva0123]

Yeah that works for me, Thanks! :D

[Kamagawa]

We have very elaborate and headaching conversations in brainstorming meetings and conference calls with Bob Gale about these things.

The mechanic here is that when they ditch 1931, the timeline in which Doc (and maybe Einstein, too) has gone through rejuvination in 2015 is gone. So, Doc, in this new timeline, has not lived a preternaturally long life. First instinct is to say, "ahah! But Doc would have been alive at age 72 by 1986!" And that's the case for Citizen Brown. But the Doc we have been spending time with has probably lived over a hundred years by now through various time travelling escapades with Claire and the kids. Without the rejuvination, he has ceased to exist. Being retroactively-dead comes with different rules than being uncreated.

Ultimately... I don't think there is anything that we could do in a BttF story, constantly twisting and turning, that wouldn't have some sort of temporal ruleset violations. But we do the best we can to tell a good story.

Ok... can I stop explaining this now? :P

As for how all of this effects the characters and gets resolved... well... 3 more episodes to go!

only problem now is:


The only question I have is why the DeLorean didn't disappear as well. This is why BTTF2 is so confusing to me in Alternate 1985. Because Doc was committed back in 1973, he never made the time machine, thus causing the events of BTTF1 and 2 to not happen.


So if the the sitiation is Doc not living till about 100, then how does that not appply in BttF II? They do say it was because they jumped to the present and over the affects of old Biff changing time. Why is moving forward in time different to moving backward in time?

[Michael J Fox is Canadian]

only problem now is:



So if the the sitiation is Doc not living till about 100, then how does that not appply in BttF II? They do say it was because they jumped to the present and over the affects of old Biff changing time. Why is moving forward in time different to moving backward in time?

Because in both timelines, doc still lives to the age of 72 (let's assume for the sake of the argument he doesn't spend that much time travelling prior to the 2015 trip). According to Sinaz, doc has a shorter life in the citizen brown timeline and thus disappears. If you consider the deleted scene real, Biff disappears from 2015 upon his return because he does not live this long in the alternate timeline.

By the way Sinaz thanks for giving such a comprehensive answer to my question. I know a lot of people here are bashing telltale for release dates, things they don't like and what not but this is the only game I've played in which the creators will actually come on message boards and interact with the users so great communication on telltales part. This is the first game I've ever played of telltales but this has been a great experience so far.

[church1138]

We have very elaborate and headaching conversations in brainstorming meetings and conference calls with Bob Gale about these things.

The mechanic here is that when they ditch 1931, the timeline in which Doc (and maybe Einstein, too) has gone through rejuvination in 2015 is gone. So, Doc, in this new timeline, has not lived a preternaturally long life. First instinct is to say, "ahah! But Doc would have been alive at age 72 by 1986!" And that's the case for Citizen Brown. But the Doc we have been spending time with has probably lived over a hundred years by now through various time travelling escapades with Claire and the kids. Without the rejuvination, he has ceased to exist. Being retroactively-dead comes with different rules than being uncreated.

This....somewhat makes sense.

I'm just trying to break my brain thinking about it.

So I suppose, when time travellers enter a foreign "alternate" timeline than the one they came from, they do not do not dissapear because it's not so much as an alternate timeline as it is an alternate "universe", or "reality" as Doc calls it. And they're not assimilated into it, but accommodated into it. Just "visitors," i suppose. Until you threaten the integrity of your family's bloodline, then you should be fine. Hence, why Doc and Marty didn't disappear in 85A.

That doesn't explain the DeLorean though.

[Michael J Fox is Canadian]

This....somewhat makes sense.

I'm just trying to break my brain thinking about it.

So I suppose, when time travellers enter a foreign "alternate" timeline than the one they came from, they do not do not dissapear because it's not so much as an alternate timeline as it is an alternate "universe", or "reality" as Doc calls it. And they're not assimilated into it, but accommodated into it. Just "visitors," i suppose. Until you threaten the integrity of your family's bloodline, then you should be fine. Hence, why Doc and Marty didn't disappear in 85A.

That doesn't explain the DeLorean though.

Basically if you are still alive at your current age in the timeline, you stay. If you're not, you disappear. So look at it this way; i'll be 28 this year. If I start travelling through time, the ONLY way I would start fading or disappear is if I do something which prevents me from either being born or living to the age of 28. Let's say I travel back in time and do something which prevents me to live to my current age. I'd start fading. But according to the rules of BTTF, if i travel forward in time, i should disappear immediately. If I travel backwards in time from there, I would not disappear. This is why both times marty jeopardizes his timeline (part I and episodes 1 and 2), he starts fading but doesn't fade out because he does not go forward in time while he's fading. But Biff (in part II) and Doc (in episode 2) disappear completely because they both jeopardize their timelines and then go forward in time and fade out.

[Michael J Fox is Canadian]

As far as the delorean, i guess it doesn't disappar because it's not living. And as far as we know, at no point in BTTF has the invention of the delorean been compromised. John DeLorean still helped found DMC and thus that car itself should still exist although admittedly the time circuits, flux capacitor, and hover conversions should not be on it at that point. Similar concept to the picture of Doc's tombstone in part III. When the tombstone breaks, it disappears from the photo but the photograph itself still remains as that photo would still exist.

[Sinaz20]

Ultimately, we look at these paradoxes that our characters get themselves into. We look at the props they have on hand and how they communicate their current conundrum.

We devil's advocate each other on every plot point, and make the same exact arguments you all make on the forums.

When we hit these moments where we can't rewind back to episodes and moments already produced and make a change to accommodate the story we want to tell, we ask ourselves, "what's more important? Getting this story arc into the game or ditching it in favor of 'correct' science."

The story almost always wins this contest.

We go through so many iterations until we find the story we really really want to tell.

[Strayth]

Hi Sinaz, first of all, thanks for explaining your logic. I don't think we should abuse your patience though. (If the writers had to answer every plot mistake on forums I think there would be no game, right ?)

So maybe I can answer it for you.

If there still is a Delorean, it's because of WHAT it is. A time dupplicate. Maybe rules are actually different (since there also obviously was no time dupplicate of Doc in the future, with the Delorean) for things like this that were never meant to be. They're out of time from start so maybe they actually can't get affected by it too.

I mean, obviously the real Delorean just doesn't exist in this present, so the only difference with the real one and the game one is that.

[Triloge]

It's never been established there can only be one version of an individual per timeline. Note that in both Part II AND Episode 2 they specifically mentioned this alternate timeline's Marty is elsewhere (boarding school and not in town, respectively). So we don't KNOW what the rules are with this issue.

[Fullmetal X]

From a story standpoint, it makes things much difficult for Marty without Doc around...and therefore, much more interesting for the game.

And I am glad to see that the writers have their bases covered for why Doc's disappearance happens. Personally, that was my own rationale for why Doc disappeared, if only because it makes the most sense. It also helps that BttF II is my favorite and I know practically every line in that movie. Doc's "It added a good 30 to 40 years to my life" line rang out in my head when that happened. No time travel, no rejuvenation clinic, no life extension. Poor Doc.

[Michael J Fox is Canadian]

From a story standpoint, it makes things much difficult for Marty without Doc around...and therefore, much more interesting for the game.

And I am glad to see that the writers have their bases covered for why Doc's disappearance happens. Personally, that was my own rationale for why Doc disappeared, if only because it makes the most sense. It also helps that BttF II is my favorite and I know practically every line in that movie. Doc's "It added a good 30 to 40 years to my life" line rang out in my head when that happened. No time travel, no rejuvenation clinic, no life extension. Poor Doc.

Part 2 has been my favourite since 1991 (yes 20 years!) and I too know every line but until recently i thought the rejuvination clinic was to make doc look OLDER as he supposedly would in 2015. It wasn't until recently when i considered the concept that maybe Doc had been travelling through time for that long and needed the rejuvenation to reverse the aging.

[Shadowknight1]

And I am glad to see that the writers have their bases covered for why Doc's disappearance happens. Personally, that was my own rationale for why Doc disappeared, if only because it makes the most sense. It also helps that BttF II is my favorite and I know practically every line in that movie. Doc's "It added a good 30 to 40 years to my life" line rang out in my head when that happened. No time travel, no rejuvenation clinic, no life extension. Poor Doc.

I didn't think of it that way.

[church1138]

When we hit these moments where we can't rewind back to episodes and moments already produced and make a change to accommodate the story we want to tell, we ask ourselves, "what's more important? Getting this story arc into the game or ditching it in favor of 'correct' science."

Logical fallacies < Story, i agree. BTTF breaks a lot of it's own rules all the time (pun intended), and it's still my favorite series of movies ever.

I guess I've always thought of the concept of like, when you enter an alternate timeline, things that you've brought with you disappear. Ex. 1985A, you've entered that alternate timeline, where the DeLorean doesn't exist, thus, the DeLorean should vanish. This new train of thought, this "displaced time traveller" angle makes the movie make a lot more sense. =D

[Shadowknight1]

Also, on the point of the DeLorean, upon arrive in the Citizen Brown '86, notice that Marty loses all control of the vehicle. Obviously the flying circuits are gone, and the time circuits begin to make the same malfunctioning noise they did in BttF2 when they displayed 1885, and the Flux Capacitor, most importantly, was no longer fluxing.

[zounds!]

As far as the delorean, i guess it doesn't disappar because it's not living. And as far as we know, at no point in BTTF has the invention of the delorean been compromised. John DeLorean still helped found DMC and thus that car itself should still exist although admittedly the time circuits, flux capacitor, and hover conversions should not be on it at that point. Similar concept to the picture of Doc's tombstone in part III. When the tombstone breaks, it disappears from the photo but the photograph itself still remains as that photo would still exist.

I like this explanation, the only thing I keep scratching at is .....
ok so the Delorean (just the car) would still be in existince, but if Doc never builds a time machine, its paradox city for a whole bunch of reasons.

They never would've done any of the events in BttF 2 or 3 (and arguably 1) No lightning strike means no duplication of the Delorean. So its iffy that it would even be there. Aside from the events that would eventually lead Marty to even occupy said questionable existince Delorean in the first place.

I hope that if in Ep 3 the events of BttF 1 have still transpired in the 1986 First Citizen Brown universe, there is a snazzy explanation....that would be interesting.

[roycejunktion]

can anyone explain in the biff brothers fight in ep2.... biff mentions hes mad at marty for the manure................

are we suppose to believe that biff now remembered marty from 1955?

[Strayth]

No, you're supposed to believe that each time Marty meets a Tannen, he ends up in the manure. Alternate Marty got Alternate Biff in the manure.

[roycejunktion]

No, you're supposed to believe that each time Marty meets a Tannen, he ends up in the manure. Alternate Marty got Alternate Biff in the manure.

ugh.... of course thats right....

ive been watching too much ghostbusters lately, i think my bttf skills are fading....

[Iggman88]

Well being a time machine the DeLorean is probally always in a state of temporal flux/displacement (or at least when the flux capacitor is on before and a few secs after jumping), creating it's own spacetime, the "true" timeline, protecting the car and the stuff hardwired to it, regardless of what happens to the timeline.

A time shield so to speak. (star trek) lol

[Kamagawa]

If marty is the speakeasy arsonist, he can't dissappear until he has blown up the speakeasy and planted the dinomite in in the second speakeasy. Therefore creating an extreme paradox of erasing ep1 and 2. The other possibility is that FCB (first citizen brown) is the speakeasy arsonist and thus the Doc vanishing has to happen in order for speakeasy1 to be blown up and speakeasy2 to have dinomite in it.

Evidence:
In BttFI, past Doc comments on a stranger helping him help marty (I think he was fixing the DeLorean). Only in BttFII do we learn that it was future Doc that helped him. In the game, Doc can't do anything and makes sure he doesnt do anything to alter the timeline. Marty on the other hand seems to be helped in getting Kid to leave the speakeasy. Doc only helped free Einstien off the roof (which is why he never dissappeared when returning to 1986 at the beginning).

Also, when Doc gets shot in the beginning of BttF1, there is no blood, implying that Marty's future self already warned Doc. So in order to maintain the timeline Marty has to end up warning Doc. The alternate 1985 is probably the true timeline as the old timeline is also required to put things on track.

Conclusion:
The DeLorean time machine still exists in order for certain events in the past to still take place and may have been instigated by marty of FCB.

[Carlos85G]

If marty is the speakeasy arsonist, he can't dissappear until he has blown up the speakeasy and planted the dinomite in in the second speakeasy. Therefore creating an extreme paradox of erasing ep1 and 2. The other possibility is that FCB (first citizen brown) is the speakeasy arsonist and thus the Doc vanishing has to happen in order for speakeasy1 to be blown up and speakeasy2 to have dinomite in it.

Marty can't be the arsonist because the fire happened before Marty went back in time, neither can be FCB because he doesn't exist in this timeline. The timeline is not looped or fixed like in "Bill & Ted" or "Twelve Monkeys", but happens as it happens because the Future isn't written. The arsonist is either Edna or somebody else.


Evidence:
In BttFI, past Doc comments on a stranger helping him help marty (I think he was fixing the DeLorean). Only in BttFII do we learn that it was future Doc that helped him.

No, we didn't see that in BTTF1: We jumped from the scene where Marty's telling the plan to George to the Courthouse, where Marty's preparing to go to the dance. They never comment about a stranger, but only about the weather, Doc thanking Marty for giving him a reason to be and about not wanting to hear about his own Future. We only see in BTTF2 that 1985 Doc went there carelessly and 1955 Doc asked him to get the 5/8 wrench. 1955 Doc could have gotten the wrench himself even if 1985 Doc wasn't there.

In the game, Doc can't do anything and makes sure he doesnt do anything to alter the timeline. Marty on the other hand seems to be helped in getting Kid to leave the speakeasy. Doc only helped free Einstien off the roof (which is why he never dissappeared when returning to 1986 at the beginning).

I don't understand your point here :confused:

Also, when Doc gets shot in the beginning of BttF1, there is no blood, implying that Marty's future self already warned Doc. So in order to maintain the timeline Marty has to end up warning Doc. The alternate 1985 is probably the true timeline as the old timeline is also required to put things on track.

No, we only saw Doc's legs through the van, we didn't see Doc's full body. Probably because of movie rating.

It has been established by Gale that there is no "Future" or "Second" Marty in Twin-Pines-Mall Universe; so, when the Libyans shoot Doc, he's really dead.

Conclusion:
The DeLorean time machine still exists in order for certain events in the past to still take place and may have been instigated by marty of FCB.


I don't understand how that conclusion arised :p, but I believe Doc still invented time travel and worked on the DeLorean. Maybe the DeLorean won't work now because there are missing parts as consequence of of it being FCB's WIP -and we can also see burning sparks just before temporal displacement occured- and then only Doc dissapeared because he won't live to be almost 100.

[Shadowknight1]

Also, anyone who didn't notice, the missing gargoyles on the clock tower are NOT a continuity error! When you talk to Edna in the park at night, she's raising money to put some kind of statues on the courthouse. :D

[Carlos85G]

I heard the line and was relieved :D, but still the ledge is too wide, or better said: the upper part of the ClockTower is too far back, unless that part is set closer to the front in the remodelling -though I don't know how-

[jortlaban]

Also, anyone who didn't notice, the missing gargoyles on the clock tower are NOT a continuity error! When you talk to Edna in the park at night, she's raising money to put some kind of statues on the courthouse. :D
They just fixed that... probably after comments or just as an easy fix to prevent comments.;)

[Kamagawa]

Marty can't be the arsonist because the fire happened before Marty went back in time, neither can be FCB because he doesn't exist in this timeline. The timeline is not looped or fixed like in "Bill & Ted" or "Twelve Monkeys", but happens as it happens because the Future isn't written. The arsonist is either Edna or somebody else.


Then how do you explain that the reason for einstien's behaviour in ep 1 is revealed in ep 2 to be Marty trying to save Artie and avoid his past self? Einy "ferociousely attacked" Edna in ep 1 but it just suddenly cuts from the tree to Edna, without any indication that a stick may or may not have been thrown. You only know about the stick in ep2.



No, we didn't see that in BTTF1: We jumped from the scene where Marty's telling the plan to George to the Courthouse, where Marty's preparing to go to the dance. They never comment about a stranger, but only about the weather, Doc thanking Marty for giving him a reason to be and about not wanting to hear about his own Future. We only see in BTTF2 that 1985 Doc went there carelessly and 1955 Doc asked him to get the 5/8 wrench. 1955 Doc could have gotten the wrench himself even if 1985 Doc wasn't there.


Thanks...I thought I had that wrong.
Wait...I NEVER SAID NOR INDICATED that the BttFII marty and doc were seen in BttFI or there actions reffered to in BttFI. I was talking about within BttFII ONLY.
BttF was originally only 1 movie. Box office sales turned it into a trilogy. The VERY end of BttFI was just in case they made a sequal.


I don't understand your point here :confused:


No real point. Doc didn't really have much opportinity to mess-up his own timeline...that was Marty's fault.


No, we only saw Doc's legs through the van, we didn't see Doc's full body. Probably because of movie rating.
100.

True...I just thought they might have shown a puddle or some indication that he was really dead and not just knocked out from the force of the bullets on the bullet proof vest..


It has been established by Gale that there is no "Future" or "Second" Marty in Twin-Pines-Mall Universe; so, when the Libyans shoot Doc, he's really dead.


I never really meant that point, I know it is not true. I was just thinking of alternate possibilities.
Mainly...
At the end of BttFI, we see Marty arrive just as past Marty leaves for 1985. How do you know that didn't happen at the beginning of the movie as well? I know that's not the case, it is just interesting thinking.



I don't understand how that conclusion arised :p, but I believe Doc still invented time travel and worked on the DeLorean. Maybe the DeLorean won't work now because there are missing parts as consequence of of it being FCB's WIP -and we can also see burning sparks just before temporal displacement occured- and then only Doc dissapeared because he won't live to be almost 100.

I understand that and never said otherwise.
What I meant was the DeLorean still has to be invented (which it has/will) in order for Marty to correct the timeline and for the DeLorean to still exist (he always seems to be the one who puts the timeline on track). So Doc (or FCB in this case) needs to invent the DeLorean, which he is probably hiding from Edna.

[Michael J Fox is Canadian]

Thanks...I thought I had that wrong.
Wait...I NEVER SAID NOR INDICATED that the BttFII marty and doc were seen in BttFI or there actions reffered to in BttFI. I was talking about within BttFII ONLY.
BttF was originally only 1 movie. Box office sales turned it into a trilogy. The VERY end of BttFI was just in case they made a sequal.




True...I just thought they might have shown a puddle or some indication that he was really dead and not just knocked out from the force of the bullets on the bullet proof vest..



I never really meant that point, I know it is not true. I was just thinking of alternate possibilities.
Mainly...
At the end of BttFI, we see Marty arrive just as past Marty leaves for 1985. How do you know that didn't happen at the beginning of the movie as well? I know that's not the case, it is just interesting thinking.




I understand that and never said otherwise.
What I meant was the DeLorean still has to be invented (which it has/will) in order for Marty to correct the timeline and for the DeLorean to still exist (he always seems to be the one who puts the timeline on track). So Doc (or FCB in this case) needs to invent the DeLorean, which he is probably hiding from Edna.

No according to movie rules, the events of part II haven't happened yet in part 1. I've watched part II more than any other movie in existance and just watched part I again last week fairly closely to see differences from the scenes of part II; marty does walk violently through the doors from the stage (part where he eventually hits his other self) but you can clearly see through the windows in the part I clip and there is nobody else standing where marty and biff are in the sequel. Also they do cut away at the part of doc running in the street. But anyhow according to bttf theres no time travel written in the timelines hence why we see pictures, newspapers, and such changing when events change.

I thought about the blood thing you brought up recently. And yes it was likely avoided due to MPAA reasons as i can't believe someone being shot that many times would not bleed. But yeah according to the rules, at the start of the film, doc is dead.

the fact that twin pines mall changes to lone pines mall is a good indication of what you brought up.

[Kamagawa]

One thing I like about BttFI is that it shows you the very beginning of the time loop. I prefer part 1 & 3 to part2 because part 2 is tho most common and typical timetravel plot. Villian alters time and heroes have to stop villian.

Also, in the games, they can use the predestination paradox (created when marty arrives back in 1985) because they can think an episode ahead. they didn't have that luxury in the movies because they never intended to make more than 1 movie. The ending of part 1 was just in case (google it). This ultimately makes the movies very unique as timetravel plots will employ either the predestination paradox or hero stopping villian from altering time.


Predestination Paradox: the time traveller is in the past, which means they were in the past before. Therefore, their presence is vital to the future, and they do something that causes the future to occur in the same way that their knowledge of the future has already happened.

[Kamagawa]

Quote from wikipedia:
In the film Back to the Future Marty plays Chuck Berry's future song Johnny B. Goode, which then is relayed to Chuck Berry, resulting in the song having no original creator. Also, after Marty leaves, his future mother Lorraine states that she likes the name Marty, making Marty's name a possible instance of the bootstrap paradox.


Makes you think

[Carlos85G]

Then how do you explain that the reason for einstien's behaviour in ep 1 is revealed in ep 2 to be Marty trying to save Artie and avoid his past self? Einy "ferociousely attacked" Edna in ep 1 but it just suddenly cuts from the tree to Edna, without any indication that a stick may or may not have been thrown. You only know about the stick in ep2.

You're thinking too 4th-dimensionally! :p

In Ep. 1 Einstein attacks Edna twice: Before getting in the DeLorean with Edna's shoe (first) and when he returns with Marty (second).

In Ep. 2, just once: When Marty goes back to 4:45 p.m. and throws the stick to Edna (third time).

Even as Marty traveled back in time, this is the third time (from Edna's POV) that Einstein attacks her. There's no predestination paradox here.

The only explanation still needed is why did Einstein attack Edna the first time...

Thanks...I thought I had that wrong.
Wait...I NEVER SAID NOR INDICATED that the BttFII marty and doc were seen in BttFI or there actions reffered to in BttFI. I was talking about within BttFII ONLY.
BttF was originally only 1 movie. Box office sales turned it into a trilogy. The VERY end of BttFI was just in case they made a sequal.

You said In BttFI, past Doc comments on a stranger helping him help marty (I think he was fixing the DeLorean). Only in BttFII do we learn that it was future Doc that helped him., so you said that 1955 Doc talked about a "stranger" in BTTF1, so where am I getting it wrong?:confused:

True...I just thought they might have shown a puddle or some indication that he was really dead and not just knocked out from the force of the bullets on the bullet proof vest..
*snip*
Mainly...
At the end of BttFI, we see Marty arrive just as past Marty leaves for 1985. How do you know that didn't happen at the beginning of the movie as well? I know that's not the case, it is just interesting thinking.



That's the power of Love Suggestion: He was shot point-blank, multiple times, with an AK-47. He's certainly dead in Twin-Pines-Mall universe. There was the possibility of Doc being alive with the Marty-II theory, but predestination paradoxes are primordialy avoided in BTTF (the "Chuck Berry" one doesn't count as a paradox, because Chuck Berry did write the song in the original timeline, he only heard the sound of the song through the phone).

We don't know the reason why Lorraine named his third son "Marty", but probably she had a reason before Marty went back in time.

[Masta23]

I don't understand why Doc got erased straightaway?
I get that Doc never would have gone to that rejuvenation clinic, therefore he wouldn't have lived as long as he did. In the case of old Biff in BTTF 2 (if you watched the deleted scene), he didn't erase straight away. He appears wounded for about a minute whilst time is catching up. Why was Doc's disappearance instantaneous?

[Flyingman356]

We don't know the reason why Lorraine named his third son "Marty", but probably she had a reason before Marty went back in time.

Named after his Great Great Great-Uncle?

[zounds!]

The whole thing with Einstein in episode one "responding" to Ep 2 Marty throwing the stick, is a great example someone pointed out. I think that going by these rules, and knowing that ultimately if it makes a good story they'll do it, makes it even more likely the Marty-speakeasy thing is going to be true.

If you take the whole Doc dissapearing but not the Delorean discussion further, ultimately there are SO many reasons you can come up with for potential paradox's. The biggest problem I have here is that its just so obvious. In BttF 2 there is a similar feeling but its not nearly as pronounced and you can come up with potential reasons why it might work. (The moment 2015 biff hands the almanac to 1955 biff-boom-paradox! as well as others...)

I still have this small feeling that the arsonist is going to be someone we haven't met yet in the game. I go back and forth about who it might be.... last night I was pondering who Edna will eventually make a baby Mr. Strickland with. Maybe thats a clue...

[unicornfoal]

last night I was pondering who Edna will eventually make a baby Mr. Strickland with. Maybe thats a clue...

Edna won't make a baby Mr Strickland. He's her little brother. Her PARENTS will make him... should have ALREADY made him by 1931, if his age in the novelisations is correct. xD

[Carlos85G]

Edna won't make a baby Mr Strickland. He's her little brother. Her PARENTS will make him... should have ALREADY made him by 1931, if his age in the novelisations is correct. xD

I think zounds! means another Mr. Strickland, not THE Mr. Strickland (Gerald).

[church1138]

The whole thing with Einstein in episode one "responding" to Ep 2 Marty throwing the stick, is a great example someone pointed out. I think that going by these rules, and knowing that ultimately if it makes a good story they'll do it, makes it even more likely the Marty-speakeasy thing is going to be true.

Marty couldn't have burnt down the speakeasy, neither could Doc.

That deals with predestination paradoxes...which BTTF has distinguished itself to steer clear of.


Nooo, I think Edna is the one to have done it.

[Triloge]

Nah, it's too easy to guess. We have 3 more episodes, so there could be any number of new or old characters who could have done it.

Here's something interesting: what if we aren't following the original duo? Perhaps they're from a further iteration of the timeline than we think? Perhaps another Marty and Doc already had their adventures in 1931, and we're following the second iterations? What if Marty/Doc DID start the fire, just not these ones? It's sort of like if instead of seeing the movie from the perspective of the Marty we did, we saw it from Lone Pine Marty's POV. He'd be on the same adventures, but changes to the timeline have already been made.

This would explain things, like how Doc is acting. Perhaps he was warned by a future Marty or Doc of some future events, but can't tell Marty so he won't mess things up by doing things differently. Maybe he only came to 1931 in the first place because he was told he was supposed to?

[Carlos85G]

*snip*
Here's something interesting: what if we aren't following the original duo? Perhaps they're from a further iteration of the timeline than we think? Perhaps another Marty and Doc already had their adventures in 1931, and we're following the second iterations? What if Marty/Doc DID start the fire, just not these ones? It's sort of like if instead of seeing the movie from the perspective of the Marty we did, we saw it from Lone Pine Marty's POV. He'd be on the same adventures, but changes to the timeline have already been made.

*snip*

That would only work if, for example, we saw Past-Marty (from his perspective) race his DeLorean against Future-Marty's DeLorean the first time he went to 4:45 p.m.; instead, we followed the same Marty and, the first time he went back, we didn't see that future DeLorean: So, we're always following Present-Marty. From Doc's point of view, he saw the first DeLorean dissapear and then the other DeLorean appeared as Ripple Effect, as if it had been there the whole time.

Of course, if we weren't following Present-Marty, the predestination-paradox theory would work.

[Kamagawa]

You're thinking too 4th-dinemsionally! :p

In Ep. 1 Einstein attacks Edna twice: Before getting in the DeLorean with Edna's shoe (first) and when he returns with Marty (second).

In Ep. 2, just once: When Marty goes back to 4:45 p.m. and throws the stick to Edna (third time).

Even as Marty traveled back in time, this is the third time (from Edna's POV) that Einstein attacks her. There's no predestination paradox here.


How do you know?
Just messing with you now.

Either of us could be right.
Play ep 1 again. past Marty and einstien make the same actions and comments as in ep2.


You said In BttFI, past Doc comments on a stranger helping him help marty (I think he was fixing the DeLorean). Only in BttFII do we learn that it was future Doc that helped him., so you said that 1955 Doc talked about a "stranger" in BTTF1, so where am I getting it wrong?:confused:


I thought he mentioned it or hinted at it in BttFII.


the "Chuck Berry" one doesn't count as a paradox, because Chuck Berry did write the song in the original timeline, he only heard the sound of the song through the phone).

We don't know the reason why Lorraine named his third son "Marty", but probably she had a reason before Marty went back in time.

That was something to think about. It wasn't actually for the thread. sorry for the confusion.
Also, Marty is named after a family member.

[Michael J Fox is Canadian]

Edna won't make a baby Mr Strickland. He's her little brother. Her PARENTS will make him... should have ALREADY made him by 1931, if his age in the novelisations is correct. xD

I'd say by the looks of him in 1955, he looks much older than 24 years old so it's safe to say he's been born in 1931.

That was something to think about. It wasn't actually for the thread. sorry for the confusion.
Also, Marty is named after a family member.

Chuck doesn't hear the entire song marty plays (comes in halfway through and never finishes the song). Similar to the martin mcfly reference, Lorraine obviously liked the name, marty just told them sooner.

Or look at it this way; back to the future part II is my favourite movie of all time and I saw it first in 1991. If someone went back in time to 1989 and showed it to me in theatres, it would still be my favourite movie most likely I just would have been introduced to it sooner. :D

[Carlos85G]

Besides, in the three cases of "predestination paradoxes", there's already an idea behind it: every circumstance happened just as in the original timeline and the only thing Marty did was put it on the right track:

- Goldie already wanted to go to night school and be somebody before Marty went into Lou's Cafe.
- Chuck Berry was already looking for a new sound before Marvin called him.
- Marty already had a relative named Martin and another named Seamus before going to 1955 and meeting his parents.

None of the events depended on Marty going back in time.

Even in the game, Emmett already had the idea for the drill and Marty just helped in actually making it real.

[joek86]

As far as plot holes go there was one in the first movie that always bugged me. Marty meets Goldie Wilson and gives him the idea to become mayor, but he already WAS mayor in the 1985 Marty came from, but how can that be if Marty hadn't gone back to give him the idea yet? And, if he would've done it anyway, then what was the point of that scene being in the movie.

As far as people speculating on the possible meaning of the dream in Ep 1, my idea is probably to epic for anyone to attempt. First of all the reason why both of the 1985's in bttf 2 had to exist was because the existence of 1985a depended on the existence of the time machine and the existence of an alternate time line. However, what if Doc and Marty had inadvertently created alternate time lines every time they used the time machine (which would explain the lack of paradoxes) , but what if all those alternate time lines had a negative effect on the universe? In bttf 2 Doc talks about time lines merging, but what would this appear like to the time travelers who are aware of whats happening?

Like I said, probably to huge of scale for a video game, but who knows, I still have three eps to be surprised by.

[doggans]

And, if he would've done it anyway, then what was the point of that scene being in the movie.

To show how the citizens of a town change over thirty years, and to be funny.

[Follower]

How does the Delorean even exist? Wasn't it destroyed in Part 3? Am I missing something?

[Shadowknight1]

How does the Delorean even exist? Wasn't it destroyed in Part 3? Am I missing something?

Short answer: Talk to Doc while he's in jail in Episode 1.

Long answer: According to Doc, the gigawatt overload that shorted out the time circuits, destroyed the flying circuits, and activated the flux capacitor which sent the DeLorean back to 1885 also sent a duplicate of the DeLorean 70 years forward to the year 2025. This was probably caused by the fact that, unlike the lightning strike that sent the DeLorean to 1985 at the end of BttF, the lightning wasn't channeled through cable and a pole and hook which would have absorbed some of the power going to the flux capacitor. The DeLorean took the full charge, and since 1.21 gigawatts is all that's needed, it's a safe bet with BttF physics that the charge was more than enough to over-"flux" the time machine. On a trip to 2025, Doc learned of the existence of the duplicate time machine, probably traveled back to when it arrived, and prevented it from falling into the hands of Griff Tannen. It is then presumed that Doc repaired the time circuits and had the flying circuits replaced while in 2025 and then began using it as well as the Jules Verne time train. It's currently unknown if the duplication affected Doc as well. Logically speaking, it should have, but logic doesn't always apply to time travel.

[Kamagawa]

As far as people speculating on the possible meaning of the dream in Ep 1, my idea is probably to epic for anyone to attempt. First of all the reason why both of the 1985's in bttf 2 had to exist was because the existence of 1985a depended on the existence of the time machine and the existence of an alternate time line. However, what if Doc and Marty had inadvertently created alternate time lines every time they used the time machine (which would explain the lack of paradoxes) , but what if all those alternate time lines had a negative effect on the universe? In bttf 2 Doc talks about time lines merging, but what would this appear like to the time travelers who are aware of whats happening?

Like I said, probably to huge of scale for a video game, but who knows, I still have three eps to be surprised by.

Sounds similar to my heretic idea that FCB or Marty is the speakeasy arsonist.

I think the dream was a premonition. Perhaps it was the memory changing and thus the timeline slowly changing around Marty. Marty remains unaffected because he still needs to go to 1931 to mess up the timeline. It is as if the time-space continueum is communicating to Marty.
Maby it is indicating that it was actually Doc's fault that he faded out.

[russell19831983]

The main inconsistency I found was this:

When Marty finds Doc in jail, he says something like "why don't I just travel back to before they arrested you, and stop you being near the speakeasy". Doc replies, "that would mean the events that led to you finding out about me being here would never happen, catastrophic end of world etc."

BUT surely saving Doc from jail *by any means* would produce the same result, as the paper would still never have run the story about Carl Sagan getting killed, so Marty would never be able to find out where in time Doc was?

I wondered about that too, i also remember time travel in the bttf movies doesn't work like that, all that happens is an alternate time line is created, so no matter what marty does to save doc will actually just create a new time line where marty doesn't go back in time or at least to the correct date, unless the newspaper simply said carl sagan escaped from jail, which would make sense, and then marty would maybe realize he is the one who freed him.

[BritishChap007]

So what does this mean for Clara? Since Doc disappeared instantly, did his kids and wife also disappear? If Doc grew up to become first citizen brown than he would not have invented the time machine...yadda yadda....saved Clara from killing herself.

[Shadowknight1]

I wondered about that too, i also remember time travel in the bttf movies doesn't work like that, all that happens is an alternate time line is created, so no matter what marty does to save doc will actually just create a new time line where marty doesn't go back in time or at least to the correct date, unless the newspaper simply said carl sagan escaped from jail, which would make sense, and then marty would maybe realize he is the one who freed him.

What is being said is that Doc needs to be in jail so he doesn't return to the DeLorean so the DeLorean goes to 1986 so Marty goes back to 1931.

@BritishChap; Yes, that means that Clara, Jules, Verne, and the time train no longer exist, nor will they unless Marty not only fixes Doc becoming a grand scientist but makes sure that time will flow along the proper course.

Continuity error(?): When you finally get Officer Parker to tell you his problems, he says that it all started on June 14, 1931 when a strange car appeared and ran him off the road while he was chasing down Kid's guys. Marty arrived at 4:00 AM on June 13, 1931. However, I am willing to let it pass because it had been a couple of months since the incident, and he was drunk off his @** while relating the story. Just thought I should bring it up.

[sVybDy]

As far as plot holes go there was one in the first movie that always bugged me. Marty meets Goldie Wilson and gives him the idea to become mayor, but he already WAS mayor in the 1985 Marty came from, but how can that be if Marty hadn't gone back to give him the idea yet? And, if he would've done it anyway, then what was the point of that scene being in the movie.

There's nothing wrong with that scene. At some point in Goldie Wilson's original timeline, something or someone gave him the inspiration to run for mayor. When Marty went back in time, he ended up being the person to do it. But that doesn't mean it was always him.

Which brings up another point unrelated to the above. We never know how this story will end, but the arsonist could wind up being Marty or Doc. If it had been Marty or Doc all along, that would probably be a paradox, but the story could develop in such a manner that Marty will go back to an earlier point in 1931 and somehow cause the arsonist to never burn down/blow up the original speakeasy. In order to correct the timeline, Marty would then presumably have to become the arsonist. As far as history is concerned, the identity of the arsonist is unimportant, so Marty can fill in if need be.

[russell19831983]

only problem now is:



So if the the sitiation is Doc not living till about 100, then how does that not appply in BttF II? They do say it was because they jumped to the present and over the affects of old Biff changing time. Why is moving forward in time different to moving backward in time?

In Bttf part 2 in Biff-controlled-1985, Doc would have disappeared if he was going to die before the age he is now, but he hasn't travelled in time much yet, only to the future and back twice, getting rejuvinated in his first trip to make him look younger, so he's not dead before his time. But after those events and after he finds clara he does go on a lot of time travel adventures and rejuvenates himself a lot and the same with einstein, so that's why einstein and doc disappeared in episode 2 of the game, as they were too old to live in the alternate timeline. Makes sense to me

[Groundsplitter]

In Bttf part 2 in Biff-controlled-1985, Doc would have disappeared if he was going to die before the age he is now, but he hasn't travelled in time much yet, only to the future and back twice, getting rejuvinated in his first trip to make him look younger, so he's not dead before his time. But after those events and after he finds clara he does go on a lot of time travel adventures and rejuvenates himself a lot and the same with einstein, so that's why einstein and doc disappeared in episode 2 of the game, as they were too old to live in the alternate timeline. Makes sense to me
Yes. I think we tend to forget that the last time we saw Doc in BTTF3 he already had two sons, so from his perspective he had already aged some seven years (or so; I can't remember how old Jules and Verne appeared to be) since Marty returned to the future. And judging by what Doc told Marty in episode 1 about him and Clara looking for the best time period to put Jules and Verne in college, even more time must have passed since then. I guess the Doc we see in the game must be at least 15-20 years older than the Doc we see in BTTF2.

[Enigmatic Wonder]

We don't know the reason why Lorraine named his third son "Marty", but probably she had a reason before Marty went back in time.

As we learn in Part 3 he's actually named after a great, great uncle from the 1800's. Been awhile since I've seen the third film but if memory serves me Martin McFly had a bit of a temper and was apparently killed in a knife fight prior to 1885.

As a side note Marty is named after BOTH of the McFly brothers from the 1880's: his full name is Martin Seamus McFly according to the BttF Wiki ^_~


Yes. I think we tend to forget that the last time we saw Doc in BTTF3 he already had two sons, so from his perspective he had already aged some seven years (or so; I can't remember how old Jules and Verne appeared to be) since Marty returned to the future. And judging by what Doc told Marty in episode 1 about him and Clara looking for the best time period to put Jules and Verne in college, even more time must have passed since then. I guess the Doc we see in the game must be at least 15-20 years older than the Doc we see in BTTF2.

Easily the most likely explanation and one that people seem to be having trouble with. Marty when compared to Doc has actually spent very little time outside of 1985. From the time the DeLorean left at 1:35 AM on October 26th, 1985 until his final jump back to 11 AM on October 27th, 1985 we see Marty spend a little more 16 days outside of 1985:

-One week in 1955
-Two hours and fifty nine minutes in 2015
-Five hours and forty two minutes in 1985A
-Four more days in 1955
-Five days in 1885

On the other hand we have Doc. While other works seem to have established him as being born in 1920 this game has now set the date to 1914. As far as I'm concerned since the game has the involvement of Bob Gale and has pretty much been written to be Part 4 I'm going with it's age for Doc.

Now at the end of the original movie Doc says "30 years is a good round number" in regards to going to the future. One can assume he went to October 26th, 2015. However since Einstien was in a suspended animation kennel upon Doc's return to 2015 with Marty it seems to suggest he arrived at an earlier date. Finally when you consider everything Doc did in 2015 prior to getting Marty (the rejuv surgery, DeLorean upgrades, ect) then one has to assume he was in 2015 for a considerable amount of time. Also for all we know Doc made other trips along the timestream prior to learning about what happened to Marty's kids. Once you bring 1885 into the mix it gets even more insane. Considering the ages of Doc's sons and the fact that Doc had to reverse engineer the hover board with 19th century tech in order to come up with a new flux capacitor it could have easily taken Doc about 10 years (the wiki even lists a departure date of 1895 which I assume likely came from either the novel of Part 3 or the animated series). That being said if we assume Jules was about 7 or 8 and Vern was about 4 or 5 then we must assume at least another 15 years have passed for Doc from the end of Part 3 to the time we first see him in 1931.

Once all things are considered it's easy to assume that Doc has spent the better part of 25 years living and traveling to various time periods. This puts Doc at about 96 years old. Assuming he got only one rejuv surgery this mean his life expectancy is about 100-110 years. Now since Doc was excited over finding out who would win the next 25 World Series prior to being shot in the original TP timeline one could assume he knew he was near the end of his life and maybe didn't see himself living past 75 (obviously at this point he'd have no way of knowing about the surgery to prolong his life)

As for why Doc disappears instantly it's simple: by not seeing the film Frankenstein along with Young Emmett's encounter with Marty in episode one his outlook on science his changed. As the DeLorean doesn't disappear itself and merely suffers malfuntions we can assume that "Citizen Brown" still comes up with the idea for it but doesn't complete it and doesn't travel to the future. As a result the paradox this creates erases the Doc we know from existance since he cannot be a 96 year old man without the surgery in 2015. He jumped past a critical point in history and upon arrival vanishes.

Now I know what some folks will say: "Sure Enigma....that all makes sense but why didn't this affect Old Biff the same way?" It's simple really. As the younger version of Biff couldn't act instantly on the info it created a ripple effect that protected Old Biff for a short time. The moment the ripple caught up to him that was it. As he jumped past a critical point (in this case 1996) he was no longer compatible with the timeline and vanished.

Finally some of you will say this: "What about Marty/Doc in 1985A in the film? What about 1986A in episode two? 1986B? How do these timelines affect the DeLorean?" As long as nothing has endangered your existance at that paticular point in time you CAN live that timeline and are simply a visitor. 1985A works for Marty because he has obviously still been born. Doc in this case may have gotten lucky. At that point in time he's only spent at the most a year outside the normal flow of time. Granted the 1985A version is in an asylum but as long as he was alive then our Doc is ok since he's pretty much a version of Doc from the future. The DeLorean in 1985A could have been on the verge of fading away for all we know but we never see it happen so it's possible some kind of ripple effect protected it (I for one don't believe it's immune to timeline changes as it's mafunctions at the end of episode two suggest it can indeed be affected). 1986A is a simple one: we know Marty had to leave town but he's alive. As for Doc the events with Edna upon the next trip to 1931 hadn't happened so he's still safe. Hell for all we know the Doc Brown of 1986A left in '85 and is alive and well in 2015 (hence why Doc didn't fade upon arrival here). As for 1986B that already been covered.


Ok......I know this was a long read. Hope it helped things make a bit more sense into the reason why Doc fades away so quickly. However knowing this series it's likely to just raise additional questions.

Time travel can be such a headache at times can't it? XD

[Carlos85G]

As we learn in Part 3 he's actually named after a great, great uncle from the 1800's. Been awhile since I've seen the third film but if memory serves me Martin McFly had a bit of a temper and was apparently killed in a knife fight prior to 1885.

As a side note Marty is named after BOTH of the McFly brothers from the 1880's: his full name is Martin Seamus McFly according to the BttF Wiki ^_~

We find that out in III that Marty's great-great-grandfather's name is Seamus and that Marty had a great-great-uncle named Martin, but we never knew if George and Lorraine decided to name "Marty" after his great-great uncle (it could have been a nice name they liked in the original timeline), being that Marty didn't know about Seamus' brother, he might have not known why he was named "Marty", so it could just be an amazing coincidence. They never mentioned the reason for Marty's name in the original timeline and that timeline is gone since Part I. About "Seamus", probably same situation, but likely George liked his great-grandfather's name.

It's the most-likely explanation, but not the definitive.

About Ripple Effect and Doc's fate: I fully agree.

[R.I.P-Bill]

Finally some of you will say this: "What about Marty/Doc in 1985A in the film? What about 1986A in episode two? 1986B? How do these timelines affect the DeLorean?" As long as nothing has endangered your existance at that paticular point in time you CAN live that timeline and are simply a visitor. 1985A works for Marty because he has obviously still been born. Doc in this case may have gotten lucky. At that point in time he's only spent at the most a year outside the normal flow of time. Granted the 1985A version is in an asylum but as long as he was alive then our Doc is ok since he's pretty much a version of Doc from the future. The DeLorean in 1985A could have been on the verge of fading away for all we know but we never see it happen so it's possible some kind of ripple effect protected it (I for one don't believe it's immune to timeline changes as it's mafunctions at the end of episode two suggest it can indeed be affected). 1986A is a simple one: we know Marty had to leave town but he's alive. As for Doc the events with Edna upon the next trip to 1931 hadn't happened so he's still safe. Hell for all we know the Doc Brown of 1986A left in '85 and is alive and well in 2015 (hence why Doc didn't fade upon arrival here). As for 1986B that already been covered.

I follow and appreciate your logic here. I would like to point out that in 1986A, it's likely that Doc and Marty left town together. Doc would still be a scientist since he would have seen Frankenstine alone and his entry to the Expo would have lost. He may still have invented the flux capacitor, needed plutonium, manipulated the Lybians, asked Marty to film the experiment, and accidently sent him to the past when the Lybians showed up. One of Biff's brothers mentions George knocking Biff out at the dance. I can't imagine the new Tannen timeline would lead George to do this alone, he'd still need "Calvin's" encouragment. Marty would not have ended up in Old Man Peabody's farm, the mall would still be Twin Pine Mall, but other than that, I don't imagine why the events of the first movie would not have played out with the addition of a longer trek for Marty into town to find 1955 Doc who would still be in Hill Valley. The Tannen Brothers were younger than Biff, they might not have even effected the relationship between Biff and George.

Anyway, my point is that the comment about George laying Biff out at the dance leads me to believe that Doc still has a time machine. If he has a time machine, then he still went to the future, got the rejuvination clinic stuff, and then the events of Part II and III would be far different/nonexistent.

Not a hole in your logic, just an alternative :). I just can't think of a reason why having a Tannen crime family would prolong Doc's life when being some sort of Clockwork Orange figure does not.

[Kamagawa]

"Incarceration is the detention of a person in jail, typically as punishment for a crime. People are most commonly incarcerated upon suspicion or conviction of committing a crime, and different jurisdictions have differing laws governing the function of incarceration within a larger system of justice."

Oh...the way they said it in BttF II, I thought Doc was excecuted or something in rich Biff's timeline.

[Carlos85G]

"Incarceration is the detention of a person in jail, typically as punishment for a crime. People are most commonly incarcerated upon suspicion or conviction of committing a crime, and different jurisdictions have differing laws governing the function of incarceration within a larger system of justice."

Oh...the way they said it in BttF II, I thought Doc was excecuted or something in rich Biff's timeline.

Well, Doc wasn't incarcerated, but commited to an insane asylum by Biff's order in 1983-A.

[russell19831983]

I follow and appreciate your logic here. I would like to point out that in 1986A, it's likely that Doc and Marty left town together. Doc would still be a scientist since he would have seen Frankenstine alone and his entry to the Expo would have lost. He may still have invented the flux capacitor, needed plutonium, manipulated the Lybians, asked Marty to film the experiment, and accidently sent him to the past when the Lybians showed up. One of Biff's brothers mentions George knocking Biff out at the dance. I can't imagine the new Tannen timeline would lead George to do this alone, he'd still need "Calvin's" encouragment. Marty would not have ended up in Old Man Peabody's farm, the mall would still be Twin Pine Mall, but other than that, I don't imagine why the events of the first movie would not have played out with the addition of a longer trek for Marty into town to find 1955 Doc who would still be in Hill Valley. The Tannen Brothers were younger than Biff, they might not have even effected the relationship between Biff and George.

Anyway, my point is that the comment about George laying Biff out at the dance leads me to believe that Doc still has a time machine. If he has a time machine, then he still went to the future, got the rejuvination clinic stuff, and then the events of Part II and III would be far different/nonexistent.

Not a hole in your logic, just an alternative :). I just can't think of a reason why having a Tannen crime family would prolong Doc's life when being some sort of Clockwork Orange figure does not.

The past is set in stone no matter what alternate future is created. Think about bttf part 2 when old biff has changed the past to make him richer, there is still a marty in 1955 when he should have been unable to go there since he was in boarding school, also in the first film near the end you see another marty going back in time, a marty with different memories and experiences going back to 1955, surely the arrival of a different marty would change the past, but it doesn't. I believe doc in the tannen-crime-family timeline would still have gone forward in time and had rejuvination surgery and so lived to approximately the same age as the original doc from the original timeline, so he does not disappear. Only when the past changes so that he does not go forward in time does he disappear, hence why he disappears as soon as he enters the citizen brown timeline.

[Vainamoinen]

When Marty hands Zane George's foto, shouldn't Zane be STUNNED at the quality of the photography? At least it's a black & white one... which doesn't make sense either...

[Shadowknight1]

One of the passwords to get into El Kid has Marty saying "Leggo my Eggo". Eggo waffles didn't get into supermarkets until the early 1950's and they were called Froffles. They were officially named Eggos in 1955. So the slogan wouldn't have been heard of in 1931.

Also, Bruce Springsteen is mentioned, and he isn't even born until 1949.

[R.I.P-Bill]

Boss Hog was also one of the possible passwords and that's certainly out of era. I don't think that's a massive deal though, they didn't really have to make sense. Matches just needed to hear the same syllable usage.

[Vainamoinen]

Right. As long as Marty sais the 1931-anachronistic stuff, it's all right. ;)

[Shadowknight1]

Shouldn't we have seen that building that Kid was shooting at Marty from burning? And technically, shouldn't Marty have been arrested for arson?

[tope1983]

I think much of the confusion concerning altering the past is based on one major problem in the BTTF-universe: it doesn't stick to its own rules.

Basically there are 2 solutions:
PRESUMTION 1:
It's just ONE universe we live in, and when altering the past, we change OUR past, which can influence ourselves and even lead to a paradoxon.
What would be a paradoxon? Anything that changes the LAW OF CAUSE & EFFECT.

PRESUMTION 2:
There are multiple universes. When altering the past you split the universe and create a parallel one which has in terms of interference nothing to do with the universe you are coming from. THUS everything you do in the past WONT influence yourself.
Side-effect: you won't be able to return to your orgin universe when travelling back to the future cause you are stranded in the split one.


In BTTF1 when Marty changes his own past it influences himself. He nearly manages to prevent his own birth which would lead to a paradoxon because when not even born, he can't travel back in time and do that. Like the famous grandfather-paradoxon this doesn't work with the law of cause and effect. The "erasing from existance"-phenomenon sticks to PRESUMTION 1.
But when Marty makes George beating up Biff and alters the love-story of his parents this doesn't affect him. When he travels back to 1985 and sees the difference to the 1985 from the beginning he is not familiar with that which sticks to PRESUMTION 2.
So why did the changes in the past first even influence his existance but later on not even his mind (because he experienced a different youth in a richer household?)

I think that is the major problem with BTTF. It often breaks with its own rules and that is what makes it sometimes so hard to understand.

Personally to understand time-travel it is easier for me to follow PRESUMTION 2. Avoiding a paradoxon makes just sense that the time-traveller finally finds a way back where he can live with more or less problems.
In BTTF1 after Marty erased himself from existance and would have returned to 1985 - without bringing his paretns together - he would be stranded in a world where nobody knows him and he has no home. He would be a stranger forever. Thus it was essential to recreate a 1985 which was as similar to the 1985 he was originally from. It was also important that doc just put on a bullet-proof vest so that nearly everything on TWIN/LONE-PINE-MALL happened as it originally happened. Only this led Marty to travel accidentially back to 1955. If doc would have avoided this by not going to the mall or anything else, Marty wouldn't have travelled back in time. So when the original Marty returns from 1955 he'd face himself and be in a 1985 where two Martys would exist. So no home again.

[unicornfoal]

I think much of the confusion concerning altering the past is based on one major problem in the BTTF-universe: it doesn't stick to its own rules.

One presumption you've missed is that both may be partly true. Paradoxes are definitely possible, and Marty DID change after returning home at the end of the first movie, as in the second and third he was both more confident in general and had that anger issue with being called a chicken. It just took a while to happen, seeing as he didn't remember anything about the new timeline when he first woke up. My theory is that the universe itself generally tries to keep everything as much the same as possible, which has worked fine for me so far. :)

[Scientist93]

In the "I KNEW it!" thread, the member Flah has also proposed an interesting theory: the multiple universes are actually links of a bigger, stable time loop which cycles through (at least partially) parallel linear timelines, and which can expand until it eventually ends (in completing the circle) by a paradox which shows that the consequential changes of time travel had actually caused time travel in the first place. I tried to explain it in some more detail here (the original theory fully quoted): http://www.telltalegames.com/forums/showthread.php?t=23050&page=3

[zounds!]

One presumption you've missed is that both may be partly true. Paradoxes are definitely possible, and Marty DID change after returning home at the end of the first movie, as in the second and third he was both more confident in general and had that anger issue with being called a chicken. It just took a while to happen, seeing as he didn't remember anything about the new timeline when he first woke up. My theory is that the universe itself generally tries to keep everything as much the same as possible, which has worked fine for me so far. :)

I think this is just Marty "growing up." As opposed to his memories/confidence changing as a result of some time thread. I think the reason they added the whole "chicken" thing was just so Marty would learn a life lesson at the end of the 2 and 3rd movies.

[Jennifer]

When Marty hands Zane George's foto, shouldn't Zane be STUNNED at the quality of the photography? At least it's a black & white one... which doesn't make sense either...
It could be a novelty photo like the ones at county fairs where the photo quality is made to look like an older photograph, and Marty liked how it looks so he kept it in his wallet. It wouldn't be too strange. My dad had a novelty picture taken where he's holding a PGA championship trophy and I keep that one with me because I really like how happy he looks in the picture. :)

[unicornfoal]

I think this is just Marty "growing up." As opposed to his memories/confidence changing as a result of some time thread. I think the reason they added the whole "chicken" thing was just so Marty would learn a life lesson at the end of the 2 and 3rd movies.

Yes, the out-of-universe reason IS that it was a retcon thing added so Marty could visibly improve at the end, but in-universe it's definitely something about his trip to 1955 that's changed him.

[Qualcosa]

I'm not going to talk about plotholes/continuity errors/anachronisms but I did notice a silly, not really important, mistake which made me laugh a bit.
Judge Brown can't pronounce his surname. Here's the quote: "The Von Brons have been officers of the court since God heavenly spark first gave rise to man, Emmett!" (yes, he says Von Brons it's not a typo) I'm not german but shouldn't he say "Fon Braun"? He's supposedly german and doesn't know that? lol

[Shadowknight1]

It should be Von Braun.

[Qualcosa]

It should be Von Braun.
Von in german is pronounced Fon. I wrote the pronunciation ;)

[Vainamoinen]

It should be Von Braun.

I think you didn't quite get Qualcosa's drift here. He wasn't talking about spelling, but about pronunciantion - and that English Native speakers tend to speak the "v" in "von Braun" as a /w/ sound instead of an /f/. ;)

[Qualcosa]

I think you didn't quite get Qualcosa's drift here. He wasn't talking about spelling, but about pronunciantion - and that English Native speakers tend to speak the "v" in "von Braun" as a /w/ sound instead of an /f/. ;)
Yes, Germany to the rescue! XD
Btw, did you hear that and laugh about it? hah.

[VeryTori]

The whole time travel thing is confusing but very very interesting!!! I am very excited!!! :)

[cybernetics]

Hi,

Just a thought here..... But Ep 3 main story line is Doc fixing the time machine from references in his book regarding the Delorian & Flux Capacitor.........

Technically as far as I think..... this book and it's contents should not have existed in this timeline neither the the Delorian or F.C.

..... hmmmm ok we have to let the car and fc slip but the book is just too obvious!!!:eek:

[Mercedez]

You're just not not thinking fourth dimensionally! Remember in the flop house where Doc explains all the time lines? Well, this would be time line F where Marty goes back while Doc realizes that Edna and his younger self get together and his ticket stub fades since Edna 'has other ideas'. The news papers still exist that Marty carries, but they change. The Flux capacitor won't ever change, it's already been invented. Though this Doc is really not the Doc from the original timeline that started it all back when Doc was showing Marty the time machine in the very beginning at the Twin Pines Mall Parking lot.

And shameful.. It's DeLorean... XP And it would still exist since this is timeline E Marty going into Timeline F thinking he was going back to the original 1986. Also remember the corrupted timeline in Episode 2 where Doc rams the limo that Kid Tannen is in. Same difference. The timeline is still corrupted but that Marty is not. Nor is Doc.

[cybernetics]

http://www.istockphoto.com/file_thumbview_approve/914882/2/istockphoto_914882-confusing-traffic-sign.jpg

Thanks that um...... yeah.... makes sense

PS sorry for mispelling DeLorean

[Mercedez]

LOL! Think McFly Think! :p:p

[cybernetics]

Arrrrgh just finished Ep3!!! Damn horrible ending... Cliffhanger deluxe

[Mercedez]

Agreed, Now to wait another month for the next part. haha >.<

[Martin McFly]

The reason most of the pages are blank could be an indication that the book is slowly disappearing from existence.

I thought it was a great way to end off the episode. I still wish we could've interacted a little bit more with Citizen Brown though...

[thesporkman]

The flux capacitor drawing still existed because Doc still had his flux capacitor vision in 1955 (or some other date). However, in this timeline, rather than building it, he used it as inspiration for the Hill Valley y-shaped man logo.

[cybernetics]

LMAO ok ok ok I get the point..... I need to brish up on my BTTF knowledge To prove it in fact I have just returned from purchasing BTTF 1, 2 ,3 dvd box set. the 25th special is not available in S.A yet.... as per usual we get it months if not years later!!!

[BlankCanvasDJ]

If the pages of the book are fading from existence, why isn't the DeLorean itself fading?

[cybernetics]

http://www.istockphoto.com/file_thumbview_approve/914882/2/istockphoto_914882-confusing-traffic-sign.jpg

Dont make them explain this pic again LMAO but yeah my point exactly.

[docbrown2015]

Well all! played the whole ep 3 and loved it! Citizen Brown looks awesome like A crossover od Christopher lloyd and Emmett. also reminds me of a Character in Fng of Fighters http://www.fightersgeneration.com/characters2/oswaldxi.jpg

[railfan990]

The Sisters of Mercy Soup Kitchen building in 1931 has a different facade design to what it does in its appearances in the films. The 1885 building has the same facade as the 1955 building, suggesting (based on the different filming locations) that they are intended to be the same building.

While it is possible that the building was damaged pre-1931, rebuilt to a new design (as seen in the game), before being damaged again, and rebuilt to its original 1880s design, it's more likely an oversight by the game designers.

[Vainamoinen]

Ok, now here's an inconsistency that blows my mind from episode 2 to episode 3. Marty returns from 1931 in a hurry. He naturally wears his neat 1931 suit. He crashes into the billboard in 1986, and ta-dah, magically wears his 1986 clothes?!?

/edit: Damn, that wasn't an inconsistency. He changes those in the end sequence of episode 2, still in 1931.

[Nekoai-kun]

I'm not going to talk about plotholes/continuity errors/anachronisms but I did notice a silly, not really important, mistake which made me laugh a bit.
Judge Brown can't pronounce his surname. Here's the quote: "The Von Brons have been officers of the court since God heavenly spark first gave rise to man, Emmett!" (yes, he says Von Brons it's not a typo) I'm not german but shouldn't he say "Fon Braun"? He's supposedly german and doesn't know that? lol

Meh, his Honor is upset, his speech is messed up. Don't you mis-speak when you're angry?

[Nekoai-kun]

If the pages of the book are fading from existence, why isn't the DeLorean itself fading?

That Delorean is a temporal duplicate, therefore in technicality, it shouldn't exist at all! But because it was made by twists in by the flux capacitor.... fluxing improperly, then it's not bound by normal temporal mechanics.

(or maybe it's been fading out gradually while not on camera)

[StarEye]

Well, I can only assume that the car came from a different timeline then the alternate timeline shouldn't affect it. Also, if the car would fade out, then Marty would fade out, because if the DeLorean was never made, then Marty would never get to that timeline in the first place.

The whole series is full of time paradoxes, and is basically a complete mess if you dive deep into it.

"Snake, you can't go around changing the future like that!"

[Gelbs]

Seems totally messed up to me. So Edna married Doc who became a totally different person. Just got the part where Marty met "Citizen" Brown.
Why doesn't Doc remember Marty from 1931?

[puzzlebox]

Why doesn't Doc remember Marty from 1931?

55 years is a looooong time... and Citizen Brown already knows this timeline's Martin McFly, so the most logical assumption for Brown is that Martin has gone a bit whack, not that a guy he met in 1931 has time travelled to an alternate future.

[Martin McFly]

Why doesn't Doc remember Marty from 1931?

Are you asking why he doesn't remember "Harry/Sonny/Michael" from 1931? Note that Emmett only met him once when he was seventeen and fifty five years have passed since then. Do you really think that someone would remember an acquaintance for over fifty years?

[Qualcosa]

Meh, his Honor is upset, his speech is messed up. Don't you mis-speak when you're angry?
Sure do but in that phrase 1) he had a calm angry tone (except for the word "spark", he was totally loud there heh), his speech wasn't fast 2) do you really want to tell me that of all the things you can mis-speak when angry, it's your own name that you mess up? ... oh, c'mon! XD It's clear. The voice actor didn't know or forgot the right pronunciation and TellTale probably didn't notice or if they did they shrugged it off since it's not important. Seriously, don't find excuses for them. I know you are a fan but you can laugh about these things you know! They are funny! :D

Why doesn't Doc remember Marty from 1931?
Would you remember a guy met twice for a few hours over 50 years ago?

[oberlerchner123]

I noticed that Marty seams to be playing his guitar standing up but without a guitar strap. Apparently it just hovers there in front of him.
Even if he held on to it, as soon as he would move his hand on the fretboard he would drop it.
Also where does he carry it when hes not playing it?
Its not in the golf cart, he just pulls it out when talking to Citizien Brown in his office.

Ok, now here's an inconsistency that blows my mind from episode 2 to episode 3. Marty returns from 1931 in a hurry. He naturally wears his neat 1931 suit. He crashes into the billboard in 1986, and ta-dah, magically wears his 1986 clothes?!?

/edit: Damn, that wasn't an inconsistency. He changes those in the end sequence of episode 2, still in 1931.

Why does Marty change his clothes while Doc is driving him home after arriving in Tannen-Mafia-1986 though?
George already saw him wearing the 1931 stuff earlier, wouldnt be weird for him to come back home with them.
I guess Telltale just figured that if Marty doesnt wear his life preserver people wouldnt understand that Marty is back to where he came from. :rolleyes:

[henrydalton]

Ok, so Ep3 - Doc's timeline has been erased. So why when Marty looks at the photo in Citizen Brown's office to convince him, he sports original Marty (himself) and original (Sagan) Doc in the background? Marty would still be there, but Doc (Sagan doc) should have been erased from that picture as Doc's timeline is erased?

[techie775]

technically if doc hooked up with edna like how he did in episode 3 marty should have disappeared too and became mr.goodie twoshoes. But if that happened we wouldn't have a story.

[henrydalton]

technically if doc hooked up with edna like how he did in episode 3 marty should have disappeared too and became mr.goodie twoshoes. But if that happened we wouldn't have a story.


No, because Marty was traveling in the delorian. Goodie Twoshoes Marty does exist in Ep3, he's just not in town, George says so - it's the same as what happens in the other films (when Marty travels to the Biffhoric timeline in BTTF2 he doesn't disappear, and the Biffhoric's Marty is in Switzerland). So it makes sense for Marty to be in that photo, but Sagan Doc should have been erased, as Sagan Doc didn't travel in the delorian with Marty to the Ep3 1985, thus deleting his timeline. As they've made such a point of photos being erased in the story up to now, I'm really surprised that they've left that plot hole in there, unless they're planning on explaining it somehow in future episodes.