E3 - Brief new King's Quest info

[Blind Sniper]

"Grossman said Telltale actually approached Roberta Williams, one of the designers of the original games, to see if she was interested in working on the new one. While she declined by saying she had retired from games, she did offer the development team advice, some of which was "very valuable," according to Grossman. "

http://pc.ign.com/articles/117/1174593p1.html

[Valiento]

Is it just me, or is it strange, and kinda insulting that IGN calls Roberta Williams, just 'one of the designers...?

Rather than pointing out the fact that she was the 'original' creator of King's Quest series, wife of the owner/CEO of Sierra On-line? ...or the fact that she was usually the producer of the series?

Its almost as if she has been forgotten and sent to the dustbins of history. Kinda sad really...

Now the fans can commence with the arguments on if this has the rights to be a true or canonical KQ game or not... ...and I'm sure some fans will start that debate, since there is now confirmation that she has virtually no involvement with the game (and likely little involvement with the story)... We still don't know how much involvment Josh Mandel (or other former Sierra King's Quest developers) have or are giving towards the game...

[MusicallyInspired]

Gee.....that sure was a lot of information.

[Simo Sakari Aaltonen]

Here is a clear example of Telltale doing exactly the right thing for King's Quest. Is someone going to argue otherwise...? :)

[Hero1]

Gee.....that sure was a lot of information.

Yeah I was disappointed by the lack of info on this :(

[chucklas]

Here is a clear example of Telltale doing exactly the right thing for King's Quest. Is someone going to argue otherwise...? :)

There are 2 arguments that can be made saything that they did not do the right thing. First, they knew Roberta Williams would turn them down and so all they did was try to make people think they did the right thing (they got you to buy in). Second, they perhaps wanted to bring her in, she saw their direction and said, "I don't want to work with them on that, the direction is awful!" She then turned them down and once again, it would show the direction TellTale is taking is something she did not want to be a part of. If they would have offered her 100% control of the project, she might have actually come onboard. Until I hear they offered her that, I think it is just for press and they think we as fans are too stupid to know the difference.

[caeska]

If they're going to do it right, they need the same amount of depth and puzzle design in the game that KQ 6 had. In KQ 6 you could use each of the interactions (look/eyes, touch/hands and talk/mouth) on pretty much anything (and there are a lot of things you can interact with) and you would get a unique response from the very funny narrator pretty much every time. And deaths are humorous.

But alas, it's probably going to be a BTTF clone with 5 things to click on, 2 items in your inventory and a generic response for everything.
My fate in humanity is at its all-time low.

[Valiento]

If by a BTTF clone you mean KQ7 split into separate chapters and sold individually you might be right! KQ7 game has zero interactivity, was extremely dumbed down...and too cartoony. Hell the only things you could look at were objects you could pick up, characters to talk to, or things that needed to be manipulated for sake of puzzles...

BTTF has more non important scenery things to examine,
, and get messages than KQ7 had... But still less than KQ5 even (that game had more to look at than the previous games in the series)...

[MusicallyInspired]

If Telltale can overcome the urge to carbon copy the format and look of KQ7 (which closely resembles their business model the most) and instead copy KQ5 or KQ6's approach they'll have already gained some of my respect. But I doubt it. I'm expecting a KQ7 clone. I mean it's right there. Visible in KQ's history as something perfect for Telltale to model and they can say that they're being true to the series without lying! The only problem is, it's the one KQ game that is hated the most (besides MOE).

[Simo Sakari Aaltonen]

This was very nice to see:

When asked whether the new King's Quest would be a full reboot or more like a sequel, Grossman said there's "a lot of canon and it would be a shame to ignore it." ...

[Valiento]

I'd think a nextgen MOE 2 would be hell of a lot more fun than KQ7 clone.... The original is probably my 2nd or third favorite KQ game (although it could have been better), but now there are technologies that could make Roberta's more ambitious ideas (that were ahead of there time or the the technology back then) for that game a reality, and even go beyond them.

But I'd want to see a bit more light hearted fairy tale mixed in as well, less of the epic fantasy/biblical/mythology. More Dreamfall less high fantasy (But some is ok). There needs to be a balance. A sequel does not need to be as atmospheric or dark, it worked for that story, but MOE sequel should have a different direction for the story. There is room for more whimsy, but keeping fighting in in some form. I wouldn't want MOE 2 to be an exact clone of the first.

[thom-22]

There are 2 arguments that can be made saything that they did not do the right thing. First, they knew Roberta Williams would turn them down and so all they did was try to make people think they did the right thing (they got you to buy in). Second, they perhaps wanted to bring her in, she saw their direction and said, "I don't want to work with them on that, the direction is awful!" She then turned them down and once again, it would show the direction TellTale is taking is something she did not want to be a part of. If they would have offered her 100% control of the project, she might have actually come onboard. Until I hear they offered her that, I think it is just for press and they think we as fans are too stupid to know the difference.

Were you really expecting Telltale to offer her 100% control? The idea that Telltale would offer significant control to anyone outside their own management team is unrealistic. TT doesn't work that way, and really, no established game company would. In fact I think it's unrealistic to expect that any of the original KQ creators will have direct involvement in the project at all.

More importantly, I don't believe that's an appropriate standard to which to hold Telltale. I think it's theoretically possible for a development team that does not include the original designers to produce a game that fits into the KQ universe and captures what the fans most enjoyed about the existing KQ games. (Whether Telltale can or wants to actually produce one is, of course, an entirely separate question, one discussed ad infinitum in many other threads.)

So I don't see any reason to be ungenerous to Telltale on this, especially since there is precedent with Ron Gilbert and Monkey Island. I have no trouble believing that Telltale would have liked to have had Roberta come in for a day and talk about KQ with the staff, and that she declined for her own personal reasons. I think they could ask the same from one or more of the other people who worked on KQ at Sierra, and while it might not have any direct influence on the final product, it won't be just for show either.

[Valiento]

The only cartoony art style that could work I think, on levels of nostalgia, would be something that harkens back to the old AGI games. Think yellow people (The Simpsons meets King's Quest). KQ2 with smooth lines, less jaggies. As a bonus you could unlock a 3-D '8-bit'-style model for Graham as an easter egg!

[MusicallyInspired]

I'd think a nextgen MOE 2 would be hell of a lot more fun than KQ7 clone.... The original is probably my 2nd or third favorite KQ game (although it could have been better), but now there are technologies that could make Roberta's more ambitious ideas (that were ahead of there time or the the technology back then) for that game a reality, and even go beyond them.

I agree fully. A modern King's Quest RPG/fighter would be fantastic. But that's most likely not going to happen.

Were you really expecting Telltale to offer her 100% control? The idea that Telltale would offer significant control to anyone outside their own management team is unrealistic.

Which is one of the reasons exactly why I've been against this from the start.

The difference between these two opposing points is the belief that it's not possible for Telltale to create something in Sierra's style therefore there will be compromises to fit the business model and appeal to a wide range of gamers and non-gamers to make the biggest profit possible. They simply haven't proven themselves worthy or able to continue a Sierra series.

I see no reason to be optimistic at all. I'm curious to see what'll end up happening, but I'm not getting my hopes up.

[Valiento]

They promised us we would see more at E3 and didn't even bother including any concept art... bah...!

[Diduz]

I'm expecting a KQ7 clone.

Well, a KQ7 clone would still be better than BTTF, gameplay-wise. :p
It was easier than the previous entries in the series, but you had to solve puzzles to finish the game.
I agree with KQ6 being the best one, though. ;)

[MusicallyInspired]

I never said KQ6 was the best. :p

[caeska]

But I did. And KQ6 is the best game.

[MusicallyInspired]

KQ6 would've been the best.....if KQ5 hadn't existed. ;)

[caeska]

You say KQ5 is best, I say KQ6 is...but which opinion is the right one?

[MusicallyInspired]

None of course. Which is why I mentioned both of them as my example for referencing a proper KQ game's style.

[Valiento]

To say KQ7 has puzzles is almost stretching it, sure it has a couple of good ones. But most of the puzzles in the game are glorified fetch quests. Characters tell you what they need, and what to do, and then you go do it, bring stuff back. Beyond that it was a matter of looking for sparkly hotspots on the screen to let you know what you could manipulate.... Then for that matter each chapter really only had two or three items you pick up, and those items were more or less only useful for that chapter... And you could start the game from any chapter! The one or two items that could be missed in a previous chapter, appear in a different location if you missed it previously, for example the fragrant flower.

Seriously many reviewers were harsh with that game, many saying it was more like watching a cartoon movie catering to small children then playing a puzzle solving adventure game.

The only thing I can say for it is it did offer a couple of alternate puzzle solutions for one or two puzzles, such as how to get rid of the scorpion. But then they released version 2.0 which dumbed it down even further complete removing a few timer puzzles and the deaths that went along with them! For example the volcano no longer has a chance of erupting in the final chapter!

[Diduz]

I remember KQ7 got me stuck on a musical puzzle (I cannot recognize and/or replay notes, it'a problem of mine) and on the whole


"taking the faux shop with a grain of salt". I'm Italian, so I had some problems in getting a solution out of an idiom.


:o

[Valiento]

Ya the music puzzles, gave me some trouble as well. I knew what I needed to do, the dragonettes made it obvious. But not that good at remembering the notes or the order, I suppose. Maybe don't have the best ear for music. But that's not really an adventure game-style puzzle (it doesn't involve inventory items), at least traditional adventure games. It's more of a puzzle game type puzzle. Or at least puzzle/adventure hybrid, like Seventh Guest. There was Loom, though that made the puzzles into that type of puzzle only...

Btw I'd say that BTTF has puzzles, even adventure game style puzzles. But the puzzles are pretty much ripped from the cliched stale depths of puzzles used and abused almost twenty years ago. So far many of them have been variations on the hand gestures puzzle in Monkey Island II, or the even more stale slide the newspaper under the door to get a key. Probably the most over used adventure game trope from the adventure game design hand book. These puzzles might have been original decades ago but now those ideas no longer present a challenge. There is seriously a lack of the originality in puzzle game design anymore.

[Blackthorne519]

I don't think Roberta Williams would have come back even if offered 100% control. Ken has said, many times, that they have no interest in that any more. They seem to be very occupied with their sailing and traveling, and I don't think she wants to go back to working on games.

I'm not going to speculate anything that Tell Tale is doing with this until I see SOMETHING from them.


Bt

[Valiento]

She used to make escapist adventures, now she can afford to take real adventures to escape....

To be honest Roberta's greatest strength was pushing the adventure game genre forward by pushing the technology forward. She was more about presentation less about story. She looked at technology and figured how to use that technology to design a better game, the games were designed to take advantage of the technology. There was a time when she pushed the whole computer industry forward (getting people to buy into new devices and hardware just to be able to play her games). They were uber tech demos. Now she would be so far behind that I'm not sure she would have ideas that would be revolutionary or original. She probably would be clueless, as I understand it she doesn't even really play games at all, so she likely wouldn't have any ideas how to push things further.

I'm pretty sure almost anything that comes out will be more retro for nostalgia purposes rather than truly innovative in themselves. The whole episodic gaming and digital download technologies are no longer innovative. Roberta also wanted to push the series toward massively multiplayer gaming, but that is no longer truly innovative idea. The lack of innovation would be missing out on one of the essential aspects of being a Roberta Williams or KQ game.

[MusicallyInspired]

That's an interesting point, actually. King's Quest was the flagship of Sierra for a reason. It showcased all of Sierra's newest technology. Innovated it even. Furthermore, created it out of a "what if we could do this?" attitude. Very few game companies have this attitude nowadays. Least of all Telltale. They innovate nothing. You can praise them all you want but it's true. They do not innovate.

Maybe that's another one of the big reasons why we loved King's Quest so much. It showcased new methods of game design that weren't possible until King's Quest invented it. That's something Telltale can never follow up on unless they change their whole business strategy as a company.

Thought-provoking post, Valiento.

[Valiento]

I think only Nintendo has the innovative spirit anymore and that is shown through their game and system design and flagship games. Even if it comes off being gimmicky at times.

Telltale was only really innovative their first year, when they created the quick release episodic format, that other companies are now copying. Valve attempted the episodic distribution as well but really failed. Valve got the whole digital download service going through Steam though.

Now Telltales' 'claim' to 'innovation' has something to do with a Pilot program to give aspiring designers a chance to create new games series.
http://ixdasf.ning.com/forum/topics/ui-designer-games-award

[MusicallyInspired]

(I guess you meant Valve when you said Steam)

Yeah. Nintendo are the only ones left. And they pay through the nose for it seemingly. I guess it's not surprising no one else dare try. In the words of Ken Williams: "You can't innovate without taking risks."

[Valiento]

Innovation is both a curse and a blessing. It can lead to great things that draw a greater audience to the product, but there is also a risk that it might alienate long time customers, pushing them away, if they are resistant to change.

[MusicallyInspired]

But the benefits of the potential rewards should always outweigh the risk. Developers are just as afraid of change as consumers are.

[Chyron8472]

I never said KQ6 was the best. :p

But I did. And KQ6 is the best game.

KQ6 would've been the best.....if KQ5 hadn't existed. ;)

You say KQ5 is best, I say KQ6 is...but which opinion is the right one?

Mine is. :cool: KQ6 is the best.

I hate Cedric, all of the animal-voice acting, and the glut of nonsensical puzzles in KQ5 like using cheese to make the machine at the end work.

[Valiento]

I still wonder if the cheese machine is a reference to some obscure story somewhere... I may never know! :p

I did come across this;
Cheez powered time machine (http://vimeo.com/1213780) But that's apparently something new, some graphic novel. Maybe Roberta was ahead of her time?

Many of those animals in KQ5 were Roberta Williams herself playing the roles! :D. It was innovative at the time, as it was one of the earliest full-voice CD games on the market. Impressive at the time, but for some hasn't aged well. It also was the first sierra game to bring about the end of the parser. Thought many older fans of the series, criticized that change thinking it dumbed the game down, making things easier!

KQ6 brought rotoscoped animation (with live actors), an impressive for the time 3D introduction scene by Kronos, several well known and respected actors (so it was getting closer to the multimedia Hollywood ideal that Ken and Roberta wanted Sierra to move towards). Not sure if it ever got any criticism?

The thing about inovation, it also gave us things like KQ7 which brought feature length quality animation to computers aimed at a younger more family friendly audience (while her other game at the time, Phantasmagoria pushed movie quality live action, went more towards the mature audiences), and streamlined the interface (reducing it down to a single cursor + inventory), and MOE (which was Roberta's push to bring hardware 3-D graphics and action to PC and the adventure game genre). Both have been controversial to some of older fans, while also bringing new fans to the series.

[philthethrill]

I found this article on Destructoid which says that Telltale is keeping the whole game a secret and won't release it until 2012. http://www.destructoid.com/e3-roberta-williams-advised-telltale-on-king-s-quest-203396.phtml

[caeska]

I hate Cedric, all of the animal-voice acting, and the glut of nonsensical puzzles in KQ5 like using cheese to make the machine at the end work.

But but, KQ5 had the poiiiisonous (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9p30heMs8UU) snake in it. KQ6 is still the best, but Cedric is cool nonetheless.

[Mr. Freeze]

Ok, really guys?

You're making all these hasty assumptions based on absolutely nothing and it's honestly making you look like you're hoping that this game is gonna come out bad.

I mean, at least TellTale is trying... of course they probably knew that the likelihood of Robert accepting was slim to none, but they did get some valuable advice out of it so where's the harm in that? Maybe it's something that will help them capture the essence of the games...

[Chyron8472]

We don't hope it will turn out bad, we anticipate that it will. There is a difference.

Granted, there's nothing wrong with being hopeful and open-minded. I'm just... skeptical, that's all.

[Valiento]

I don't know yet, I'll still probably find it fun on some level. I've enjoyed most Telltale offerings so far, and they are good at crafting stories. Even if their games use every cliche in the adventure game puzzle design book. Ideas that were already seen in countless games years ago.

[MusicallyInspired]

I just don't see this as Telltale trying to serve the community by bringing back a beloved classic for the fans. I see it as them taking advantage of a fanbase by churning out another lifeless puzzle-less episodic game to make a buck. Don't get me wrong, I hope I'm proven wrong. And I don't think all of Telltale is like this, just the ones in charge.

It's just that King's Quest was known and loved for things I don't believe Telltale can ever deliver. Innovation, difficulty, and consequences.

[JuntMonkey]

That's an interesting point, actually. King's Quest was the flagship of Sierra for a reason. It showcased all of Sierra's newest technology. Innovated it even. Furthermore, created it out of a "what if we could do this?" attitude. Very few game companies have this attitude nowadays. Least of all Telltale. They innovate nothing. You can praise them all you want but it's true. They do not innovate.

Maybe that's another one of the big reasons why we loved King's Quest so much. It showcased new methods of game design that weren't possible until King's Quest invented it. That's something Telltale can never follow up on unless they change their whole business strategy as a company.

Thought-provoking post, Valiento.

I've been saying this for years now. Adventure games were popular (relatively speaking) back in the day because they were pushing the technology. When you wanted to show off your new 386, you bought the latest King's Quest game. Even after the advent of first-person shooters, games such as Phantasmagoria and Gabriel Knight 2 came in and were the best-looking games around.

Current fans of the genre like to say that it was always all about the story and characters, because they want to feel as if adventure games are the "intelligent" genre and that they are more cultured than those adolescent FPS players. But as I've said ad nauseum, that is not the case.

There was a thread in the main forum here recently about multiplayer adventure games. Many people pooh-poohed the idea, saying that cooperative adventure games are not possible for various reasons. There was a thread elsewhere about the possibility of open-world adventure games. This was pooh-poohed as well, because adventure games simply cannot be done in an open-world environment.

That's the anti-innovative thinking that we're dealing with, and it's why the genre has been in this gross rut for over a decade. It's arguably devolved since 1999, and until the players and developers get out of this box and start innovating again, adventure games are going to remain a cute little niche casual genre.

[Waltuck]

Must be a lot of infos on this, what's the rest?

[Rather Dashing]

Mine is. :cool: KQ6 is the best.
All of you are wrong. King's Quest III is easily the best.

[caeska]

All of you are wrong. King's Quest III is easily the best.

Did it have poisonous snakes in it?

[Valiento]

I've been saying this for years now. Adventure games were popular (relatively speaking) back in the day because they were pushing the technology. When you wanted to show off your new 386, you bought the latest King's Quest game. Even after the advent of first-person shooters, games such as Phantasmagoria and Gabriel Knight 2 came in and were the best-looking games around.

Current fans of the genre like to say that it was always all about the story and characters, because they want to feel as if adventure games are the "intelligent" genre and that they are more cultured than those adolescent FPS players. But as I've said ad nauseum, that is not the case.

There was a thread in the main forum here recently about multiplayer adventure games. Many people pooh-poohed the idea, saying that cooperative adventure games are not possible for various reasons. There was a thread elsewhere about the possibility of open-world adventure games. This was pooh-poohed as well, because adventure games simply cannot be done in an open-world environment.

That's the anti-innovative thinking that we're dealing with, and it's why the genre has been in this gross rut for over a decade. It's arguably devolved since 1999, and until the players and developers get out of this box and start innovating again, adventure games are going to remain a cute little niche casual genre.

Another thing I seem to recall Roberta or Ken mentioning in an interview that many of the things we now consider standard Adventure game traits, like the item trading and inventory were created due to limitations in the technology. It was a way to infuse interactivity in a technology that didn't allow for much direct onscreen player interaction (somewhat ironic that those features are considered by some fans of the genre as epitomizing higher levels of interactivity in games via everday objects, as opposed to "shooting/killing" in many other genres).

When technology became advanced to the 'half-life' era or even N64 action/adventures, and some RPGS, Ken was praising those as the future (and that adventure game as people knew it was going to be dead), as those kinds of games infused the kind of interactivity the Williams only dreamed about back when they started Adventure games. He believed in time those types of games would replace adventure games.

Roberta believed the important thing was creating towards some kind of 'interactive story' (she didn't really like the term 'games') utilizing latest technology, and opening up new forms of interactivity for the user. For a while there was a dream to merge and overtake Hollywood in the story telling industry. That ideal lead to things like Phantasmagoria and other interactive movie style games from Sierra (which argueably have more to do that the average FMV game). These games were like watching a movie, but essentially making the 'player' the director, controlling the direction of the movie.
Did it have poisonous snakes in it?
Well it does have snakes, and Medusa!

[Sinaz20]

There are 2 arguments that can be made saything that they did not do the right thing. First, they knew Roberta Williams would turn them down and so all they did was try to make people think they did the right thing (they got you to buy in). Second, they perhaps wanted to bring her in, she saw their direction and said, "I don't want to work with them on that, the direction is awful!" She then turned them down and once again, it would show the direction TellTale is taking is something she did not want to be a part of. If they would have offered her 100% control of the project, she might have actually come onboard. Until I hear they offered her that, I think it is just for press and they think we as fans are too stupid to know the difference.

I just want to point out that none of this post is accurate. It's just pessimistic.

All of our communication with designers related to previous King's Quest games has been positive.

Our designers recognize that King's Quest cannot be handled in the same fashion as games like Monkey Island and Sam n Max.

We reached out to Roberta Williams to get insight about what she felt was core to the games rather than simply relying on our experience from the gamer side of the screen.

She declined to participate because she has truly put the series behind her. She supports our endeavors.

[chucklas]

I just want to point out that none of this post is accurate. It's just pessimistic.



I would say more cynical, but that's just semantics. As for pessimistic, I am. Until we actually see something, anything for that matter, what else can we do? We can speculate and worry. You guys have not done anything to give me any reason to be optimistic.

[Mr. Freeze]

They haven't done anything to make you pessimistic, either. The only thing they've released about the game is that they approached Roberta Williams about it. And what did you do upon hearing that information? You took the press release and came up with two completely wild theories based on absolutely nothing at all (and don't say they were just theories, you explained what you really thought at the end of your post).

I mean, I guess you COULD say you're basing your cynicism off of telltale's past games, but Sinaz already clarified that the developers are well aware that they have to take a different direction with this game. So, you really don't have any ground to stand on at the moment.

[chucklas]

I don't base my cynicism on anything except I don't really trust what people say. Thats more of my personality than anything else. I am waiting to see what they are doing before I make any conclusions. Without seeing anything, I don't know what they are doing and can only speculate. I assume then worst and thus can't be disappointed in the end, perhaps happily surprised even.

[MusicallyInspired]

Don't follow blind Telltale faith until they actually show something worthwhile. Talk is cheap, too cheap where PR is concerned. Always.

[Rather Dashing]

I don't dislike JD Straw. I don't consider him a liar.

...but frankly, I can't believe a subjective assessment of an unfinished product from a designer whose only other work I've played was Back to the Future: Episode 3. I don't think he WANTS to provide something that will disappoint other King's Quest fans, but I don't have faith that his own ideas or the demands of higher management or simple time crunch won't work to undermine that ideal. I am WATCHING the development, I am not entirely giving up on it nor am I going to directly insult anyone working on the project. But I do ask for the understanding that, as adventure gamers, we feel we have been shunned and burned too badly once already, that this company has yet to really prove itself with a Sierra franchise, and our skepticism leads us to want to see something substantial. The PR message has to be combined with advertising and gameplay-related press, as soon as these things can be released, featuring the various features and design philosophies that separate this from other Telltale games, Back to the Future ESPECIALLY.

[chucklas]

The PR message has to be combined with advertising and gameplay-related press, as soon as these things can be released, featuring the various features and design philosophies that separate this from other Telltale games, Back to the Future ESPECIALLY.

Exactly. When they first announced that they would be making a KQ game, they hinted that more was to come at E3. All we got was a PR message with nothing else. I am waiting to see what they will show us with regards to game play, etc. and until they do, I will continue to be pessimistic and cynical. Prove me wrong TellTale, don't just say that I am wrong, show me something.

[Beacon80]

I'm of the exact opposite point of view. Everything I've seen gives me reason to believe that Tell Tale will produce a worthy game in the King's Quest series.

There's two key elements that give me this belief:
1) Tales of Monkey Island. This game fit right into the style of the earlier Monkey Island games, and might just beat out Curse for my favorite Monkey Island game (haven't played it in years, so it's hard to be sure). This says something important about Tell Tale Games. They didn't just crank out another Sam & Max game and call it Monkey Island. They tailored the game to fit the existing series. I see no reason they won't continue to do the same here.
2) I don't put the King's Quest games on a pedestal. I've been playing through them again recently (made it through the first five so far), and while most of them are enjoyable, they're not these perfectly executed gems some people seem to think they are. King's Quest V, in particular, was not a lot of fun for me, despite fond childhood memories of the game. I think a lot of people here have painted over the flaws, creating ideal games in their mind that nothing TTG (or Roberta Willaims, for that matter) could compete with.

::Raises his shield and prepares to be attacked::

[MusicallyInspired]

Regardless of their flaws, we love the KQ games just the way they are......except for KQ7 and MOE, for the most part (I don't actually have a problem with the latter).

[Beacon80]

Don't get me wrong. I'm a fan of the games, or else I wouldn't be here. I've just noticed a lot of people hold up the King's Quest games like they're an impossible standard for TTG to reach.

[Rather Dashing]

It's less like they're an impossible standard, and more like they're a standard that Telltale simply doesn't WANT to reach. We've all read about Dave Grossman's mother-in-law one too many times and seen the catastrophic effect this kind of perspective has had on the company's output. It's also true that the King's Quest games were, frankly, the most technologically advanced of their time, and Telltale's will be....let's say less than that for the modern generation.

[Beacon80]

Technology for technology's sake doesn't make a great game. Cutting edge technology would add very little to an adventure game at this point. I mean, I loved ADGI's remake of King's Quest 2. Some minor issues aside, I think it sits well among the official entries in the series, but it's hardly pushing the envelope when it comes to technology.

As for the articles about his mother-in-law, I hadn't read them before. Having looked over them, I'm forced to ask "so what?" Unless I'm missing something, he discovered that non-gamers have difficulty figuring out how to play an adventure game, and managed to make Sam & Max: Season 2 more intuitive for them while not sacrificing gameplay. If this means the tutorial scene at the beginning involves Graham explaining how the inventory system works, I'll survive.

[thom-22]

It's less like they're an impossible standard, and more like they're a standard that Telltale simply doesn't WANT to reach.

This is my thought (concern, reason for skepticism), too. Not just because of the mother-in-law thing but also how Telltale has been defining itself in what seems like every recent interview/article I've seen as producers of cinematic games focused on narrative and character. That's a long way from the "focus on the under-represented adventure game market" that Telltale adopted at its inception.

If you focus too much on cinematic presentation, a cohesive single-experience narrative and stimulating emotional investment in the character(s), it seems to me the natural result is a narrow-pathed gameworld with limited interactivity and simplistic obstacles to advancement. I don't believe it was an accident, or a failure of execution, that this is exactly how BTTF turned out, and why gameplay was lacking at various points in the The Devil's Playhouse for that matter.

Until there is direct evidence that Telltale intends to focus KQ development on things that make for good games, rather than on things that make for good movies, I believe skepticism is entirely warranted.

[Beacon80]

thom, you make a good argument, and I definitely agree with you on the need to balance cinematics with good, solid gameplay. I certainly don't blame you for being concerned or skeptical.

I'm not trying to convince anybody to change their ways or anything. It's too early to really know anything about the game one way or another, but I'm optimistic. Life's more fun that way.

[corruptbiggins]

Regarding the lack of info at E3 I feel that the schedule for this game was pushed back a bit due to the delay of Jurassic Park.

[Hero1]

I think there are some good points in this thread. We know Telltale's focus is story, so we are all interested in how they will handle the gameplay for a King's Quest game.

[GuybrushWilco]

Maybe it just means that the game will not reference back too much to the originals, so it will be a good jumping on point. I'm glad they approached Williams, as I believe it shows that they have a genuine interest in trying to keep it in the same vein as the older games.

[Daventry]

I'm of the exact opposite point of view. Everything I've seen gives me reason to believe that Tell Tale will produce a worthy game in the King's Quest series.

There's two key elements that give me this belief:
1) Tales of Monkey Island. This game fit right into the style of the earlier Monkey Island games, and might just beat out Curse for my favorite Monkey Island game (haven't played it in years, so it's hard to be sure). This says something important about Tell Tale Games. They didn't just crank out another Sam & Max game and call it Monkey Island. They tailored the game to fit the existing series. I see no reason they won't continue to do the same here.
2) I don't put the King's Quest games on a pedestal. I've been playing through them again recently (made it through the first five so far), and while most of them are enjoyable, they're not these perfectly executed gems some people seem to think they are. King's Quest V, in particular, was not a lot of fun for me, despite fond childhood memories of the game. I think a lot of people here have painted over the flaws, creating ideal games in their mind that nothing TTG (or Roberta Willaims, for that matter) could compete with.

::Raises his shield and prepares to be attacked::

I just want to say that the term "flaw" is very subjective, especially when it comes to gaming. I love King's Quest V for the very same reasons that other people seem to dislike it...

[wilco64256]

I just want to say that the term "flaw" is very subjective, especially when it comes to gaming. I love King's Quest V for the very same reasons that other people seem to dislike it...

I just have to say how much I appreciate your signature.

[Daventry]

I just have to say how much I appreciate your signature.

Thanks! I just didn't want to be associated with someone else. Unfortunately the Daventry name was already taken on those other forums... but I'm only active on this one and the Sierra Help Forums anyway, so it wasn't too big of a loss.

[Cygnata]

King's Quest 8: Mask of Eternity, follows one of the inhabitants of Daventry as he fights to save the world, and King Graham and his family, after most of the humans have been turned to stone.

It was very Doom-esque, with few true puzzles, and hence is not considered by fans to be a true sequel. It IS official canon, though.

[MusicallyInspired]

It was nothing like Doom.

[Anakin Skywalker]

It was a hybrid of a whole bunch of different things. It should've been a massive hit, KQ name or not. It was innovative.

[BagginsKQ]

It was very Doom-esque, with few true puzzles, and hence is not considered by fans to be a true sequel. It IS official canon, though

It's actually has just as many true puzzles as many of the early KQ... they just get overshadowed by the amount of new action content, like the rpg combat, jumping, the Torin's Passage style tile puzzles, and box pushing... The game is absolutely huge and takes several hours/days to complete...