Chuck is Vernon's brother.

[george110]

I am completely surprised not one person mentioned this or how it is not mentioned in the wikia, but Chuck is a lot bigger of a character than it seems.

Play episode 3 again, and when you first enter the driver's room and see the dead body, remember how the guy was not killed by the walkers, nor turned into one, but was MURDERED? He didn't kill himself, someone shot him from the outside as evidenced by the glass. Now in this room, did anyone look at the photograph? It was a man with his wife and two kids. Guess who that was. Yes, Chuck.

Why would his picture be attached in the driver's room? Remember how Chuck just so happened to be living at the train? How the train somehow stopped on its own and was shut off? Remember how he strangely happened to be in the sewer with a gun that was never seen before, and how Vernon questioned Lee about the train? Is it weird that both Chuck and Vernon look alike? Lastly, did you notice how the picture disappeared after talking to Chuck for the first time and heading to the driver's room to find it missing? This cannot be a coincidence. Chuck used to work as a train driver, and Vernon knew about it.


So, what am I trying to get exactly? Well here is what I think. Chuck lied to Lee about not seeing his family in fourteen years. For all we know, he was probably on the train the day of the outbreak and after seeing what happened and the train stopping to possibly avoid hitting a car (seen next to the train where that zombie was inside still attached to the seat belt.) Chuck, who knew what was going on and was too afraid to take chances, shot the driver and shut off the train, using it as shelter. Possibly fearing death, he chose to stay indoors, going out only to find food and whatnot, drinking to keep him calm, assuming his family are dead.

Seeing how Kenny had the same drinking habits, this is very likely. Now here is where Vernon's story comes to mind:

Vernon and Chuck knew of their occupations and area of residence. When Chuck chose to fight off the walkers himself, he looked very confident. It appears that he still had his gun all along and used it to defend himself from the horde of zombies. Then, he went to go meet his brother and the cancer group on his own and possibly get them to help Lee. Realizing he was outnumbered and could not make it in time, he took his life with the last bullet of his gun.

Vernon, knowing of Chuck's occupation, went to the train, possibly to see if he was still there and also to see if they can use that as a method of transportation. As we don't know what happened to the group, this is probably the case.


Anyone want to say why you agree/disagree? Feel free to discuss.

[xXNinjaScoreXx]

I'm speechless right now, I want to disagree but...but...I DON'T KNOW ANYTHING ANYMORE D:

[thestalkinghead]

he wasn't shot, his head hit the front window when the train crashed, and the picture going missing was a mistake

[TheNNerdGamer]

the dead guy in the train most likely crashed and died on impact while hitting the glass

[george110]

he wasn't shot, his head hit the front window when the train crashed, and the picture going missing was a mistake

how can you guarantee that?

[Rock114]

The train driver's death was caused by blunt force trauma he recieved from slamming into the glass hard enough to break it. The train stopped suddenly because something collapsed on the rear of it during a spot of chaos (I think). The train wasn't stopped, it was STUCK. There's a reason Lee had to pry that boxcar loose from the rest. I'm fairly certain that Chuck dying so close to Vernon's group was pure coincidence, as the house, church, and riverfront are all within a few blocks of each other. He likely ran into the sewers, but was either pursied by the walkers or encountered even more once he reached the sewers. He tries to evade them, but in the close quarters he gets cornered, possibly bitten, then takes his own life with his last bullet. The proximity to Vernon's group was pure coincidence.

[thestalkinghead]

how can you guarantee that?

i heard one of the people that made it say the picture was a mistake (i think it was on twitch.tv King Foom destructoid lets play with the telltale developers) , it is actually a different scene altogether when it goes missing and they forgot to put it in, and the way he dies is just based on the evidence we saw which did not include a bullet hole in the head but did include a misshapen head, a crashed train and a broken train window (incredibly hard to break) but of course that isn't concrete proof, just enough for me :)

[Christoaster]

No... just no... You are thinking WAYY to much into this... Can't really blame you though, since the time between the release dates give us plenty of time to come up with possible theories, even some of the farfetched ones like this one.

[george1120]

made a new account due to name typo... xD


Anyway, I can agree with the train driver's possible head trauma, but still, Chuck was the guy on the picture. There's no denying it.

Also, the train was indeed shut off, that's why there was that whole objective that took several minutes which required us to find out how to get it up and running.

[Zeruis]

It seems possible that Chuck is Vernon's brother, but I actually thought that the police officer in episode 1 had more of a physical similarity to Vernon. I used to think that they were brothers.

[thestalkinghead]

made a new account due to name typo... xD


Anyway, I can agree with the train driver's possible head trauma, but still, he was the guy on the picture. There's no denying it.

Also, the train was indeed shut off, that's why there was that whole objective that took several minutes which required us to find out how to get it up and running.

i don't know exactly how a train works but i would asume there are certain safety measures built into the train to stop catastrophic failures, so my assumption would be that a safety kill switch stopped the engine (when it crashed) and that the start up procedure was just how that train is always started
but i did find it suspicious that the start up steps had been cut off the notebook but that could have happened anytime

[Viser]

I thought Kenny took the picture down, because well, he was the train's... conductor? Driver? Anyhow, his family had just died, and it was the picture of a happy family (as far as I can remember, I could be wrong), so it makes sense he would take it down so he could try to get the death of his family out of his mind. It's what made sense to me when I noticed it wasn't on the wall anymore.

[Rock114]

I would assume that the train shut off on its own, or Chuck turned it off after the accident so it wouldn't attract walkers. If Chuck was going to do something to the picture, he had three months to do it. I find it entirely more likely that Kenny took the picture and threw it away. Notice how we see the picture there while trying to get the train started up, but the next time we have the chance to see it is after Duck and Kat's deaths, where it has suddenly vanished. Kenny probably didn't want to see a happy, smiling family after his own had been taken away from him so he got rid of the photo.

Vernon mentioned the train because that was where the herd was coming into town. The herd followed the train, and thus would have hit Savannah from the railroad tracks. As a doctor, Vernon would have had little to nothing to do with trains before the apocalypse. He might be trying to get his group to the train and get them away from Savannah, but it isn;t because of some unknown link to Chuck.

[george1120]

I would assume that the train shut off on its own, or Chuck turned it off after the accident so it wouldn't attract walkers. If Chuck was going to do something to the picture, he had three months to do it. I find it entirely more likely that Kenny took the picture and threw it away. Notice how we see the picture there while trying to get the train started up, but the next time we have the chance to see it is after Duck and Kat's deaths, where it has suddenly vanished. Kenny probably didn't want to see a happy, smiling family after his own had been taken away from him so he got rid of the photo.

Vernon mentioned the train because that was where the herd was coming into town. The herd followed the train, and thus would have hit Savannah from the railroad tracks. As a doctor, Vernon would have had little to nothing to do with trains before the apocalypse. He might be trying to get his group to the train and get them away from Savannah, but it isn;t because of some unknown link to Chuck.

i believe the photo was missing from after chuck's appearance, and that was before kat and duck died.

[george1120]

and think about it, that train driver's head was blown off, didn't seem like a head injury.

[Rock114]

I always thought it got smushed into the glass, which was the reason for the bloody hole in it. Plus, the smushed side is on the driver's left if I recall, which would be where the wound was if he slammed into the glass while looking at the picture.

[TheNNerdGamer]

and think about it, that train driver's head was blown off, didn't seem like a head injury.

imagine it like this:

you are the train conductor, then the train cart wheels go loose, your head goes flying to the window then BAM! half your head is gone

[Viner16]

2 Words.

Conspiracy. Theory.

[Dildor]

I think it's a brilliant theory, minus the train conductor part but who knows.

[LGThomas]

Love this theory. It makes you think twice how and why Chuck ended-up in the sewers so close to the entrance of Vernon's bunker. At first, I just took if for granted he went down there to hideout; now I'm thinking: he tried to get back to the group in the morgue or more sinisterly he did get back to the group and they murdered him and left him to the walkers.

This may be meant as a big revelation in the last episode, who knows...

[Fiddle Diddle]

I think that this is a bit of a stretch, I'm going to apply Occam's razor to this and just suggest that it's much more logical to assume the simpler conclusion; Chuck and Vernon didn't know each other, everything Chuck did and said was on the level (he kept no secrets), and the reason behind Vernon's ominous line "Y'all didn't come from the train tracks, did you?" is as of yet unknown and will possibly be further explained in Ep. 5.

[Panzer89]

Wow, there's grasping, and then there's this thread.

[Nathanial]

I'll have to replay Episode 3 I guess, but I could have sworn the broken window was to the side, not in front of the conductor of the train. And quite a distance away from where the driver was sitting. I always assumed, and still do, that the conductor killed himself. With a magnum. Hence the gigantic gaping hole/part of his head missing. It doesn't look like he crashed his head into glass... I've never heard of somebody crashing into glass, and half their head coming off in the process... oh, and then they get thrown back into the chair, seated perfectly.

I assumed it was suicide, with a magnum, which Chuck later grabs. Didn't Chuck have a magnum when you find him in the sewers?

I don't know if I would say that Chuck and Vernon are brothers and what not, but I would at least say that's where Chuck got the gun...

[thestalkinghead]

I'll have to replay Episode 3 I guess, but I could have sworn the broken window was to the side, not in front of the conductor of the train. And quite a distance away from where the driver was sitting. I always assumed, and still do, that the conductor killed himself. With a magnum. Hence the gigantic gaping hole/part of his head missing. It doesn't look like he crashed his head into glass... I've never heard of somebody crashing into glass, and half their head coming off in the process... oh, and then they get thrown back into the chair, seated perfectly.

I assumed it was suicide, with a magnum, which Chuck later grabs. Didn't Chuck have a magnum when you find him in the sewers?

I don't know if I would say that Chuck and Vernon are brothers and what not, but I would at least say that's where Chuck got the gun...

his head looks flattened to me

[Panzer89]

I'll have to replay Episode 3 I guess, but I could have sworn the broken window was to the side, not in front of the conductor of the train. And quite a distance away from where the driver was sitting.


Let me save you the trouble. It was the front viewing window. PIC 1 (http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a252/teh_man_in_black/Front-window2.jpg) and PIC 2 (http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a252/teh_man_in_black/Front-window.jpg).


With a magnum. Hence the gigantic gaping hole/part of his head missing.

I can't think of any conceivable shot angle that would cause that level (http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a252/teh_man_in_black/smashed-head.jpg) of wound. It still makes more sense that his head was smashed on impact.


It doesn't look like he crashed his head into glass... I've never heard of somebody crashing into glass, and half their head coming off in the process... oh, and then they get thrown back into the chair, seated perfectly.

I'd google train crash victims, but I don't feel like staring at real disfigured corpses. What your proposing is actually harder to believe and has zero set up to support it.


Speaking of set up, people need to read into the scene a little bit more (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=bLzjaFT77rA#t=647s) and stop wildly guessing. They give a good long shot of the dead guys face and a good long shot of the smashed window. That's the game makers way of saying, "LOOK AT THIS! See? We're putting these two scenes together so you look at them and draw the conclusion that we was killed by slamming headfirst into the window."

Also magnum refers to when a bullet is a larger version of another bullet or uses more powder, it doesn't refer to any specific gun.

[george1120]

I'll have to replay Episode 3 I guess, but I could have sworn the broken window was to the side, not in front of the conductor of the train. And quite a distance away from where the driver was sitting. I always assumed, and still do, that the conductor killed himself. With a magnum. Hence the gigantic gaping hole/part of his head missing. It doesn't look like he crashed his head into glass... I've never heard of somebody crashing into glass, and half their head coming off in the process... oh, and then they get thrown back into the chair, seated perfectly.

I assumed it was suicide, with a magnum, which Chuck later grabs. Didn't Chuck have a magnum when you find him in the sewers?

I don't know if I would say that Chuck and Vernon are brothers and what not, but I would at least say that's where Chuck got the gun...


I agree with you completely here on the head part. It didn't look like he could possibly have part of his head crushed by a train impact.

[george1120]

I also don't see anyone agreeing or denying that the man in the photo is Chuck. He could be Vernon, but that isn't likely considering the hair which looks just like Chuck's.

Besides, I doubt it is a coincidence that Chuck was in the train with another man looking like him in the photo. Seems like Chuck is the train driver after all honestly.

[Panzer89]

I also don't see anyone agreeing or denying that the man in the photo is Chuck. He could be Vernon, but that isn't likely considering the hair which looks just like Chuck's.

Besides, I doubt it is a coincidence that Chuck was in the train with another man looking like him in the photo. Seems like Chuck is the train driver after all honestly.

You mean, this picture (http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a252/teh_man_in_black/nice-hair.jpg)? I hate to break it to you, but I'm pretty sure this guy is wearing a hat.

Here's a nice up-close of the dead guy (http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a252/teh_man_in_black/smashed-head.jpg). Notice how the dark brows and well groomed beard match the photo?

Now contrast that with a picture of Chuck (http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20120829200442/walkingdead/images/8/8d/CharlesVG.jpg). Grey, almost completely white, brows and a poorly maintained beard to match.

The guy in the photo is just plain younger and much less weathered looking than Chuck.

[george1120]

hmm you have a good point, but I'm not sure.

[8Bit_System]

I always used to think he was shot from behind, but after some discussions on here and some rethinking I'm pretty sure the crash theory is the one to go with. The conductor's chair is very close to the window, so it would have been possibly to crash into the glass and back into the seat. Also, the force produced by a body being flung with 30 or so mph into a solid object is tremendous and could well crash a head open.

I also have to disagree on the photo showing Chuck. I don't think there is a lot of resemblance and it is not taken away after Chuck appears either.

http://i784.photobucket.com/albums/yy123/omen3608/Walking%20Dead/trainpic.jpg

http://i784.photobucket.com/albums/yy123/omen3608/Walking%20Dead/trainpic2.jpg

The pic disappears after Duck has died, so my guess would be that Kenny takes it off.

[Moneymich383]

vernon says "I had a brother in macon"
chuck?
not sure if someone already said that?

[Panzer89]

vernon says "I had a brother in macon"
chuck?
not sure if someone already said that?

If the wiki is to be trusted on the subject he's from Clayton (http://walkingdead.wikia.com/wiki/Charles_(Video_Game)#Clayton.2C_Georgia), and that's quite a ways away from Macon. Although I've never heard him make mention of this in game.

[trd84]

http://imageshack.us/scaled/landing/546/trainpic.png

Doesn't look like Chuck to me.

[Pellet]

the picture is of the guy that smashed his head on the window.
Not hard to figure out.
People just want things to be more complicated than they already are

[Matrox Yang]

I continue to be surprised by the people who can't see that the train driver died by hitting his head on the glass in front of him. Seriously guys- sometimes the simplest solution really is the correct one. I know it's the walking dead but not every death is a murder.

[Fiddle Diddle]

Guys... come on now, I don't mean to rain on people's parades, aw who am I kidding, yes I do.

Chuck freakin' died right outside the doorstep of Vernon's cancer group. Lee and Vernon probably had to step over his dead body when navigating their way back to the house. And NO, I'm not going to budge on that, and here's why: When Lee goes back to the cancer group hideout (keep in mind that he left FROM THE HOUSE), he uses the same path to get there, which is through the hole in the wall. Vernon specifically mentions that he's using the sewers to navigate around the town.

Just face the simple truth. Chuck was a simple, honest man and had no choice but to go with the group. He got surrounded in a panic and tried to escape into the sewers, where he unfortunately died. His story is over, guys.

That said, we're all over-thinking this. I bid you all adieu and retire myself permanently from this thread.

[george1120]

lol k

[Corcline27]

I am completely surprised not one person mentioned this or how it is not mentioned in the wikia, but Chuck is a lot bigger of a character than it seems.

Play episode 3 again, and when you first enter the driver's room and see the dead body, remember how the guy was not killed by the walkers, nor turned into one, but was MURDERED? He didn't kill himself, someone shot him from the outside as evidenced by the glass. Now in this room, did anyone look at the photograph? It was a man with his wife and two kids. Guess who that was. Yes, Chuck.

Why would his picture be attached in the driver's room? Remember how Chuck just so happened to be living at the train? How the train somehow stopped on its own and was shut off? Remember how he strangely happened to be in the sewer with a gun that was never seen before, and how Vernon questioned Lee about the train? Is it weird that both Chuck and Vernon look alike? Lastly, did you notice how the picture disappeared after talking to Chuck for the first time and heading to the driver's room to find it missing? This cannot be a coincidence. Chuck used to work as a train driver, and Vernon knew about it.


So, what am I trying to get exactly? Well here is what I think. Chuck lied to Lee about not seeing his family in fourteen years. For all we know, he was probably on the train the day of the outbreak and after seeing what happened and the train stopping to possibly avoid hitting a car (seen next to the train where that zombie was inside still attached to the seat belt.) Chuck, who knew what was going on and was too afraid to take chances, shot the driver and shut off the train, using it as shelter. Possibly fearing death, he chose to stay indoors, going out only to find food and whatnot, drinking to keep him calm, assuming his family are dead.

Seeing how Kenny had the same drinking habits, this is very likely. Now here is where Vernon's story comes to mind:

Vernon and Chuck knew of their occupations and area of residence. When Chuck chose to fight off the walkers himself, he looked very confident. It appears that he still had his gun all along and used it to defend himself from the horde of zombies. Then, he went to go meet his brother and the cancer group on his own and possibly get them to help Lee. Realizing he was outnumbered and could not make it in time, he took his life with the last bullet of his gun.

Vernon, knowing of Chuck's occupation, went to the train, possibly to see if he was still there and also to see if they can use that as a method of transportation. As we don't know what happened to the group, this is probably the case.


Anyone want to say why you agree/disagree? Feel free to discuss.

Other than the train conductor theory this post is awesome!

[Hudomonkey]

It was a good theory but after the Vernon betrayal it gets rid of the idea about the train

I think the man could have been murdered by some using a blunt instrument but if that were the case it would probably be putting him out of his misery and I think a train accident is more likely

I don't think Vernon and Chuck have anything to do with each other

[Corcline27]

It would be too cool if they were bros

[JakeSt123]

I can't think of any conceivable shot angle that would cause that level (http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a252/teh_man_in_black/smashed-head.jpg) of wound. It still makes more sense that his head was smashed on impact.

Just realised the Train Driver shares the same head as Ben's teacher.

[Vladisimo]

"It still makes more sense that his head was smashed on impact."

No. Just look at his head. That glass doesn't seem that thick and tough. Shooting him seems much plausible in my opinion.

[aperose]

if chuck was a train driver why didn't he try starting the train?

[Jake]

He hit his head and died. He was the train engineer. Picture wasn't supposed to disappear.

[Corcline27]

Boom ^

[Frostixa]

Whoa, interesting way to look at it.

[AnnaSan]

Half of his head is gone though, I doubt the crash would talk half chunk of your face off.

[Sutinen]

You guys don't know shit if you think your head will split in half when you hit a window at high speed. Looks more like something that a hollowpoint round would do. On top of that, the train conductor wouldn't be sitting in his chair, he would be somewhere on the floor after he dies from getting launched at the window.

E: Always late, a TellTale guy just revealed the big mystery.

E2: I just looked at the images on the second page, looks like he has been against the window for a while (The dried bloodstream on the panel), I think Chuck has dragged and put him on the chair?

[Robbingrobin]

No, I guess he just was catapulted against the window, slammed his head in and flopped back on the chair.

[Vladisimo]

E: Always late, a TellTale guy just revealed the big mystery.

Wha... When? Where? Link please.

[Toasty]

This is an absolute amazing theory. It makes sense even.

[Mornai]

Wha... When? Where? Link please.

Uh...scroll up? :p Their names are highlighted in red, so it shouldn't be difficult at all to notice their posts, even when skimming through. Here it is regardless: Link (https://www.telltalegames.com/forums/showpost.php?p=758942&postcount=44)

Interesting theory, but it has thus been more or less confirmed that the guy was not Chuck.

I assumed that he hit his head and died, and it seems obvious with the camera shots focusing on the window. From the threads here and all of the playthroughs I've seen on youtube(not just popular ones, either) it seems this is what the majority saw as well.

[Vladisimo]

You're right. They should highlight their posts or something (fancier, just like Jagex does), I don't think anyone looks at a posters name unless it's OP.

[Demopan]

1. The train came to a stop suddenly and the guy hit the window and broke his head.

2. Chuck probably found the gun down there

3. Being old and having beards does not make two people related.

[double_u]

I think that this is a bit of a stretch, I'm going to apply Occam's razor to this and just suggest that it's much more logical to assume the simpler conclusion; Chuck and Vernon didn't know each other, everything Chuck did and said was on the level (he kept no secrets), and the reason behind Vernon's ominous line "Y'all didn't come from the train tracks, did you?" is as of yet unknown and will possibly be further explained in Ep. 5.

I'm glad to learn something new everyday (regarding Occam's razor). :)