Should Season 3 reset or continue the S&M Universe?

[barchetta]

With all these things that have been going on the past two episodes, should season 3 continue (thus Max being the US president and a high priest, Sybil marrying Lincoln and being Queen of Canada, the Maimtron 9000 roaming around, the C.O.P.S. having a broken Bluster Blaster, etc. etc. etc.) or just reset everything and start all over?

Because of all these things going on, I'd say: reset.
It has worked in SM205, having everything tied together, even down to Brady Culture, but now that the Soda Poppers are no more (Yay!) I see no reason to make things even more complicated.

On the one hand you can continue, like a soap opera or a sitcom, on the other hand, most cartoons and comic strips just start all over again.

[Harald B]

Having just seen the splendors of a large dysfunctional support cast and a rich history to refer to, a reset would feel very weird. Sure, it may be better for some characters to move out and some facts to get conveniently changed, but they should keep them in the continuity to refer to and possibly insert where funny. And they should drastically cut down on the office souvenirs, but they should keep a handful of them laying around.
You've got loads of comedy gold here; it might get in the way a bit in the future, yes, but why throw it all away when it's enough to just stash it in the background?

[Badwolf]

I'm in two minds about this. On the one hand, there's a few characters I'd like to see more of (Hugh Bliss, Bosco, the COPS).
But on the other hand, starting with a clean slate, completely new characters replacing the old, a completely new street and office design, etc, would really make things more interesting.

The main problem I can see with a reboot is if the new characters and base locations don't go down too well. There'd definitely be a risk involved.
Maybe if recurring characters recurred a lot less, and if the street and buildings along it somehow had an even more radical overhaul, it'd do a lot to shake things about, but series 2's managed to keep things reasonably fresh.

Either way, I'd buy another series, reboot or not, in a flash.

[Mel]

Could someone put the spoiler sign next to the thread title? I suppose I should have expected some, but honestly, I didn't.

[TrogLlama]

Continue. We've still got loose ends (Superball's employer and possibly Satan's cryptic comment, although that may have just been implying that they'll go to hell when they die).

[barchetta]

Sure I want Bosco back, and some Flint Paper interaction, but maybe we should leave Sybil alone with her hubby and leave both Stinky's to .. whatever they do, in episode 3. I'm not saying we should get rid of them, but more Featherly and Brady?
(I'm not sure about Hugh Bliss, that was wrapped up I think).

As for the junk in the closet -- have you seen what Future Max and Future Sam had in their future office? :)

[Avel]

And besides, the soda poppers aren't dead, they're robots, obviously.

[chrisff1989]

I'd like to see some serious cleaning up, but a reset? I don't think so.

[RobD]

I'd like to see some serious cleaning up, but a reset? I don't think so.

I agree, there's still quite a few unanswered questions and the matter of a demonically possessed Desoto. But a clean up would be good as it would seem like a fresh start without ignoring anything that has happened before.

Anyway, I'm sure Max's run at office will eventually end.;)

[MaxFan]

I like that there's an ongoing story. I agree that I could live without seeing any more of Sybil/Lincoln. Remember that next season will occur after the next presidential election, so who knows if Max will still be president? I'm curious about Superball's employer, what's going on with both Stinky's, and to see how finally snapping has effected Bosco.
Also, I hope one day Sam & Max's closet in the office really does look like it did in 204.

[SloppyJimbo]

There's no way a reset could be better than continuing. At this point in the series, there's already a nice, huge cast built up. It'd be a shame to scrap them all.

[Mr_Stealth]

I think it should definitely continue from the previous seasons, at least to some degree.

"Cleaning up" is a good expression for what should be done, IMO. Don't throw out the past events and characters, but reference them and bring them back less often, only when they are relevant. Have some new things happen before next season. If Max isn't president in Season 3, it should be because he was impeached, not because he was never elected. Somebody should really clean up Sybil's office from the middle of the road, too.

[ezzetabi]

No reset, are you joking?
Resetting the setting in the easy way out the bad authors use.
Telltale tried the hard way making a story which alters the setting so much... Now they can't just reset everything.

Of course they can take it easy with some things:
E.g.
Sybil goes somewhere for living with her husband.
Max is not elected again.
S&M move in an other city (of course an other chunk of urban misery).

[InvaderJim42]

Definitely continue with the direction they're going. We've already got several great characters, such as Hugh Bliss, Brady Culture, Grandpa Stinky, Flint Paper, the COPS, Mr. Featherly, Jurgen and his monster, Leonard stuck in the closet (though it seems they finally let him out to attend the wedding)... it'd be a shame to throw them all out and start over. I do agree, there are some things that could use a little cleaning up... the office feels very crowded with the North Pole, talking bear head, and Wack-Da-Rats in it. I think the memorabilia items in the office should be small, or stuffed in the closet, like all the items from Season 1 were.

I'm quite curious to see what will happen in Season 3, especially with the issue of a possessed DeSoto and how Bosco will behave now that he's clearly lost what little marbles he had left. There are also characters that were introduced in Season 2 that I hope we'll be seeing much more of. Namely Jurgen, Grandpa Stinky, and an occasional appearance T.H.E.M. (AHHH!!!).

[wisp]

i'm against resetting, some cleaning or reorganizing is in order however... i even think there should be a plot that involves events and characters from all the first three seasons. the final events of season 2 where the results of season 1 and 2 and season 3 should continue in the same manner to create a proper trilogy.

[Kitmit13]

holy Cheese no D8 Would not want a reset. Maybe they could change their office again and the layout of the street , just to make things a bit more intressting, sorta like how they moved Sybils and opened stinkys, and they could have different seasons as well,e.g snow, but I love what we have here already. I love the world, with Bosco and Sybil and Stinky and I can see a lot more happening with them 8D

A big part of a game, appart from the puzzle solving, is the storyline, otherwise its not the game that we already have fallen in love with. You see what I mean?
lol

[Guybrush Threepwood]

I voted 'reset', but not in the extreme sense. I don't want the characters, plot or anything else like that to go, I just don't want stories from season two being carried on in season three - I'd like some fresh things (such as a season two character not being a villian in season three).

[Croutons]

I'm way too mixed. I think you can reset it to the point of like 'fixing' Bluster Blaster, but I don't want all the characters to go away. I'd love to see new characters, but characters like Flint Paper, Bosco, and Sybil need to stay, along with more 'side' characters like Superball and the C.O.P.S. Obviously things can change, but I don't want a total reset unless they do a prequel like thing. I like consistency, even if Sam & Max often skips the big details (Like how they got to the moon in the comics :V) for silly humour.

[barchetta]

Well, the reboot worked on James Bond - and he got to keep 'M' ... (but not 'Q')

[Chris1]

Possibly all they need is a change of location?

Sam and Max could hire an office in another state, or possibly another country.

[Kedri]

This is what I'd like:

-Sam & Max's office: New, yet retro. Not so eclectic, but looking like how you'd see it in the comics.

-The DeSoto being returned to its former glory. Don't get me wrong, it's awesome now, but a car that cool probably runs away. Sam & Max should either get a new DeSoto, or have their old one exorcised.

-The streets. Awesome though they are in this post-apocalyptic wasteland form, I'd like to see their street returned to something less...destroyed. Have Stinky's, Bosco's, and all that, but the fissure, rubble, and Sybil's damaged shop should get cleaned up.

Thanks for freeing Leonard! That was a first step toward a bright future. :D
Keep in mind these are just ideas, and for all I know, they won't improve things. But a bit of cleaning up, I think, might make things less distracting? I dunno.

[barchetta]

Very good points there, Kedri!

[mish]

Agree with Kedri. Keep up the scum of their street though. I love the premise that they live in a horrible trashy scummy blood-stained bullet-holed neighborhood.

Oh, and Bosco's could get a do-over too, now that Bosco is no longer freaked out by everyone/everything).

In short just make sure that everything you wrapped up stays wrapped up, because you wrapped it up really nicely.

I say introduce new characters, leave some classic ones, like Bosco (cause you can't move the guy with the corner store), get rid of Sybil & Abe because Abe as a character closes a lot of doors (I feel like). I wish all the characters would be actual characters that aren't completely nonsensical....EG:

Bosco makes sense. Stinky & Stinky make sense. Sybil makes sense. Jimmy-Two-Teeth makes sense. Abe doesn't make sense. Monster doesn't make sense. Moai heads don't make sense. I mean characters are characters and they've served well so far, but i'd like to see less "Aqua Teen Hunger Force" type characters. They break the fourth wall too much.
Though don't get me wrong, the monster was a brilliant character, in fact Night of The Raving dead was the best stand-aloneable episode yet.

Also, for season 3, remember why everyone hates the Soda Poppers: they had really really really annoying voices. In real life, I wouldn't want to spend five minutes in the presence of someone with a voice as annoying as that. Even Mr. Featherly was cooler. Oh, and Harry the moleman was annoying, too. Am I the only one who finds COPS very annoying, and sort of...old? They're just not funny anymore.

But kudos, Season 2 was amazing. An enormous improvement over Season 1. Let's hope the line is going to keep rising and we get to see more awesome characters such as Stinky, Satan, Flint, etc.

EDIT: HARALD B:
Yeah, they should get rid of the Season 1 & 2 Baddie souvenirs, but KEEP THE MARIACHI FROGS! FOR THE LOVE OF GOD, KEEP THE FROGS!

[Hero1]

Basically season 3 needs to be set somewhere else.. their main home base location should be in space or something different..cause theres no way I could spent another minute trawling up and down that street visiting the office sybils boscos again.. 11 episodes of that was enough!

[NHJ BV]

Sam & Max love their office and their neighborhood, what is this heresy of moving to another location? If their cases demand their attention somewhere else, they drive there. They will never move to a different wretched block of urban misery.

[Harald B]

EDIT: HARALD B:
Yeah, they should get rid of the Season 1 & 2 Baddie souvenirs, but KEEP THE MARIACHI FROGS! FOR THE LOVE OF GOD, KEEP THE FROGS!Relax. I was talking about the big things, like the magnetic pole, the bear head, and the rug; too visible and clashy. I like having a few small mementos.

[Hero1]

Sam & Max love their office and their neighborhood, what is this heresy of moving to another location? If their cases demand their attention somewhere else, they drive there. They will never move to a different wretched block of urban misery.

That was fine if each case we got to go straight to a new location..but telltale keep reusing the street for puzzles..and you have to constantly travel back and forth between the new location and their neighborhood.. I'm pretty much sick of that street by now..

[Quuux]

Maybe S3 will be kingdom of the molemen, with their cameo in 205.

[tobar]

No reset no. There were plenty of nods in 205 that hinted that they already have the story for season 3 planned out. Let them continue as they are because they keep getting better and better. The only thing I agree with is getting rid of the bear head, north pole and whack-da-ratz. =P

[Jeff1203]

It definitely has to continue. In a universe as crazy as that, a "restart" would be a pain to have to reintroduce especially with all the running gags currently in play. Although, an overall change in scenery would be a lot easier since hell finally froze over causing a dramatic change in climate and Max has yet to control Maimtron (as was promised to him from Sam) so world destruction is at hand. :D

[Sammy]

Their closet for souveneirs had more space now thet Leonard is gone.Bosco's store must have bright lights again.

[All-thumbs]

I vote for continue.

I think anybody in the future who picks all the games up without knowing about Sam and Max would be confused. Especially if they only pick the retail versions up, and don't know about the site. I mean looking at it that way, they'd play season 1 and 2 and everything would make sense, but then they'd get to season 3 and end up confused. I geuss they could put a note in the box and say "We don't want to confuse you so we're going to pretend everything in the first two seasons never happend and so we've scrapped everything you know an love." :D

I think having smaller changes like the office design, or new characters would make more sense, and be a lot less brain hurt for future fans. :P

[SloppyJimbo]

Don't throw out the past events and characters, but reference them and bring them back less often, only when they are relevant.

I couldn't disagree more. I've always loved seeing unexpected characters return, and the more past-references, the better. See: Arrested Development.

Of course, being too self-referential would deter the player who decides to randomly start in the middle of a season, but as Season Two proved, a better connected plot worked out better than loosely tied episodes.

Look at 204 too. That's the best episode so far (in my opinion and in many others'), and it was the most self-referential yet.

[etherbot]

And besides, the soda poppers aren't dead, they're robots, obviously.

well, to be honest, Peeper's eyes survived the lava, so some stray pit ridden witchdoctor could always voodoo up some replacements, le'chuk styles

[ezzetabi]

@etherbot. Oh dear, I can't imagine anyone so evil and crazy to go in the pit of hell to take the eyes and resurrect him... It is out of mind!

[Sammy]

If anyone would do that, it's worse than the @#&!* Poppers.

[CGameProgrammer]

Season 3 should not reset the universe but it should largely abandon it. I want to see what they do with the DeSoto now, but I long ago tired of Sybil, Abe, Stinky, Jimmy, and to a lesser degree, Bosco. Also Flint Paper is worthless.

They need to introduce a new cast and keep only a few of the old characters. The wedding scene was a good send-off for the old cast.

[taumel]

Starting something new, i would love to see a more road movie like S3, far far away from the streets and the known characters (maybe we just could take Bosco with us). I dunno if this is what has been offered as a reset as resetting involves some sort of playing the same old thing over and over again.

[BancoLavadero]

Voted for continue as reset, as I see it, seems too strict a thing.
However, they need to seriously reform, in order not to be too repetitive. There are certain patterns to the game that need to be broken. The time elevator in 204 was a good step in terms of transportation.

A new set of characters, themes and sceneries is needed - you're not playing the SAME game anymore - but not completely at the expense of old ones. There needs to be things that tie all three seasons together and add a sense of continuity. I don't see the aspects closing each other out, if you design it well.

As for the street and office, I feel like that's something fundamental you just can't change. All the games more or less start in the neighborhood, that's where the Freelance Police work! It's where do we go from there and why that matters.

[ezzetabi]

The roaming desoto is eating miles of asphalt...
Sam:- As was saying this morning we have to move for a long mission in a new area.
Max:- Where we'll live?
Sam:- The commissioner organized a new home, it seems.

Sam and Max enter in a obviously office looking room. White walls, two desks, four chairs (one higher for Max), few empty file cabinets. Two window with a nice balcony with a red floor. Not a single dot of dust.

Sam:- Here we are. Welcome in our new workplace.
Max:- ...
Sam:- As first thing lets take our luggage from the car and...
Max:- NOPE, as first thing...
Max extracts a survival knife from the place where he keeps his gun and jumps on the balcony, draws in the outside wall a giant Sam&Max Freelance Police logo.
Max:- This is the first thing!
Sam:- Did I say you crack me up little buddy?
Max:- Always.

[Peril]

I'd like to refer to episode 204. Future Sam and Max were still in the same office working cases on the same street. Why mess with the canon of that? The whole next season doesn't have to take place on the street, but 301 should either start or go back to the office. Part of the humor is that all these ridiculous things happen that don't involve them having to stray too far from home. Well..... They did go to the moon.... and Germany...... and hell..... but, you know what I mean. I do support the idea of some cleaning of the office and street. Less clutter, less rubble. The only things that have to stay for canon sake are the mariachi frogs and the model volcano.

[Zeek]

All I want to see in Season 3 is The Mariachis working as Wedding Singers because it pays better than singing for birthdays. If they add that, they can do whatever else they want with the season.

EDIT: Now that I think about it, I'd like something similar to what they did in the animated show where some of the cases just kind of happened while Sam & Max were around a la 202 post opening credits.

It would be funny and probably annoying to Max to have to solve a local caper as they try to get from point A to point B by the season's end.

[mish]

Taumel: Agreed.
It's what made Sam & Max the comic so fun - that they were short stories of what happened on their road trip and episodes of life. They weren't necessarily all connected.
I agree some continuity is great, but the amount of characters that's brought back every episode satisfies only people who've religiously played the games since episode 1 season 1. Telltale must have a bigger budget now and could bring us something much more complex. Eh? Eh?

How about a spinoff episode in the middle of the third season where max gets kidnapped and sam has to rescue him? We've seen the 'solo sam' thing in the past a couple of times and it worked fine.

or maybe you could use that unfinished comic steve was working on as a basis for one of the episodes.....you know....the one with the gibbon!

[nhaingen]

or maybe you could use that unfinished comic steve was working on as a basis for one of the episodes.....you know....the one with the gibbon!

I keep hearing about this - from people on the forums, from the front flap of the comic book... now can someone please tell me some substantial info? How finished is it, and where might I see it?

Back on topic, I am getting fairly tired of walking up and down the same street. I was glad that Sybil's shop was relocated so I didn't ever have to attempt the long mile between her place and Stinky's/the COPS. Somehow, though, changing the feel of the street - like making it nighttime in WNB - fools me into thinking I'm somewhere totally new, and the whole experience is a lot more fun. ^^ Maybe some nice winter or autumn or acid rain would keep it interesting.

[Flo]

It doesn't have to be a full continuity reboot, but if we only see the office once more in 301 and then get all-new locations (road trip maybe), all the better.

[mish]

nahigen - it's apparently only missing a few pages, so it's relatively close to completion but steve hasn't had time to finish it between his job at pixar and telltale. you probably won't see it anytime soon, unless we all keep bugging steve really really hard. so better get on that, on his blog (spudvision).

Hey Telltale, was that a CLOVERFIELD JOKE???? :O

A LOT OF PEOPLE SEEM TO LIKE THE ROADTRIP IDEA! HUH? HUH? POKE POKE!

[Jake]

nahigen - it's apparently only missing a few pages, so it's relatively close to completion but steve hasn't had time to finish it between his job at pixar and telltale. you probably won't see it anytime soon, unless we all keep bugging steve really really hard. so better get on that, on his blog (spudvision).

Much like how I don't know if Freelance Police was "almost done except for some polish," I don't think the comic was "only missing a few pages." Steve Purcell showed me the comic at one point, and it was completed through about the first twelve pages, and then devolved into sketches and rough ideas. It didn't even fully get to the part where Sam finds the monkey. Granted, this was almost ten years ago when he showed me the unfinished book, but I don't know if he's really had time to go back to it much since then.

[barchetta]

A LOT OF PEOPLE SEEM TO LIKE THE ROADTRIP IDEA!

Hmm... yes...
And then there's a carnaval, and a Biggest Ball of Twine, and a aligator golf course and how about a bungee jump thingamagoo at Mt. Rushmore and a tarpit and ...

[ATMachine]

SPOILER ALERT

I was quite disappointed by how heavily Season 2 relied on Season 1 for its humor, especially the Soda Poppers as villains in 205. When the second season began, I had naturally been expecting a few references in the jokes to the previous season's events, but I thought the puzzles and storyline wouldn't require too much knowledge of 101-106. I certainly didn't expect the entire overarching plot of the new season to hinge on events from Season 1.

I really, really hope Season 3 sees all-new ultimate villains, not ones whose villainy is rooted in events from Season 1 or 2. Otherwise, bringing back characters is fine, but new players should be able to start playing 301 without having to catch up first.

[Jake]

For what it's worth, I don't think that a hardcore fan who has been playing the series from day one is in a position to accurately decide what a new player should or shouldn't be able to do. But, that said, I'm sure that much like Season One and Season Two were different in their structure and storytelling, Season Two and Season Three will also have differences, which will be revealed as the season progresses.

massive 205 spoilers within:
Also, as a side note, aside from the throwaway Brady Culture stuff, the Soda Poppers story was wholly contained in Season Two, with their appearance in Ice Station Santa, and their interrupted birthday in Chariots of the Dogs. If Season One hadn't existed, I imagine the Poppers would have had more screen time in this season , but all you really need to know is 1) they're annoying 2) their appearance at the north pole is slightly suspicious 3) sam & max have met them before and have messed with them a lot 4) their birthday was ruined by Sam & Max. If this had been a Sam & Max comic book, you wouldn't expect any of the backstory from Season One to be needed for the story to work -- the Soda Poppers would really have appeared out of nowhere with some thinly referenced context layered in over time, and then ended up being the masterminds -- and I think that if you are a player who didn't have that backstory, it would still be okay. Obviously not as strong as if you yourself were there for all the past Poppers encounters, but the story still holds. It just recontextualizes the Poppers as characters more in the vein of Commander Blip and the Rubber Pants Commandos or something, who have a hugely implied backstory and relationship to Sam & Max, but its one you really don't need to know much about if you don't want to.

[Flo]

Hmm... yes...
And then there's a carnaval, and a Biggest Ball of Twine, and a aligator golf course and how about a bungee jump thingamagoo at Mt. Rushmore and a tarpit and ...
No need to be an ass about it. Suggesting a road trip doesn't mean we have to rehash Hit the Road.

A road trip is just a simple way of ensuring a minimum of recycled locations, which is what a lot of people have been asking for.

[DoubtedEdwardo]

A road trip is just a simple way of ensuring a minimum of recycled locations, which is what a lot of people have been asking for.
Agreed, it would be nice to have a season long road trip where each stop was a different episode, but I can't see that happening for a loooooooong time. Especially as they probably already have the main story line for Season 3 mapped out.

characters more in the vein of Commander Blip and the Rubber Pants Commandos or something, who have a hugely implied backstory and relationship to Sam & Max, but its one you really don't need to know much about if you don't want to.
It would be quite cool for this to actually happen, just have some characters turn up with a back story already in place, though I suppose this already happened with Grandpa Stinky.

Back on topic I think it would be a shame to lose what Telltale have spent two years creating, and a bit of a cop out to go "Okay so forget all that stuff and it's ramifications, pretend it didn't happened"

[ShaggE]

Nah, a reset is unnecessary. Look at the Simpsons, they went from a tiny cast to a ridiculously large one, and it worked perfectly. Why can't Sam & Max do that?

[Jake]

A road trip is just a simple way of ensuring a minimum of recycled locations, which is what a lot of people have been asking for.

An even simpler way to not re-use locations would also be to just make a Hawaii 5-0 game instead of Sam & Max for Season Three.

[Hero1]

An even simpler way to not re-use locations would also be to just make a Hawaii 5-0 game instead of Sam & Max for Season Three.

Come on now reusing the tv station from season 1 was a real stretch.. if you are going back to the same old locations again it does take away some of the excitement.. I understand why it's done, because it improves the gameplay and with 1 game every month the design team can't make 5 or 6 new locations/rooms per episode.. Maybe by season 3 it will have been figured out, perhaps some advancements in the telltale tool? or more design staff hired.. Thats why I like that season 3 is about a year off.. gives some space and breathing room to see how best to take sam & max forward.

[RMJ1984]

It should continue to get better and evolve. The game is getting better and better all the time, last few episodes 204 & 205 are the best in my mind so far.

But yeah new locations, more to explore and ofc new people are the way to go, its no wonder all those episodes that had lots of that are the most popular. :)

And as always i still like full games the most, and dont hope this episode thing is a new trend, so hopefully at somepoint telltale gets big & rich enough to do a full Sam&max game :)

and also we need even more detail to locals, 2d is sadly still miles ahead, lets get the hall in sam&max's building now, and the room outside there office not being empty when you open the door, and lets also bring back a map like structure like in hit the road.

Was a way better a more visual way to get around between places :)

And yes im walling to pay 2 or even 3 times as much as previous seasons if they really improve overall =)

[Peril]

An even simpler way to not re-use locations would also be to just make a Hawaii 5-0 game instead of Sam & Max for Season Three.

Oh good. Now I have THAT theme song stuck in my head.

[Flo]

An even simpler way to not re-use locations would also be to just make a Hawaii 5-0 game instead of Sam & Max for Season Three.
Please don't try to tell us that the recycling of locations was done for artistic reasons. I think most of the people here understand why it's necessary, but that doesn't make the wish for less recycling any less valid, and it certainly doesn't mean that less recycling would mean it's not a Sam & Max game.

[Jake]

I'm not claiming its done for artistic reasons (though I think that they do by and large make sense in the stories told. While 205 had some which were a bit of a stretch, I thought they were used brilliantly in 204), but saying that pitching a road movie story is a "simple way" to not re-use locations is a preposterous oversimplification of the real-world issues at hand.

[Flo]

saying that pitching a road movie story is a "simple way" to not re-use locations is a preposterous oversimplification of the real-world issues at hand.
I meant that the other way around. If you want less recycling, asking for a road trip basically ensures that since it doesn't give you a lot of chances to re-use content.

[Jake]

I think you misread what I said, since I said the same thing as you. "No re-use" basically = "less recycling."

[Flo]

Let me rephrase that. I didn't mean that a road trip would make it easier for you (Telltale) to do less recycling.

[Jake]

I see now!

[taumel]

For what it's worth, I don't think that a hardcore fan who has been playing the series from day one is in a position to accurately decide what a new player should or shouldn't be able to do. But, that said, I'm sure that much like Season One and Season Two were different in their structure and storytelling, Season Two and Season Three will also have differences, which will be revealed as the season progresses.

massive 205 spoilers within:
Also, as a side note, aside from the throwaway Brady Culture stuff, the Soda Poppers story was wholly contained in Season Two, with their appearance in Ice Station Santa, and their interrupted birthday in Chariots of the Dogs. If Season One hadn't existed, I imagine the Poppers would have had more screen time in this season , but all you really need to know is 1) they're annoying 2) their appearance at the north pole is slightly suspicious 3) sam & max have met them before and have messed with them a lot 4) their birthday was ruined by Sam & Max. If this had been a Sam & Max comic book, you wouldn't expect any of the backstory from Season One to be needed for the story to work -- the Soda Poppers would really have appeared out of nowhere with some thinly referenced context layered in over time, and then ended up being the masterminds -- and I think that if you are a player who didn't have that backstory, it would still be okay. Obviously not as strong as if you yourself were there for all the past Poppers encounters, but the story still holds. It just recontextualizes the Poppers as characters more in the vein of Commander Blip and the Rubber Pants Commandos or something, who have a hugely implied backstory and relationship to Sam & Max, but its one you really don't need to know much about if you don't want to.

First it's a matter of personal taste if you like certain things and then if you enjoy dealing with those you don't. Secondly it comes down to alternatives. If for instance there would exist a second Sam&Max which comes without the poppers and with more variety then it's very likely i would have gone for this one instead.

Were the seasons fun although of certain lacks? Yes.

Was it the best which you could hope for? Nope.

A thing i found distracting from time to time was that some characters and objects were reused to a degree that it felt artificial. Take for instance the cake which you offer the poppers at the end. Same as the cake which Stinky turned into just before. Such things drag you out of the story like in very simple comics were all characters are responsible for this and that and ... at a certain point it's a bit too much.

As for the story i have to say that to me it feels too constructed. It's not so much in a flow or brings you to moments were you're thinking oh yes this makes sense now. It's more like you create a story for something and then after this is done, reuse stuff and bend it to the direction which pops up to your mind then. So in a weird way it always can make sense but it just doesn't feel really convincing and clever. If looking at the whole season i wouldn't say that the story is one of the big strengths of Sam&Max so far.

A road movie like thing has a big plus on that it's an ongoing thing. Send them on vacation (Desoto, trailer (or generally give them a mobile caravan office), ferry, plane, spaceship not heading for home, walking a mountain trail, the train of love,...) get into trouble with something, whoops there is a case. You need a location which they can reuse a few times in order to give some more stability, let them use a abandoned office, a motel room, their seatrow in a plane or whatever but you are free to go after using it for an episode or maybe two.

To me the nice thing about Sam&Max is more about what you can read beetween the lines and which shows up in the overall experience. There is a certain degree of quality in more than just one aspect and how this all comes together whilst some aspects are stonger and some are weaker. That's the nice thing.

[wisp]

A thing i found distracting from time to time was that some characters and objects were reused to a degree that it felt artificial. Take for instance the cake which you offer the poppers at the end. Same as the cake which Stinky turned into just before.
i guess your argument is valid, but i can't really agree with your example. that is totally supposed to be that way and didn't bother me at all. why should it look different if it actually is the same more or less?
the reuse of old characters and locations should be limited in season three however. don't get me wrong, i like the recurring characters, but their importance should be reduced and the big parts should got to new characters. also, the time you spend in reused locations should be limited. you can be in the office, but only until you did what you have to and go back to the case instead of wandering around the neighborhood.

[barchetta]

Nah, a reset is unnecessary. Look at the Simpsons, they went from a tiny cast to a ridiculously large one, and it worked perfectly. Why can't Sam & Max do that?

I'm not saying that characters should disappear, it's just that the Desoto can't be possessed for too long to be useful. Or Max being president for more than a season.

In The Simpsons (or Futurama, a favorite of mine) the story continues and the universe expands, but the individual episodes are never so drastic as above mentioned examples to make matters unnecessarily complicated.

[Flo]

I'm not saying that characters should disappear, it's just that the Desoto can't be possessed for too long to be useful. Or Max being president for more than a season.
Pretty much all of that stuff is fixable, though, if continuity really matters that much. (Though yet another exorcism might be too much and would be better as back-story.)

[mish]

An even simpler way to not re-use locations would also be to just make a Hawaii 5-0 game instead of Sam & Max for Season Three.

There's really no need for that. The forums are intended for feedback from the consumers to the Telltale team to make the games "better" or more suited for the market. Also after two seasons you can't keep a lot of constants, you have to kick it up a notch, or else you'll start losing audience.

The people here on the forums are going out of their way to give you their opinions. Most have no knowledge of how the Telltale tool works, but they don't need to. That's your job. If somebody suggests something that can't be done due to technical complications, all is well, move on.

"The first time someone calls you a horse you punch him on the nose, the second time someone calls you a horse you call him a jerk but the third time someone calls you a horse, well then perhaps it's time to go shopping for a saddle."

EDIT: Oh, and about the comic, I heard from Steve's lips that it's nearly done, but that he hasn't had time to finish it. Maybe he's worked on it since. :)

[Jake]

Heh sorry if that post came off all snarky -- it was meant to be in more good fun than it reads, apparently. No harm to anyones opinion was intended! :(

[boo]

Here's what I think. And since I'm me I value my opinion over anyone else's.

I think the staff got a lot of mileage out of the continuity of Max's presidentship and his status as a high priest and I think it's time to put those two bits to bed. As funny as it is that the president has not been involved in the actual running of the country as of late... I'm happy to have those two things resolved "off screen" or in dialogue.

Other than that, I think it would be humorous if Sam and Max did go to a foreign country to set up a new base of operations and it looked EXACTLY like their current street, but with mild details changed.

I think we were all pretty happy with Season 2's new locales, especially the main office of Hell. If things keep going that way, I think we need not worry about whether there is a total reset or not.

[Flo]

Other than that, I think it would be humorous if Sam and Max did go to a foreign country to set up a new base of operations and it looked EXACTLY like their current street, but with mild details changed.
There's also the option of lookalike locations akin to the three different Snuckey's stores in Hit the Road. A complete lack of recycling just isn't feasible with monthly releases, but we can still hope, can't we?

I think we were all pretty happy with Season 2's new locales, especially the main office of Hell. If things keep going that way, I think we need not worry about whether there is a total reset or not.
I like the new locations well enough. Unfortunately Season Two ended on a low note with the massive recycling in 205.

[YoshiAngemon]

Well, it's not like locations seldomly used in the Animated Series (The Sub-Basement of Solitude), or any unused or forgotten characters, Hero or Otherwise (Darla "The Geek" Gugenheek, or Mack Salmon, Sam's Grandma from "Christmas, Bloody Christmas," or even Lorne, The Friend For Life), or make the DeSoto back to its former glory, but better, with Land, Sea, and Air-based Transformations.

Just don't say "LANDMASTER!" or "Do A Barrel Roll," okay?

[barchetta]

There's also the option of lookalike locations akin to the three different Snuckey's stores in Hit the Road.

And they all looked and talked like Bernard Bernoulli :D

[wefeelgroove]

I think I would go more for "continue" than "reset". If I were to reset anything, I would clean up the office a little- the stuff they collected over the season was pretty funny, but if they keep hoarding stuff at that rate, they'll run out of room! Oh, and of course (ep. 205 spoiler) never ever ever bring the Soda Poppers back ever again ever.

And you never know, season 3 might end up tying up a lot of stuff like Max's presidency (what WAS Superball doing in their office, anyway?) and the possessed Desoto.

[octochan]

The roaming desoto is eating miles of asphalt...
Sam:- As was saying this morning we have to move for a long mission in a new area.
Max:- Where we'll live?
Sam:- The commissioner organized a new home, it seems.

Sam and Max enter in a obviously office looking room. White walls, two desks, four chairs (one higher for Max), few empty file cabinets. Two window with a nice balcony with a red floor. Not a single dot of dust.

Sam:- Here we are. Welcome in our new workplace.
Max:- ...
Sam:- As first thing lets take our luggage from the car and...
Max:- NOPE, as first thing...


Cut to the next scene of their new office, only it's now just as dingy, dilapidated and doodled on as their old one, complete with the tire marks, bullet holes and mysterious stains.
Max: . . . we do some remodeling.
Sam: You really know how to make a place feel like home, little buddy.

[Volatilevalentine]

They can clean up the street maybe redesign it a bit after its been destroyed. They could have blister blaster fixed/ repaired, I would like to see bliss again but hes dead so i guess thats not a possibility.

a reset would screw up the way the game feels

[boo]

And you never know, season 3 might end up tying up a lot of stuff like Max's presidency (what WAS Superball doing in their office, anyway?) and the possessed Desoto.

I think I'm the only one who doesn't care why Superball was in S&M's office.
And I hope that we don't need a whole season to clear up Max's presidency. The storyline well is run dry there.

[boo]

The most recent season was wild, outrageous and over the top with myths, time travel, conspiracy theories, the afterlife, Max as president and a high priest. How do you top that?

Maybe the answer is to go backwards. Not reset the storylines, but bring S&M back to chasing purse snatchers and build from there. Maybe we could get some mysterious dames? They always noir things up.

[ShaggE]

How do you top that?


Max as pope, of course. :D

[boo]

Max as pope, of course. :D

I think Cerebus taught me everything I need to know about anthropomorphic creatures wearing tall hats.

[wisp]

Max as pope, of course. :D
na, he already has a religious title..that would be boring..

[ShaggE]

Heresy! Big hats are always pure awesome. :p

[Chuck]

I think I'm the only one who doesn't care why Superball was in S&M's office.
No, you're definitely not. I don't care, either.

[wisp]

...because you know?

[Chuck]

...because you know?
Um... sure.

[Jake]

People will be shocked when in Season Three, Superball transforms into Commander Blip.

[Kedri]

People will be shocked when in Season Three, Superball transforms into Commander Blip.
Well, so much for shocking me. :(

This does remind me of a huge problem, though...resetting would mean that Superball goes away!:eek:

[Zeek]

I feel like I'm in a Holiday Inn Express for coming up with this idea while in the shower.

------------------

Sybil and Abe on a random desert road riding the possed Desoto. They look around rather confused. They question where they are going. Desoto gets pissed, headlights turn red, and they zoom off to places unknown!

Meanwhile, back in NYC, Sam & Max are back from their yearly grocery shopping trip! As they are walking down the street....

Sam: Okay, Max, let's double check our supplies so we don't have to make two trips this year, since this is the only day of the year that restraining order can be waived. What's our haul?
Max: Jumbo industrial size bag of pork rines... Four wheels of cheese that have been rotated and balanced... An assorted sample package of Glazed MacGuffins... Double-dipped chocolate covered sugar fudge bombs... and five gallons of concentraited caffinated orange &^%#!
Sam: Remind me to pay a visit to the FCC Hell Branch and get that list changed back.

Phone rings. They bolt for the office door from the street dropping their groceries for the rats to claim. A physical fight over the phone ensues, Sam answers it as usual.

Sam: Hello? Yes, commissioner? *cue ominous music* No.... no!... You're lying!... Sweet mother of all things holy and glorified by the naive and obsessive! We'll take the case! *goes to hang up the phone but stops halfway to bring it back to his ear* Uhm, just how exactly are we going to go after the perp anyway? Uh huh... okay... Got it.. *hangs up*

Max: Judging from your more-than-usual excited tone and the ominous music playing in the background, is it safe to assume that we have a case that involves defying death like a rebelous 80's teenager?

Sam: Indeed, Max. It seems that Sybil and Linclon have been kidnapped on their Honeymoon.

Max: *disappointed* Awww. That doesn't sound fun..

Sam: It gets worse, little buddy. They were kidnapped... by our car!

Max: Our beloved Desoto who mysteriously died while we were abducted by time-traveling mariachies that we released from the netherworld of Hades as an evil and twisted version of its former self?

Sam: Good use of exposition.

Max: And that's bad why?

Sam: Oridnarily, I would say that it is because they are our friends and we have an obligation to save them, but it's mostly because our badges are locked in the glove compartment and the commissioner says we are due to renew them in the next five to six months or we end up losing our job titles as Freelance Police.

Max: But... that means...

Sam: You guess it. No more guns.

End scene with Max doing a shot for shot Darth Vader NOOOOOOOO! featuring all the knick-knacks in the office flying about as only the High Priest of the Ocean Chimps could get away with.

[r00tb33r]

I dunno... I was thinking a lot about this, in season 2 there were too many permanent changes to the street where the office is located... I mean the rubble, Sybil's and the huge crack aren't going to go away by themselves? Not sure what Telltale was thinking there.(I'm not bashing but I very much disagree)
I loved that scummy feel in Hit the Road though so thats definitely how I would like to see it.
As far as characters, I would definitely want to see more Bosco, maybe more of Superball(his character is not yet exhausted, we haven't actually seen him in 205, even though we know he was up in the office), perhaps Stinky(be sure to stick some more cool tunes in his jukebox), Sybil(maybe, but less important)...
I would like to see a new character at the other end of the street, where there was a boarded up shop behind Sybil's.
As far as the car goes, I'm file with a DeSoto, with or without the roof, as long as its a DeSoto.
Thats about all, I'd like to see what Telltale comes up with, and SOON!!!

[mish]

We simply do not have enough scum in the games.

Telltale, please, add more scum. We love scum.

(That was actually not sarcastic.)

[TrogLlama]

We simply do not have enough scum in the games.

Telltale, please, add more scum. We love scum.

(That was actually not sarcastic.)
And when they're done with the scum, they can put in some scumm.

[Blehboy]

It's real important to clean up a lot of the things taking place and perhaps tie up a lot of loose ends that aren't that important. Don't reset but the office and surrounding settings could use a serious clean up to get the clutter out of there. Perhaps with a few quick side conversations and comments a lot of the loose ends could be tied up (for example the demon car, or why the rubble's gone in the street), and it would allow for a real fresh start.

[ezzetabi]

Or the new car can be a Ferrari, just like in the comic! Just for one season of course.

Nice one Zeek, a little strange earing Max speaking that way... But nice.

[Zeek]

It's hard to figure out Max's speach quirks even when you're in the shower. You would think being naked helps, but it doesn't.

[wisp]

your little story was interesting...and while i was thinking about it i got another idea. did the episodes so far have cutscenes that did not involve sam&max or are part of the current location? i can't remember any..okay, that doen't mean much, but still...there could be a scene of sybil and abe in the demon car without being an actual part of the story. you could have max complaining why they have to walk to their next case and then cut to the desoto. it's just an example, but i would really like a few new perspectives in the next season. of course showing a location that isn't a location you can actually interact with might be considered a waste of resources..

[Zeek]

your little story was interesting...and while i was thinking about it i got another idea. did the episodes so far have cutscenes that did not involve sam&max or are part of the current location? i can't remember any..104, the Linclon Memorial

[Molokov]

@wisp: 101, Brady Culture's little bits after Sam and Max knock out each Soda Popper

[wisp]

okayokay...there are a few occasions...:o...but only a few and usually they are directly related to the ongoing main plot. wouldn't it be nice to have some subplut narration that way?

[Zeek]

a la Day of the Tenticle where the game would be inturrupted with news updates?

[RobD]

a la Day of the Tenticle where the game would be inturrupted with news updates?

Or 104 where they have the election updates? ;):p

[RMJ1984]

I dunno... I was thinking a lot about this, in season 2 there were too many permanent changes to the street where the office is located... I mean the rubble, Sybil's and the huge crack aren't going to go away by themselves? Not sure what Telltale was thinking there.(I'm not bashing but I very much disagree)
I loved that scummy feel in Hit the Road though so thats definitely how I would like to see it.
As far as characters, I would definitely want to see more Bosco, maybe more of Superball(his character is not yet exhausted, we haven't actually seen him in 205, even though we know he was up in the office), perhaps Stinky(be sure to stick some more cool tunes in his jukebox), Sybil(maybe, but less important)...
I would like to see a new character at the other end of the street, where there was a boarded up shop behind Sybil's.
As far as the car goes, I'm file with a DeSoto, with or without the roof, as long as its a DeSoto.
Thats about all, I'd like to see what Telltale comes up with, and SOON!!!


Like in the real world :) stuff can be fixed, but imo the street needs to be and look more crazy like in the original game :) and they are on the right patch imo :) it has to be messy, and not so clean and neat

[LuigiHann]

I liked the trend in season 2 of having the "main location" not being the street. Wouldn't mind if they stayed away from it altogether for Season 3, maybe having the whole season take place in Europe, or Space, or something.

[Imapus Sylicker]

Now, let's see here... Sam & Max aren't known for their "continuity", rather for their extreme sillyness and over-the-top absurdity.

I like the way season 1 kinda carried on to season 2, thus making it an extremely huge game. Every episode had a story which arched over the entire season, which arched over the 11 episodes.

Butt!

I do believe that it should kinda reset, you know? Make the 3rd season the start of a new game.

There are some discardable characters - Sybil and Lincoln could and should go. Keeping a dead president's severed stone head around does have a limited joke potential.

I don't see any reason to carry COPS over either. Nor Hugh Bliss, Brady Culture or Leonard.

In fact, apart from Bosco, Timmy and Jimmy and maybe Stinky, I don't see why any character should go over to the new season.

Bosco is now cured of his paranoia, and a convenience store is always convenient, even if it is inconvenient(ce).

Timmy and Jimmy, well... rats always were present in Sam & Max's universe, and they're just too #!*%ing funny to throw away.

Stinky? Well, a diner does have some possibilities, but I guess it's arbitrary anyways.

As for Satan & Santa... they could make an appearance, but they shouldn't be overdone.

All in all, I think some sort of reset would be a good idea. Lets the creators come up eith fresh ideas and it increases possibilities, whatever they may be.

Just my opinion.

Cheers!

[Trixie]

Like as the past comments say, the game world should say the same but in one way it would get massive and confusing.
In overall, if you keep somethings smaller noticed such as sybils marrage then it won't go mad.

[questionthemajority]

I'd like to see things start off on a clean slate again, with the neighborhood repaired, Sam & Max back in their office next door to Flint Paper, Sybill with her endless changing jobs, Bosco with his paranoia. Certainly, some things should stay, like Stinky's Diner (Old Man & Girl Stinky make a hilarious duo), but Sam & Max has always worked best as one of those series in which everything goes right back to normal after each adventure. Or what counts for normal in their world.

[YoshiAngemon]

I always thought the only thing that counted for normal would be The Geek, Sam & Max's girl companion who lives in the Sub-Basement of Solitude in the short-lived Animated Series.

[Ashton]

As somone said above soemwhere, I like the idea of them going on the road with a "mobile office" travel trailer hooked to the desoto. (though on a related note, I still ahvn't figured out where teh duo sleeps...tehy seem to be in the office 24/7...)

EDIT:
I also like the idea of sybil and abe eloping, perhaps they travel to LA (or someplace WAY WAY WAY off) and the possessed desoto returns without them! That way they'd be out ofthe picture for a season or so. I like sybil and want to see mroe of her, but she is getting kinda stale... a season or two without her would give the writers time to get together soem fresh material.

[tabacco]

As somone said above soemwhere, I like the idea of them going on the road with a "mobile office" travel trailer hooked to the desoto. (though on a related note, I still ahvn't figured out where teh duo sleeps...tehy seem to be in the office 24/7...)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=owN6A18TKrA

[Ashton]

I remember that short. and yes, just liek that except perhaps fewer violations of the laws of physics...

[Zeek]

Somehow, if Sam & Max did own a trailer as their mobile office, I kind of imagined it being really beat up both inside and outside.

[loaldnt]

I hope a middle way. I explain: I want some characters from season 2 but a couple of new characters in third. The story must be resetted, becouse to continue that of the season 2 will make all even more complex. season 2 was already difficult to understand, in certain point.

[tobar]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=owN6A18TKrA

I think that was the first Mickey Mouse cartoon I ever saw (when I was a kid). :D While watching it right now, I was imagining Goofy as Sam and Mickey as Max and Donald as Bosco. :p

[Emi]

Most definitely not. It does however need a refresh. My opinion on the Poppers can be found in this thread. (http://telltalegames.com/forums/showthread.php?p=65017#post65017) Abe and Sybil should be gone the entire season and have only Sybil come back for Season 4 and have her hook up with the monster. I got tired of Abe rather quickly. My favorite new character is easily Grandpa Stinky and I would like more of him. I still like the C.O.P.S. (especially Bluster Blaster), so more of them would be nice along with the Maimtron, Little Timmy, Superball, Flint Paper and the bug you got from Bosco. Ditch the North Pole, Wack-da-Ratz and the no longer singing bear head from the office. It makes it too crowded. And that is all I can think of for the moment.

[Jai]

Most of the absolutely funniest gutsploding jokebombs (Not jokes that ARE bombs . . . well, not jokes that are bombs that are duds, but instead, uh, live armed jocular warheads with laughter payloads and killing (If you die laughing) impact) in both seasons have been because of references to prior episodes. I see no reason for a "reboot", especially since they can continue to just go anywhere else and do anything they please. I'm not seeing any corners that Sam & Max painted themselves into over the past two seasons. Why reboot? You want to pretend they never did any of this? They'd have to do it all over again, and that would be a crummy third season!

[Bagge]

A reset would be illogical, but I agree that some things neds to be cleaned up.

The office (and the street) is getting too cluttered. I like the idea of the trophies in the closet, but the office space looks less and less like the cool, worn out office it began as, and more like a yard sale.

I also hope the longer delay between S2 and S3 means a lot of new characters and locations. I absolutely understand the need to reuse characters in episode-based games, but in order to stay fresh, I think S3 needs to get rid of (or at least lower the appearance rate) of a few characters and add a good number of new ones. Now that Sybil and Abe are married and on their honeymoon, maybe a new character could move into Sybils old building. Expanding the neighbourhood is also a possibility.

A new villain would be cool as well, and this time maybe the identity of the main bad-guy could be know throughout the entire season, instead of revealing which one of Sam & Max's previous aquantances is behind everything in the last episode? There is nothing wrong with that in the first two seasons, but I beleave S3 needs to do things a bit differently to avoid becoming predictable.

Oh, and I want more Flint, but make sure he stays a whisky-drinking, chain smoking, triggerhappy private detective with an attitude. His off-screen appearance in HtR is nothing short of legendary.

[Jai]

The office (and the street) is getting too cluttered. I like the idea of the trophies in the closet, but the office space looks less and less like the cool, worn out office it began as, and more like a yard sale.

Yep, I absolutely agree with that.

[Ashton]

I still dont think that season 3 should reset, but I've been playing some other games and decided that in some cases a reset *IS* a good idea. When a character travels down a path that ends up contrary to his nature or contrary to what he is suppsoed to stand for... then soemtimes a reboot and a slight rearangement of the backstory is needed...

I'll be glad to explain, but It's probably a bit of a faux pas to talk about other games 100% non-relational on the S+M game forum...

[onionmaster]

I think what everybody wants to do is to recreate Hit The Road in terms of humour and gameplay, but the thing that makes this series so different is actually just the amount of talking there is, often it is required to solve puzzles- they cannot always be figured out logically like in the classic adventure games. (Broken Sword is much worse for this though).

Personally I do think that the series tries to establish itself as a sitcom episode every time when really it could have more variety- an expanded idea of Hit The Road- the opportunity to visit a new area in each game by driving there, possibly dropping off at a hotel each time, picking up items and what not, so you can leave there the next morning (or the following game) and go to your new location, without having to take up the whole series on one location or area.

Also, I believe Bluster Blaster got messed up because Sam messed with his past in 204. I think that the first series was somewhat campy with the repetition of characters such as The Soda Poppers and Hugh Bliss, and Sam and Max is somewhat more gritty in both the original game and the comics. I do believe that the current pop culture references are a little too frequent and the games, while being a parody of the american way should let that be based on locations and not entirely on characters- i'm pretty sure that was the way of Hit The Road.

I apologise if that seems more like a rant than suggestions but there you go.

[Zeek]

Also, I believe Bluster Blaster got messed up because Sam messed with his past in 204.

Bluster Blaster got messed up because he was the tester for the wireless internet antenna and got struck by lightning. They then put him on laughing gas to ease his pain (which begs the question how do you put a machine under the effects of laughing gas?).

If Sam did anything to him, he made Bluster Blaster how he was (at least audibaly) in 105.