What's your theory about the ending of Monkey Island 2 - LeChuck's Revenge?

[Ash735]

Originally Posted by Rather Dashing

The Curse explanation feels...artificial, to me.

Well imagine this, YOU'VE just been hired by LucasArts to write the script for the new MI game after MI2, but you have to make sense AND keep it simple for new fans, how would YOU go about it?

[Spadge]

Aliens. Or time travel.

[PariahKing]

Originally Posted by Rather Dashing

I consider it barely more valid than a fanfiction, honestly. Story-wise, it was assigned to someone else who had no involvement with the planning and thought put into the second game's ending. In the basest sense, they were paid fanfiction writers.

That's kind of harsh.

[Ash735]

Originally Posted by Spadge

Or time travel.

You mean like in Escape from Monkey Island where Ozzie Mandrill went back in time and knocked H.T.Marley into the Whirpool before LeChuck had the chance?



OOOOHHHHHH

[Spadge]

Well, no. More like Guybrush being sucked into a time vortex and becoming his own Grandpa.

[Astro Gnocci]

Well, i think the "wrong" thing in CMI wasn't the explanation itself, but simply the fact that did try to explain stuff.
Having the game start in the middle of the ocean without any apparent reason was great : it kind of told you (or could have) "okay, so, we don't have any idea of what this MI2 Ending was supposed to mean, so let's just start from scrap and have some fun". Kind of what Telltale did with Tales and the whole fictional MI5 joke.
The whole sequence in the end wasn't "wrong" because it was bad or anything, but it seemed like trying to hard to link the game to the previous two. I guess some well thought joke along the lines of "who cares ? shut up and die !" would, in the end, have worked better than this tedious and almost desperate try to make sense.

[alexonfyre]

Hahahaha, I just went back and did the ending of MI2 again so it would be fresh, and did so right after playing the SoMI:SE... aside from the obvious references, it seemed as though it was a parody on the Star Wars tale. I mean the story parallels are all there throughout 1 and 2, the end part is obviously the end battle at Cloud City. The end sequence skips ahead to the end of Star Wars ep. 6 and, there being no obvious way to end it there, they picked the dream sequence Deus ex Machina a la Dallas.
Seems to me like they never planned on making more, that they wanted to move on to new franchises and the line with Elaine at the end was simply an out if they were forced to make another one by LA. Problem is that they had all moved on with their lives by the time LA decided to revive the series and the new team was totally in the dark about what Ron really wanted. Seems to me like they didn't want to pick up the "horrible SPELL" ball and just say something like "I lived in a strange place called 'South Dakota' for what seemed like 3 weeks until Lechuck once again attempted to kill me using a voodoo necklace which backfired and destroyed the curse which I had been under. Shortly thereafter Elaine found me unconcious at the the bottom of the deep hole..."
Instead opting to retcon it at the end rather than the beginning, which awkwarded it all up.

But despite all of that story I just made up, I have one lingering question...
What happened to the treasure chest Guybrush was holding on to before he fell?

[Ash735]

Originally Posted by alexonfyre

But despite all of that story I just made up, I have one lingering question...
What happened to the treasure chest Guybrush was holding on to before he fell?

It smashed on the floor, that's the broken case in the first room, although there is no treasure in it, only the mysterious E Ticket.

[bigdondoo]

Originally Posted by Ash735

Well imagine this, YOU'VE just been hired by LucasArts to write the script for the new MI game after MI2, but you have to make sense AND keep it simple for new fans, how would YOU go about it?

Big Whoop is an illusory simulated reality construct of the world as a theme park developed by LeChuck to keep Guybrush docile in his captivity. Guybrush must then recruit a crew to free others from Big Whoop and recruit them to their resistance against LeChuck. Within Big Whoop, they are able to use their understanding of its nature to bend the laws of physics within the simulation, giving them superhuman abilities. Guybrush is "the One", a man prophesied to end LeChuck's control through his limitless control over Big Whoop.

That's how I would go about it.

[Toothless Gibbon]

Originally Posted by Rather Dashing

I consider it barely more valid than a fanfiction, honestly. Story-wise, it was assigned to someone else who had no involvement with the planning and thought put into the second game's ending. In the basest sense, they were paid fanfiction writers.

Chuck Jordan was a paid fanfiction writer?

What do you think about the writers of ToMI then? (Specifically Mike Stemmle) Are they paid fanfiction writers too or does Dave Grossman's presence make them genuine?

[Novotnus]

Originally Posted by Vira

Best theory I've ever read about Monkey Island (I think it was on this forum) was basically that Guybrush was a failed writer who fell into a coma. His brother, Chuckie, stole his girlfriend from him so in his mind he convinces himself that LeChuck's evil. And his favorite ride as a kid was Disney's "Pirates of the Caribbean" so pirates became the main subject of his book and, consequently, his fantasies.

So everytime his mind came closer to the truth, he manages to convince himself otherwise. I like this theory because it explains his skeletal parents (they're dead and he's older), LeChuck and Chuckie's obsession with Elaine, and Guybrush's seemingly adult mind. And it can work with the proceeding games as well.

Hey, I didn't know anyone liked my theory : ) I posted it long time ago on World of MI and later here, in "Calling Mr Grossman" thread. The whole Disney thing isn't that important, as he's a writer (or a game designer) so he writes adventure books about pirates and that's his imaginatory world he escapes to when he can't stand his life anymore.
The moment when you see your parents skeletons under "Lost parents" sign is really creepy and very non-humorous, so probably he has some trauma with his parents.

[Karl]

You know, I was just thinking about the end of LeChuck's revenge, and it just hit me like a brick wall!

So...


No, it wasn't a portal to another dimension.


No, it wasn't a curse by LeChuck.


No, it wasn't Big Whoop!


No, it isn't an overactive imagination.


My theory:

When Guybrush is making his voodoo doll, if I remember correctly, doesn't he use HIS PARENT'S BONES to create it? So..Guybrush makes voodoo doll of LeChuck, and because he used his paren's bones as a part of the doll, it goes wrong. His own voodoo doll's magic MAKES LeChuck his brother! And there you have a reason of why the events took place.

This also fits in with the interview with Ron GIlbert, where when asked if LeChuck was hGuybrush's brother, Ron replied "He is and he isn't.." and also that Big Whoop was meaningless in the game.

Thoughts on this one guys?

[Bagge]

Originally Posted by Karl

My theory:

When Guybrush is making his voodoo doll, if I remember correctly, doesn't he use HIS PARENT'S BONES to create it? So..Guybrush makes voodoo doll of LeChuck, and because he used his paren's bones as a part of the doll, it goes wrong. His own voodoo doll's magic MAKES LeChuck his brother! And there you have a reason of why the events took place.

This also fits in with the interview with Ron GIlbert, where when asked if LeChuck was hGuybrush's brother, Ron replied "He is and he isn't.." and also that Big Whoop was meaningless in the game.

Thoughts on this one guys?

LeChuck reveals to Guybrush that he is his brother before you start making the voodoo doll, which is why using the bones of your parents makes sense in the first place.

Whatever happens at the end - Guybrush being pulled out of his fantasy, stepping into another dimension through Big Whoop, LeChuck casting a spell on Guybrush... - it is obvious that it has already started happening the minute you meet LeChuck again in the tunnels below Dinky. The game takes a very sudden turn for the surreal and dream-like in this very last part, with modern-day tunnels storing an elevator to Melee Island, (presumably) the broken grog machine from MI1 and the bones of your parents sitting in a waiting room.

[Karl]

Oh he told it beforehand?

But still, he could have lied to Guybrush to get him to make the doll. Isn't it awefully convenient that the bones just happened to be lying there? And also having made a voodoo doll himself, he willingly blows his nose for Guybrush and gives it back to him, knowing what he is probably doing?

[Lord-z]

If I might quote Roger Ebert talking about the movie Being There "The movie presents us with an image, and while you may discuss the meaning of the image it is not permitted to devise explanations for it. Since Ashby does not show a pier, there is no pier — a movie is exactly what it shows us, and nothing more."

Likewise, what the game shows us is that it is a curse of LeChuck by flashing his eyes. In fact, it goes out of its way to tell us so, by showing Elaine dangling and saying "Gee, I hope he wasn't cursed". Any theories about "the lingering imagination of a child" or "Elaine is just another playmate" is going out of the game and making up explanations.

[Armakuni]

It's all just kids playing, that's pretty obvious to me. I don't mind.

[Jazzy]

Originally Posted by Lord-z

If I might

No you might not.

Originally Posted by Lord-z

quote Roger Ebert talking about the movie Being There "The movie presents us with an image, and while you may discuss the meaning of the image it is not permitted to devise explanations for it. Since Ashby does not show a pier, there is no pier — a movie is exactly what it shows us, and nothing more."

Likewise, what the game shows us is that it is a curse of LeChuck by flashing his eyes. In fact, it goes out of its way to tell us so, by showing Elaine dangling and saying "Gee, I hope he wasn't cursed". Any theories about "the lingering imagination of a child" or "Elaine is just another playmate" is going out of the game and making up explanations.

The Elaine scene and glowing eyes could all be there to raise questions. Elaine wondering whether Guybrush is under a spell merely raises the possibility of such, not confirmation of the scenario, and (depending upon the intentions of the author) provides an out for possibly continuing the series.

Plus you got to remember that the guys making the game were not movie directors and probably didn't have a clue as to how things like that were probably meant to go (videogaming was still a young industry at the time), and besides, it's given us all something to debate all these years.

[pilouuuu]

I just remembered when LeChuck is brought back to life by Largo with his beard. Doesn't he tell something to the Voodoo priest? To make a spell? That could be the spell that Elaine refered at the end.

It is pretty clear to me. Le Chuck asked the Voodoo priest to make a spell. But the voodoo needs some strange ingredients to get done. The spell must be fully "activated" by the person that is going to suffer it. So Lechuck's places all the ingredients beneath Dinky Island for Guybrush to find.

The bones are probably LeChuck's parents! Why would two skeletons be put there with a sign saying "Lost Parents"? Isn't that suspicious?

The E-Ticket is probably the portal to Big Whoop and not Big Whoop itself, which may be a park, another dimention, hell, limbo, or any other thing Ron Gilbert had in mind.

Maybe LeChuck wanted Guybrush to be tortured not only physically, but also psychologically. That's why he took Guybrush there. I really doubt they are really brothers. Le Chuck seems to be too much older. He has dark hair and Guybrush is blonde.

It is an ambiguous ending and sometimes I get confused by it, and in that sense it is a brilliant ending because after so many years we are still discusing it, but honestly after you start to analyse it, all points to a spell.

[Bagge]

Don't you think the spell LeChuck is refering to is the creation of the Guybrush voodoo doll?

[Ash735]

You know what, I'm going to go back to my wacky theory, That E Ticket was Laced with Acid and Guybrush was just tripping balls in those tunnels whilst Elaine escaped and LeChuck gave chase.