Money?

[Avistew]

Since people have been talking about their financial lives...

I'm from a wealthy family. Middle-class, maybe? I'm not quite sure. Both my parents are doctor by my mother stopped working pretty early to take care of her 4 kids, and only started working again recently. (Stupid, too. My dad would have enjoyed raising us better, and would have coped better with not working. Or they could both have worked half-time or something. Anyways).

But my dad on his own earned enough that we sometimes went on holidays and stuff, and we had pocket money.
I never got along with my mom, what with her insistence that we ruined her life by being born and forcing her to stop working (nevermind that she was trying to have us) or saying we should be thankful that we didn't have to pay a rent (that was before we were old enough to work).
So I wanted to get the hell out of there as soon as I could.
First though I tried an art school. It was pricey but my parents paid (it was their idea to begin with actually. My going to the art school, I mean). It was horrible, if I may say so. 90 hours a week (including the time spent at home on assignments) and assignments during vacations that caused us to keep that rhythm. I didn't last more than the first year. And didn't sleep most nights during that year.
Then I took a part-time job (4 hours 6 days a week, so 24 hours altogether) while studying English in university. Did that for two years, the second year I met my husband and left for Canada for a year.
Then I came back, studied some Japanese but it was too slow for me so I stopped, found a full-time job (minimum wage kind of thing), married my husband (who couldn't find work) and got stressed out.

Then we moved to Canada and now he's the one who has a job and I'm the one who doesn't.

Can't say I've ever really had money trouble. When I had my parents I could have asked them if I had needed money, and now, well I just don't spend that much. Although I constantly worry we're not putting enough aside for retirement or things like that.
I've never been super-rich (although we did have two cars for a year, because my dad needed his to go to work and my mom was using the other to get us to school. I don't think many families can afford to have two cars so we must have been rich enough), but I've never been super-poor either (one of us of my husband or me always worked so we were never without an income at all, except sometimes for a couple of months between jobs and the like).

So I guess I don't really know what it's like on either end of the spectrum.

[kaptein_kaffe]

I'm a saver myself. Somehow by being open about my economy to friends I've managed give them the illusion of being this loaded mofo. Very annoying to say the least, becuase they'll allways come to me whenever they need money. The fact is that I've got a 60 000 NOK car loan and three years of school with no steady income ahead of me. And on top of that I just payed 30 000 NOK for my drivers license.

Just to give you an idea, 30 000 NOK equals about 3761,8 euros. My monthly salary is about 12 000 .. NOK that is.

I only hope that I'll be able to keep my car trough three years of school .. I love my car.

But just like avistew put it, I like to be a little bit in control with my economy. One of my best buddies is really annoying in this matter. He just bought himself a new desktop just to be able to play Battlefield BC2, we've got two concerts and a vacation planned for the summer and on top of that he suggests that we go to the roskilde festival as well. This is coming from a guy without a job who owes me 2000 NOK and intends to pay me back when he gets back on his feet.

I don't really care how people prioritize their money but I really hate it when you have to be the one to remind him of his own debts. He won't see another penny from me, that's for sure.

[Hassat Hunter]

I easily get around, I am a small spender.

I am jobless, but from my financial aid from the government I can easily get around, something others have issues with... somehow.

I am not sure how they would pull that off, since I get 400 euro's per month more than I spend.

So I am not really that bothered actually to find a job and earn more... I guess that's rather bad though in the eyes of most people...

[corruptbiggins]

My family never really been financially well off. My dad worked down in a mine for 30 years (up to about 10 years ago) and my mum worked full time as soon as I was old enough to go to school. From what I can remember they earned enough for us to live in a semi comfortable environment but there wasn't much spent on luxuries like holidays abroad and stuff. Actually I think it's a testament to my parents how little they allowed their financial situation effect my brother & I. I mean, we were always treated at Christmas & on birthdays. If we needed some money we got it, and that's still true to this day even though they are worse off now than they used to be. Sure, I didn't get much pocket money nor did we go on fancy holidays abroad (though we did go to northern France once, via hovercraft - that's about the only trip abroad we took until 1999/2000).

Things changed when my grandmother won around £1 million on the national lottery in later 1998 (or early 1999). Suddenly we had a comfortable amount of money and it gave us new opportunities. But it all wasn't plain sailing. My grandmother was given financial advice by a bank which, in hindsight, wasn't very good. She lost a lot of money due to bad advice (the economic effect of the September 11th attacks didn't help either - she had a fair bit of money invested in various stocks and stuff). Still there was and is enough left to give her a comfortable life, though she can't lavish it on her family any more.

My parents moved to Cyprus about 7 to 8 years ago, having set up a business consisting of a pub and a restaurant here in England a few years prior. The pub was a success, but the restaurant didn't do so well. In the end they had to sell them both at a loss. Still they wanted to stay in Cyprus, in a semi-retired state with just my dad working as a pool cleaner. Recent economic events have made it harder to maintain a constant source of income as most of my dad's customers are English people who've retired to Cyprus and the global recession a lot of them became unwilling to pay to have their pools cleaned all year round. So my dad's winter income shrank a lot (that's the problem with a seasonal jobs, too bad bills aren't seasonal as well) and there were a few who just went home so he lost out in the summer months too. So that combined with their general health (my dad's vision has been getting steadily worse over the past few years and now he needs an operation) they've decided to come home to England where they can at least get some benefit from the Government (which was another problem working in Cyprus - they weren't technically legal to work there, and to be legal as a foreigner you had to pay a lot (possibly around €500-€600 per month, whether you were earning or not - can't remember exact figure)).

Now I'm relying on student loans and grants to get me financially through university. I do this because I need to take the responsibility of my life and education as an adult. I know if I asked my parents for money that they would give me as much as they can. But I can't put the burden of my lifestyle on their slim income. So I've known a life with and without money, and I've learned a lot in the process. I've made mistakes but I think I'm getting it right now. I hope anyway, only time will tell.

Damn, I didn't mean to write so much.

[Little Writer]

I currently have no idea about my financial situation. We've done some extensive renovations in the house and there are several bills still underway, and we don't know how high they'll be exactly. Usually I keep track of how much we earn and spend each month, but because we've been spending so much on the house, the whole balance is out of wack. It'll be at least until next month before we can see a "normal" month with "normal" costs.

Last year I think we saved about 10% of our income each month. I keep track of grocery and fuel costs (needs), clothes bought (combination of needs and wants), as well as luxury items (wants) as books, dvd's and games.

Mortgage included, I think our needs total somewhere between 50 and 60% of our income each month, but that's not including a lot of other "needs", like the stuff required by law (taxes, insurance, etc.), which we pay only once a year, and extra costs like car checkups, haircuts, etc. You could argue that some of those lean more toward the "wants" category, but still ... We also go out to dinner sometime; that's a "want" in my book, even if it does save groceries and the time and energy of preparing the food in your own kitchen.

I used to buy a lot of books, games and dvd's, but I've cut down a lot. I always tried to buy them in secondhand stores or eBay, but sometimes you just have to buy a new release, you know? When it comes to books, I prefer them in English, and importing a hardback doubles the price. I'd like to get a PS3, but it seems that every time I've saved some cash, I end up having to spend it on this or that.

I found 5 euro in the grass the other day. It really made my day.

[Shwoo]

I don't have a job, but I can't work either because my anxiety is really bad, so I get a government pension at the moment. It's only barely enough to live on, and was even less before I turned 21 last month, but I live with my parents, so I don't need to live on it yet, and my attention span is so bad that there isn't much I want to buy, either. I'm hoping to get well enough to be able to work eventually.

I don't think my parents had a lot of money when I was little, but we definitely weren't poor. It's possible that they were just frugal or I that didn't know to ask for things I wanted.

[Avistew]

I've been enjoying people's stories! (Not that it makes me happy when your situation is bad of course).

Let's see, with actual numbers... My husband earns 1,400 a paycheque (that's every two weeks), which is actually pretty good, almost 3,000 a month (in Canadian dollars). (Which I guess mean we do earn over 30,000 a year?! Wow! We used to earn half that when I was the one working!)
Of course he does work 18 hour shift, 1 PM to 7 AM the next day, which means we don't get to see much of each other, (and when we do one of us is usually asleep) and that sucks. But he loves his job (he works with the mentally challenged).

Our rent is 756 including the 6 dollar fee to get a money order (which is the only way we're allowed to pay the rent), and then we have phone bills, Internet and food. I'd say all of these I count as needs although I guess the Internet might be a luxury. Altogether they add up to something like 1,200.

We save up around the same amount, (if I could I'd stash ALL the rest away but my husband won't let me), and what's left is spent on wants (games, books, eating out...) or just sits there in our main account (which comes in handy when we have an unexpected vet bill). (The savings are automated and sent to other accounts so we don't end up spending them accidentally).

When I look at that I think "we're doing pretty good", but then I keep worrying, thinking we need to save up for retirement for two people on only one income, that we don't have an emergency fund yet, etc.
I'm sure a lot of people are much worse-off of course, but I tend to think worst-case scenario, you know?

On the other hand, never in our lives have we been able to save that much (we used to live in Paris when 750 dollars a months wouldn't even be enough for renting a studio, plus it's bigger so we had transportation fees while here we walk everywhere, etc) so I'm feeling relaxed about it.

I do wish he didn't work that much though :S Wouldn't want him to wear himself out.

Oh, and something that annoys me a lot. An ex-roommate of my husband's, who earned about 4 times what my husband does, would keep "borrowing" money that he wouldn't pay back, and complain that he wished he was as rich as we were.
...That just annoys me. It's not like he had huge debts he needed to pay back and had no money left. He's the one who spent it on stuff all the time. Good for him, but don't go telling people who make a quarter of what you do that you wish you were as rich as them. It doesn't make you look good.
(We stopped lending him money a while ago. It felt like we were encouraging a destructive habit, you know?)

Here, you've got details and everything, specific numbers and such. Sorry if I sound like I'm complaining when I'm actually in a pretty sweet situation. Complaining is just what I do, you see :P

[kaptein_kaffe]

Originally Posted by avistew

It felt like we were encouraging a destructive habit, you know?)

Exactly! I guess it's just a matter of learning how to dodge it. A great argument in any case is to ask them why they bought the 50 inch tv, the iphone or other pricy possessions if they're in such a dire need of money

The worst kind in my opinion are the ones who catch you off guard. The ones who would stand in line with you at the supermarket and ask as they're about to pay if they can borrow some money, even if they were fully aware of it the whole time.

[MusicallyInspired]

Between my wife and I and our 2 kids, our needs are basically 90% or more of our income. We rarely have enough for wants. It's nice when we do, though.

[patters]

Wanna know how much Debt I have?

£12,000, $18,000 to the Americans

From 2 years of uni, of a 3 to 4 year course. YEAH that's cool.

[puzzlebox]

I really want to add to this discussion, but every time I try I start writing pages and pages and then give up. I just don't know how to write about my life without coming across as a complete prat. :P

[Icedhope]

Originally Posted by PecanBlue

Yes, fast. 3-4 hours per class + 11-week term + 5 classes per term = completed within two or three years. One school that does this to horrible extents is Fullsail.

I was originaly going to go to fullsail, and then Yare told me. "No, It's a ripoff, if you wan the bang for your buck, go to a 4 year school."*

*might not be entierly accurate, but well it's close enough Me thinks.

[Steve2000]

The thing that frustrates me is cost-of-living. I live in the San Francisco Bay Area, which means that I have to spend well over half my salary each month just to rent a house for my family. Don't get me wrong, I love where I live and don't want to move, but it is still a little sad every time I see/hear about someone buying a brand-new 5 bedroom house or something somewhere and they only earn half of what I make.

On the topic of spender vs saver, there is an important variable to consider. The money you earn today is worth less in the future. It is often better to put your money to good use in things that have value and are important to you. Obviously you need to save money for emergencies and building up credit debt is an insane idea, but the only way to make savings worth it is to get the money into a retirement account or other long-term interest-earning account. Just having extra money pile up in a no-interest checking account is a total waste.

[Avistew]

Originally Posted by kaptein_kaffe

Exactly! I guess it's just a matter of learning how to dodge it. A great argument in any case is to ask them why they bought the 50 inch tv, the iphone or other pricy possessions if they're in such a dire need of money

The straw that broke the camel's back was when he moved into a new place and bought a new computer (because it was on sale) and as a result missed his first rent payment. How can you be so clueless?!

Originally Posted by Steve2000

The thing that frustrates me is cost-of-living.

I used to live in Paris and I hear you on that.

Originally Posted by Steve2000

Just having extra money pile up in a no-interest checking account is a total waste.

I wouldn't let it pile up with no interest, personally (as I said we have automatic transfers to savings accounts), but even someone who did, even if the money ends up being worth less and less... It's still worth more than the $0 it would be worth if you had spent it already. Just saying.
Sure if there is something you really want, and waiting would only mean buying the same thing, but later, and you know it won't reduce in price, then buy it now.
Otherwise, by the time the stuff you want to buy is available, having spent your money on something else isn't really going to help.

I guess I just don't get the "spend your money on something, otherwise it will be worth less and less!". Well after I spend it I don't have any at all, so I'll take the reduced value over that.

[nikasaur]

Originally Posted by avistew

I get annoyed at how help is always counted depending on how much your parents earn. I know lots of people who don't get any financial help from their parents, yet because their parents earn over a certain amount, they won't get help from the government either, it's stupid.

Yep, I think the cut-off date for that is age 25. I wasn't able to get grants because my mother's tax records put me over the financial limit.
I rarely speak with my mother, much less accept financial help from her. It was highly frustrating to still be considered a dependent.

[JedExodus]

This thread makes me sad everytime I look at it

[PecanBlue]

Originally Posted by Icedhope

I was originaly going to go to fullsail, and then Yare told me. "No, It's a ripoff, if you wan the bang for your buck, go to a 4 year school."*

*might not be entierly accurate, but well it's close enough Me thinks.

'Tis true, I took a tour of it and researched online about it and it's a pretty-looking and very expensive institute, but not much else. They try and cram everything within one or two years, (Even having labs at 3 AM for christ's sake! I've heard some classes are at this ungodly hour too, but I haven't been able to confirm it so it's a playground rumor right now.) which for a school that expensive is bullcrap. I heard their accreditation sucks also. My friend once tried to talk me into going by saying "people who complain about their schedules don't realize Fullsail just tries to imitate the typical career lifestyle." Excuse me? I don't know about you guys but when I attend a college I pay heavy amounts of money for I expect to LEARN about the career efficiently and also learn about self-discipline in the process, with an actual job on the side.

[Icedhope]

Originally Posted by PecanBlue

'Tis true, I took a tour of it and researched online about it and it's a pretty-looking and very expensive institute, but not much else. They try and cram everything within one or two years, (Even having labs at 3 AM for christ's sake! I've heard some classes are at this ungodly hour too, but I haven't been able to confirm it so it's a playground rumor right now.) which for a school that expensive is bullcrap. I heard their accreditation sucks also. My friend once tried to talk me into going by saying "people who complain about their schedules don't realize Fullsail just tries to imitate the typical career lifestyle." Excuse me? I don't know about you guys but when I attend a college I pay heavy amounts of money for I expect to LEARN about the career efficiently and also learn about self-discipline in the process, with an actual job on the side.

See, thats what I wanted to do, but I heard Fullsail, just isn't that great, and I want to be a programmer, and well I don't think anyone really works until three in the morning unless it's their choice too and or thats what time, a Said schedule shoot is, and I'm pretty sure there are well, day crews and night crews. I agree with you though, I'm getting a free ride through school from the government even though, I'm not paying for it. I want to go to the best I can.

[Little Writer]

It's kind of a paradox: you need to live, but you need money to support yourself, so you need to work to make money, but working usually means less time to invest in the rest of your life.

I always separate my work from my private life. The two don't combine. My private life is who I am, my work is like a necessary evil.

While money is important, I don't see how people can actually obsess over their work. I love earning money, it's not that, but what I mean is when the work you do actually becomes more important than the life you're trying to support with the money you earn.

Perhaps it's just some kind of mechanism to deal with the fact that you actually spend the majority of your time at work, so you tell yourself it's the most important part of your life as well.

When my wife comes home in the evenings, it's like she's constantly talking about her work and her colleagues. She often becomes quite enthusiastic about those colleagues, and I'm like, "Hey, you're married to me, right? And you've already spent the entire day with those people. So could you just leave them alone and pay ME some attention? I want to hear how YOU are doing, I don't need to know everything THEY said."

I don't mind sometimes mentioning something. I rarely talk about my work, but I still tell stuff sometimes. But not from the moment I walk in the door, through dinner, even pausing TV programs, and even in bed.

And that's just because she really likes her work for the fun factor. I dare not imagine how it could be for really career-minded business people whose entire life is nothing but their work.

But if that is the way some people want it, I'll respect that. I guess it's only natural if you spent thousands on an education in preparement for that job, you want to try your best to earn that all back. I also guess that these people are just investing into their future, concentrating on their work to earn as much as they can, so they can put away as much as they can for when they retire.

But suppose you have an accident or get sick, and you don't get a chance at retirement?

I prefer enjoying my "free" life as much as I can. Perhaps I'm not earning as much as I could in a different job, with more responsability but also more hours, but that balance between work and life is just too important to me.

I sincerely hope I haven't offended anyone with this. Everyone leads their own life, there's certainly no "perfect" path when it comes to this. They're just personal choices and I wanted to express mine, so feel free to counter this with your own, and perhaps try to explain to me the real motivations behind them: I'm definitely open for them.

[kaptein_kaffe]

I too, as a part time musician, think it's important to seperate work and your actual life. Maybe I'm just a hippie with a poor work ethic, I don't know. I just can't focus on my music if I'm involved with my work 100% of the time.

I think it's great to see people who find a way to cope with their work and actually enjoy it. The company I work for is owned by a big company in Oslo, so I meet some of those hardcore office sluggers from time to time. Some of them are very down to earth and talkative people, a lot of them are also very obsessed with their work.

It's not all that different from being a full time artist when you think of it. The thing you really enjoy just happens to be your job as well.