References to Escape

[Teeth]

As with every Monkey Island game, Tales of Monkey Island has tons of references to its predecessors. However, while it's chock-full of callbacks to Secret, Revenge and Curse, Escape is often skimmed over or ignored; Morgan knows about all of Guybrush's adventures, except for that time he used a giant monkey robot to kill an evil Australian land developer, and Stan seems to have forgotten the time he spent hawking real estate (though he does mention Jambalaya Island), and Murray doesn't really go into why he quit working at Planet Threepwood.

Of course, I can understand why it was done this way, seeing as the game has its...fair share of problems. And rebooting the series back to its original style rather than continuing on in the direction Escape was heading in was definitely the best way to go.

Here are all the references to Escape from Monkey Island I found in Tales of Monkey Island:

-At the beginning, Elaine says "And now we're going to die. Again." Presumably, she's referring to Guybrush being buried alive in Curse and herself being declared legally dead in Escape, respectively. It's a very cryptic comment, mind you.
-The Ultimate Insult is on Guybrush's Cursed Cutlass of Kerflu recipe.
-Jambalaya Island is mentioned by Stan
-Guybrush's middle name is still Ulysses, or at least, it begins with a U.
-Guybrush mentions LeChuck's living statue form.

It would appear that only the most important events from Escape, involving Guybrush, Elaine, LeChuck and Stan, have carried over to Tales, and the rest of the game can be left vague. The only exception would be the stuff involving Herman Toothrot, which will probably never be touched apon and we'll most likely never see him again.

But anyway, does anyone know if anything else from Escape From Monkey Island is ever mentioned in Tales?

[monkeymovies]

Yeah Guybrush's middle name is still Ulysses. There's a bit in RotPG (can't remember when, I played it months ago. Play it again when the DVD is out!), when Guybrush says something like "Ha! That's my middle name! ... Actually it's...Ulysses, but..."

Yeah I doubt we'll see Herman again if there are any more games, or HORATIO as we must now call him.

[Captain Mickey]

Wait what? When does he say that? ... Actually now that I think about it, when exactly did they say his middle name in Escape? (haven't played it since it's release....oh wow....)

[Teeth]

In Escape Elaine addresses him by his full name if you try to drink the can of grog. In The Trial and Execution of Guybrush Threepwood he mentions it when you talk to Bosun Krebbs in Club 41.

[Captain Mickey]

Ooooh ok.

[LeChuck1986]

Also, 1 LeChuck line is partially rehashed.

EfMI: The Ultimate Insult. With it's unholy powers I will make the sea run red with the blood of my enemies. I will bring the forces of hell to the shores of the carribean....

The bolded part was a line which LeChuck used in Launch of the Screaming Narhwal.
It's a small part, so it could be an coincidence

[snip3z4kills]

Originally Posted by LeChuck1986

Also, 1 LeChuck line is partially rehashed.

EfMI: The Ultimate Insult. With it's unholy powers I will make the sea run red with the blood of my enemies. I will bring the forces of hell to the shores of the carribean....

The bolded part was a line which LeChuck used in Launch of the Screaming Narhwal.
It's a small part, so it could be an coincidence

That's actually a very well used quote, so it's probably just coincidence.

[Teeth]

There's also Morgan in RotPG saying "I'm gonna hunt pirates! Present company excluded, of course." And in the Voodoo Lady's shop in Escape, attempting to pick up the Voodoo doll makes Guybrush say "I don't like torturing strangers. Present company excluded, of course."

[Rather Dashing]

Kind of makes me wish less people liked Curse so we could boot back all the way to the actually good games, but I suppose public opinion can't be helped.

[Ash735]

Originally Posted by Rather Dashing

Kind of makes me wish less people liked Curse so we could boot back all the way to the actually good games, but I suppose public opinion can't be helped.

Oh come on, barring the last two acts of Curse, which were rushed, what's wrong with places like Plunder Island, Blood Island? Characters like Murray, Goodsoup, etc.

Plus the music was awesome, Michael Land's best really, the character designs may be weird to some, but background designs are brilliant, etc.

And besides, as much as you hate Curse, if we didn't acknowledge it, then Tales couldn't exist, not just about the whole Ring issue but also, you know, the whole MI2 ending thing.

Each time I've seen you moan about apparently how crap Curse is, it seems to stem from the last two chapters in the game where they dared to explain what the hell happened after MI2. Even though the whole Curse thing was hinted at in the end of MI2?

[Udvarnoky]

I was on the lookout during Tales for a throwaway line offering closure to Timmy the monkey's story.

[coolsome]

Originally Posted by Udvarnoky

I was on the lookout during Tales for a throwaway line offering closure to Timmy the monkey's story.

They went back to meelee after ending on CMI got a monkey Elaine did some govnery stuff then they went on there honeymoon leaving Timmy behind.

[Rather Dashing]

Originally Posted by Ash735

Oh come on, barring the last two acts of Curse, which were rushed, what's wrong with places like Plunder Island, Blood Island? Characters like Murray, Goodsoup, etc.

A vast number of things, Murray and Plunder Island being the worst offenders in that list, which is too bad because they take up the vast majority of game time, all of it at the start. Blood island is somewhat less of a problem, but by then a lot of the damage had been done, and if the game was trying to leave me with a good impression at the end then it really screwed up the finale.

Plus the music was awesome, Michael Land's best really, the character designs may be weird to some, but background designs are brilliant, etc.

Land's music in Curse is great, mostly better than his work on Tales, even. But the best music award certainly goes to one of the first two games. The first established the musical themes we identify with Monkey Island(Main theme, LeChuck's theme, Love theme, etc). It's simple and iconic. The second game had the iMUSE system, which made the music respond to your actions, something a soundtrack in an interactive medium should ideally do. By going off the player's cues, the music is able to work in ways that it wouldn't as a straight-up track.

Still, Land's music in Curse is by no means "bad" or even "mediocre". It's even great! But the first two games' music is excellent, technological gap aside. But no, I would not hold the music up as a negative of Curse, because it's well done, the same way I wouldn't hold Guybrush or Elaine's voice acting against the game, because it's well done.

And besides, as much as you hate Curse, if we didn't acknowledge it, then Tales couldn't exist, not just about the whole Ring issue but also, you know, the whole MI2 ending thing.

Tales as we know it wouldn't exist, no. But we certainly might have been able to get a better sequel. And if people had enough backlash against Curse even though it exists, it wouldn't be negatively affecting Tales(the same way Escape exists, but due to negative public opinion it is almost completely inconsequential to Tales). Escape is just as good as Curse, as far as I'm concerned, and I'd like to see both equally ignored.

And if I could live in a world in which Curse did not exist, and it did so happen to take away Tales, or even any Monkey Island game made by Telltale at all? It would probably be worth the trade. No sequel at all is better than a sequel that retroactively butchers the originals.

Each time I've seen you moan about apparently how crap Curse is, it seems to stem from the last two chapters in the game where they dared to explain what the hell happened after MI2. Even though the whole Curse thing was hinted at in the end of MI2?

This is something Curse fans never understand. The idea that it was magic is not the biggest problem with the ending. The problem is that it was magic, and that's that, let's sweep this whole thing under the rug so we don't have to deal with it anymore. It was the execution, like they were trying to GET RID OF the Monkey Island 2 ending rather than grow naturally from it. And OF COURSE they did that for money, to bring in people who hadn't played the first two games. And I understand that reasoning, but that doesn't make it a good thing for the franchise.

Curse of Monkey Island is a well-made adventure game. The background art, music, a lot of the voice acting, and most importantly the gameplay and puzzle design are excellently done. The problem is that it doesn't fit with everything else, for a lot of reasons. And while the way they dealt with the ending of Monkey Island 2 isn't the least of them, it's by no means the only issue or even the most important one.

[LuigiHann]

Oh hey, discussion about Curse in an Escape thread, this is new.

I think if Curse was trying to get rid of the ending from Revenge, they wouldn't have set the entire finale in a demonic amusement park.

And I'm personally a big fan of subjective reality in fiction, in which case I have no problem accepting "LeChuck's spell" and "Guybrush's Imagination" not only as equally valid theories, but also as equally true, they are both completely accurate interpretations of what happens in the game as far as I am concerned. I have no problem accepting that the first two games take place mostly in Guybrush's mind, at the end of Revenge he has been snapped out of it, but by the start of Curse he has started imagining again, and has also rationalized away the time he spent in reality as part of a spell... and then he goes on to imagine a couple more adventures after that... he's a creative kid. But then the idea that the adventures take place in his imagination doesn't mean that they aren't real, either. I feel like the whole point of Revenge's ending is that what's real and what's not real isn't so black and white, and I don't feel that the later games broke the spirit of that suggestion, even if they didn't dive as far into it again.

[Wolfstar27]

Originally Posted by LuigiHann

Oh hey, discussion about Curse in an Escape thread, this is new.

I think if Curse was trying to get rid of the ending from Revenge, they wouldn't have set the entire finale in a demonic amusement park.

And I'm personally a big fan of subjective reality in fiction, in which case I have no problem accepting "LeChuck's spell" and "Guybrush's Imagination" not only as equally valid theories, but also as equally true, they are both completely accurate interpretations of what happens in the game as far as I am concerned. I have no problem accepting that the first two games take place mostly in Guybrush's mind, at the end of Revenge he has been snapped out of it, but by the start of Curse he has started imagining again, and has also rationalized away the time he spent in reality as part of a spell... and then he goes on to imagine a couple more adventures after that... he's a creative kid. But then the idea that the adventures take place in his imagination doesn't mean that they aren't real, either. I feel like the whole point of Revenge's ending is that what's real and what's not real isn't so black and white, and I don't feel that the later games broke the spirit of that suggestion, even if they didn't dive as far into it again.

i think you got it right with the that guybrush was a really creative kid, i liked the ending of MI2, and maybe later on you see Guybrush telling his kids the story, which carrys on the adventures of monkey island. i know alot of people would disagree lol

[StarEye]

Originally Posted by Wolfstar27

i know alot of people would disagree lol

Including Nor Treblig

[MonkeyMania]

I made a poll over at Mojo, the majority don't like the "Guybrush's imagination" route.

http://lucasforums.com/showthread.php?t=202652

[adventureaddict]

Why can't we just have a cool pirate story without all this 'oh it was all a dream' outlook. Grr. Alot of people may think of me less because of it, but I really hated MI2's ending.

[dthoupis]

MI2 had no ending! MI2 was to be continued to see the ending. The question is. Do we really want to learn the secret? I for once YES I would like to learn at least what was in Ron Gilberts' mind because the torture for so many years is unbarable!! (no pun intended)
Demetris

[SHODANFreeman]

I really need to just write up a form response to all these threads that devolve into "MI2 sucked!" "MI2 was the best ever!" "I eat cheese on Tuesdays!".