Limited Choices discussion (merged threads)

[Kenneloth]

Originally Posted by WabbitTwaks

I would have to disagree with what you stated about Larry choices.

I think no matter what you do for Larry, he will NOT like you and will try to kill you. He is one of those judgmental assholes and he sees Lee as a murderer only. To him, that means Lee does not deserve to live.

The Glenn thing I have to agree with. He really should be one way or the other, not swap only because you made a particular decision. At the end, if you had given the girl the gun, he does begin to understand the reasons behind it. I have yet to play the other branch of that to the end to see his reaction there.

I think there will be a few other choices we made that just need more time to come to fruition within the story. Episode 1 has been more about survival and reaching relative safety. I think later Eps will show more reactions to choices we made in 1.

/agree

[BlankCanvasDJ]

I think it's a little unfair to judge how effectively player choice has been implemented when we've only played 20% of the game. We're never going to really know how well it was done until we've gotten to the very end. Remember (since we seem to keep comparing TWD to Mass Effect) most people thought the Mass Effect games were doing a great job with player choice until the last ten minutes of the last game. Now it's become an example of how to do it wrong (or, more realistically, how it can't possibly be done to the degree that people were expecting with those games). Player choice lives and dies in the endgame.

Personally, I've been very impressed with the way Telltale seems to be implementing it so far. It's much more subtle and much trickier than I would have expected. It seems to me that a choice like the one at the end, between Doug and Carly, would be relatively easy to work out. It's like a video game choose-your-own-adventure book. You choose Doug and you move on to A Version of the game, you choose Carly and you move on to B Version of the game. That's fairly simple. But having a choice like the one with Duck and Shawn that doesn't effect the immediate outcome, but instead effects how a number of characters react and respond to you further along in the game - that seems much more complicated and much more impressive to me. That's like moving on to B Version of the game, with variables of C, D and 50% of E.

[ViCiOuS-V]

Question for you guys...

Did any of you completely betrayed Kenny?

i wondered if you did, he wouldn't have came out with the axe and save Lee.

Instead he would have took that icepick from the female walkers shoulder and kill her, then make a run for it.

It probably never even happened that way, just wondering though?

[XPO]

This is my first TellTale Game and my first post.

Just wanted to mention that though the choices appear limited up front, if you watch the preview for the next chapter (that plays after finishing chapter 1), some of the choices you make do come back to haunt you.

I played it once where I sided with Larry and agreed to kill Duck. -- In the preview Kenny said something to the effect of "remember when you thought Duck was bitten and you were going to kill him...." (definitely not the quote but basically reminded Lee of what happened)

the original time I played he didn't say it.

So the branching is limited at the trunk of the tree, and looks like it can expand quite a bit down the line. At least that's what it looks like =)

[illuminaughty]

Shawn was walker bait from the get go. He had to die for the canon to remain canon. He was already dead by the time of the original story. However appropriate it might seem to be able to save him somehow that is one instance where, as a prequel, there was only one way it could go down. I'm cool with that.

However, I do hope Telltale focuses on real choices with consequences and sincere differences rather than the illusion of choice. Glen's being annoyed no matter what you do might be a problem, but then again I've met a guy like that. In a tough situation like that one there is no right answer and some people, perhaps not unlike Glen, wouldn't be happy with ANY choice you made. Naive to be p hoping there was some happy ending for the lady, but there wasn't, and Glen couldn't see that until later (as witnessed when he suggests he understand why you chose to let her off herself if you took that option). At least that's how I see it and it fits within the way they have portrayed Glen, to me.

[Chillforce]

Originally Posted by ViCiOuS-V

Question for you guys...

Did any of you completely betrayed Kenny?

i wondered if you did, he wouldn't have came out with the axe and save Lee.

Instead he would have took that icepick from the female walkers shoulder and kill her, then make a run for it.

It probably never even happened that way, just wondering though?

Kenny always saves you, he just calls you an asshole if you reject him.

[cyclopst]

Okay it's only episode 1, but there's only 5 episodes, so surely the first one should do more than just set the scene. I wanted to see events happen differently or not at all based on choices. The only real choice we had was who to save - why couldn't we have chosen to try to save both? Or none? Or at the beginning, why couldn't we have chosen a different way to kill the first zombie, logically everyone would go for the shotgun, but couldn't we have chosen to save the bullet and used the shotgun as a melee weapon? Then the horde wouldn't appear.

I agree with you on this point. The choices need to be more adamant and versatile. A first person shooter would have gone through that zombie with a right click melee attack or a left click head shot. Although I'm guessing it's to early in the game to tell how detrimental the choices are that we make and what to expect in future episodes.

[WabbitTwaks]

Originally Posted by cyclopst

I agree with you on this point. The choices need to be more adamant and versatile. A first person shooter would have gone through that zombie with a right click melee attack or a left click head shot. Although I'm guessing it's to early in the game to tell how detrimental the choices are that we make and what to expect in future episodes.

Well, since in the Which decisions are important? thread, I found this from Jake at TTG.....

Originally Posted by Jake

While those five big choices get called out for you, the game remembers literally everything you say to everyone, and writers of future episodes can call back to any dialog choice or series of events you've made when crafting how their episode plays out.

I don't see how the choices could get any more adamant or versatile.

[Vainamoinen]

Originally Posted by WabbitTwaks

I don't see how the choices could get any more adamant or versatile.

This does also mean that every choice might matter - not necessarily only the ones that trigger a story notification. Hmmmm....

[WabbitTwaks]

Originally Posted by Vainamoinen

This does also mean that every choice might matter - not necessarily only the ones that trigger a story notification. Hmmmm....

Yeah. Scary, isn't it?

[toothiersnow]

Itll be interesting to see if the character we chose to save in Ep1 constantly gets into peril, and whether we will have the opportunity to drag them all the way through it or trade them out for someone 'better' in later episodes.

[Vainamoinen]

Originally Posted by WabbitTwaks

Yeah. Scary, isn't it?

Pretty much. Immersion into the game is definitely enhanced if you turn story notifications off, because you can never be sure what itty bitty thingie counts somehow. But I assume not many people did turn them off, because they WANT that control, that look into the mechanics, that behind-the-curtain look at their real options, the whole game with its pants down.

Suddenly finding out that they weren't granted that... could scare the hell out of some players.

[WabbitTwaks]

My first play, I turned notifications off. I wanted that as-complete-as-possible immersion. I was extremely satisfied with the result. It was only for some of my subsequent plays that I turned the notifications on to get a glimpse into what my choice ramifications might be.

My first thoughts after discovering all choices are saved was, "Uh oh. What did I do in my first play through? I could be screwed." I had put myself in Lee's shoes completely, as I am sure was TTG's intention. I made real life, spur-of-the-moment choices. Some good; some not so good. How things play out will be... interesting.

I love what they have done here. To create such an immersing, interactive story is quite an accomplishment. I cannot wait for the next installment.

[Franzs]

So the game starts out claiming that the story is tailored by (that is a quote) my choices. I thoroughly enjoyed my first playthrough. Then I started a second because I was curious to see how things could have played out differently.

The first thing I found out is that your responses literally do not change conversations at all. In the cop car in the beginning I chose wildly different options and what happend was, without exception:

*short reaction line*
blabla bla what I was going to say anyway

This trend was continued by all later conversations without fail.

Alright then, I thought, there are choices to be made, definitive ones, so let's see how those play out. I had gone during the day the first time and went to Hershel's farm. The second time I went at night and lo and behold, I went to Hershel's farm. The only difference was that Hershel agreed to have the fence reinforced instantly, which, no matter what I'd have said, he would have anyway in the first scenario, I'm certain.

Right. So but here comes the first -real- choice right? First time I saved Shawn obviously, or tried to, cause he died, and no matter what I said I got kicked off the farm. Second time I saved Ducky and no matter what I said I got kicked off the farm also. Whopsie.

Not having learnt my lesson at that point, I figured you know what I'll just show the guy at the drug store, the asshole, what's what, I'll beat that guy down. Lo and behold, everything plays out exactly as it would have otherwise. I have to get heart medicine for the complete asshole. Why exactly do I have to do that? I just do. Ok then. Someone obviously tried it. Let me guess. If you agree that Ducky must be thrown out, it doesn't happen right? Color me surprised.

And that is putting aside, for a moment, the insanity of that whole situation. We have a guy about to die right here, and another one who is about to die, maybe, who knows, somewhere else. The first guy needs medicine that is literally 10 feet away. In my first playthrough I wanted to help him, I figured he was just being emotional and making tough choices, no qualms, and I wasted over an hour triple checking everything until I gave up and went to get Quinn, only to learn that this nonsensical action is what you have to do to even get at the medicine. I challenge anyone to hack through a padlock with a fire axe in a way that somehow makes less noise than a tv on static. What a joke.

It's 1 month between episodes, so if your reaction is, calm down guy, your choices will have consequences in later episodes - think for a minute. Is Chet being alive or dead really a consequence? He's barely a NPC. And ask yourself: why would we assume that the second episode has greater complexity than the first?

Don't get me wrong, I thoroughly enjoyed my first playthrough, and I will play the others too (albeit mostly because I have no choice having already paid for them), but what seemed as an involving story where I choose my destiny has turned out to be nothign but a string of BUT THOUGH MUST's.

And that would be fine. IF the game did not claim otherwise, explicitly, right off the bat. A hollow promise.

I don't understand are people are just fine and dandy with this but get insanely irate over the mass effect 3 ending.

EDIT: Moved it to where it would not be seen huh? Very classy guys.

[Thasic]

I think conned may be to harsh a term, after all, Telltale does clearly state this is story driven, but, the lack of choices is a bit of a let down. I loved the story and the characters but it is more like a comic book than a game. Still, it was very entertaining to play and I do look forward to the next release.....

[flash-900]

Having read the above post I decided to play through again, as not much else do do we dont even know when the next one will even be. And spot on so disappointed nothing different at all did not seem to matter what you say or do same places same people same outcome, burst my bubble on any play through value if just end up in the same place anyway

[toothiersnow]

I dont think it was moved to were it wouldnt be seen, infact its been moved onto a more relative and fairly active thread, though i will be seeing if your thoughts are the same a few episodes down the line :-)

[Vainamoinen]

Originally Posted by Franzs

EDIT: Moved it to where it would not be seen huh? Very classy guys.

Moved to where it would be seen, where the topic was already discussed and where you might even find some answers, a more broad perspective and/or like minded people. No interest in that? Very classy guy.

[The_Ripper]

We made our choices at first episode, we'll have to wait for the 2nd to see how much tailored is this story by us and consequences from our choices.

We have only watched 1/5 from the whole game. Saying good or bad things for this feature it's pretty premature yet.

All we can say now it's that it looks good.

[Ja1862]

Originally Posted by Franzs

So the game starts out claiming that the story is tailored by (that is a quote) my choices. I thoroughly enjoyed my first playthrough. Then I started a second because I was curious to see how things could have played out differently.

The first thing I found out is that your responses literally do not change conversations at all. In the cop car in the beginning I chose wildly different options and what happend was, without exception:

*short reaction line*
blabla bla what I was going to say anyway

This trend was continued by all later conversations without fail.

Alright then, I thought, there are choices to be made, definitive ones, so let's see how those play out. I had gone during the day the first time and went to Hershel's farm. The second time I went at night and lo and behold, I went to Hershel's farm. The only difference was that Hershel agreed to have the fence reinforced instantly, which, no matter what I'd have said, he would have anyway in the first scenario, I'm certain.

Right. So but here comes the first -real- choice right? First time I saved Shawn obviously, or tried to, cause he died, and no matter what I said I got kicked off the farm. Second time I saved Ducky and no matter what I said I got kicked off the farm also. Whopsie.

Not having learnt my lesson at that point, I figured you know what I'll just show the guy at the drug store, the asshole, what's what, I'll beat that guy down. Lo and behold, everything plays out exactly as it would have otherwise. I have to get heart medicine for the complete asshole. Why exactly do I have to do that? I just do. Ok then. Someone obviously tried it. Let me guess. If you agree that Ducky must be thrown out, it doesn't happen right? Color me surprised.

And that is putting aside, for a moment, the insanity of that whole situation. We have a guy about to die right here, and another one who is about to die, maybe, who knows, somewhere else. The first guy needs medicine that is literally 10 feet away. In my first playthrough I wanted to help him, I figured he was just being emotional and making tough choices, no qualms, and I wasted over an hour triple checking everything until I gave up and went to get Quinn, only to learn that this nonsensical action is what you have to do to even get at the medicine. I challenge anyone to hack through a padlock with a fire axe in a way that somehow makes less noise than a tv on static. What a joke.

It's 1 month between episodes, so if your reaction is, calm down guy, your choices will have consequences in later episodes - think for a minute. Is Chet being alive or dead really a consequence? He's barely a NPC. And ask yourself: why would we assume that the second episode has greater complexity than the first?

Don't get me wrong, I thoroughly enjoyed my first playthrough, and I will play the others too (albeit mostly because I have no choice having already paid for them), but what seemed as an involving story where I choose my destiny has turned out to be nothign but a string of BUT THOUGH MUST's.

And that would be fine. IF the game did not claim otherwise, explicitly, right off the bat. A hollow promise.

I don't understand are people are just fine and dandy with this but get insanely irate over the mass effect 3 ending.

EDIT: Moved it to where it would not be seen huh? Very classy guys.

)





I actually agree with all of this, the game is great but so disappointing how the choices ended up within episode one.