IWWHIIWWHITOMIROTPG: The Game!

[monkey_05_06]

I really don't want to say anything that would incite too much hope..but I want more too.

[Hayden]

Originally Posted by monkey_05_06

I really don't want to say anything that would incite too much hope..but I want more too.

Well, that's much more positive than hearing you say you DON'T want more. So, I'm afraid you have incited some hope . Even if the games are bite-size like the last one was, it'll still be awesome. I understand that they'd still be a LOT of work, though.

[monkey_05_06]

Originally Posted by Hayden

Even if the games are bite-size like the last one was, it'll still be awesome. I understand that they'd still be a LOT of work, though.

You seem to be suggesting more games along the same fan-gamery nature as this one was. The only real concern I have with that idea is actually one that came up whilst developing this one: legality. When using copyrighted names/character personas such as Guybrush Threepwood, Elaine Marley, LeChuck, Morgan LeFlay, and Reginald van Winslow, copyrighted locations/titles such as Monkey Island™, Tales of Monkey Island, intellectual property of third parties such as "I Wonder What Happens In Tales of Monkey Island", etc. the legal concept of "fair use" becomes very legally hazy, which is never good when you're on the defending side of the argument.

However, barring that, I see no reason why..erm..I've said too much.

Also, thanks muchly to all for the feedback. It's great that people are still dropping by to comment on this. I'm glad to see people's love of "the stupidest thing ever" as Ben304 (the artist) once put it.

[The Highway]

I see no reason why it should be questionable if it is for free and for a fan project supporting the game

[Hayden]

Originally Posted by The Highway

I see no reason why it should be questionable if it is for free and for a fan project supporting the game

You obviously haven't done your research on recent MI fan games. I see no problem with it either, but it hasn't stopped LucasArts from ceasing and desisting close to a dozen significant fan projects.

[The Highway]

Originally Posted by Hayden

You obviously haven't done your research on recent MI fan games. I see no problem with it either, but it hasn't stopped LucasArts from ceasing and desisting close to a dozen significant fan projects.

yeah, but lucasarts can go die in a hole.

[Hayden]

Originally Posted by The Highway

yeah, but lucasarts can go die in a hole.

Heh, that's just the sort of reply I'd expect from you. And I don't necessarily mean that in the bad way .

Anyway, you do share the same opinion as many. I hate the fact that LucasArts decided to stop so many fan projects in their tracks. And they've all been non-profit games as well; games made by fans for fans purely for enjoyment on both ends. It's not as though the games would have affected the company even in the slightest. It wouldn't affect sales, which means that there'd be no financial problems for LucasArts, and because the games are unofficial, they're not even affecting the canon or timeline in any way either. I dunno, LucasArts are the masters of proverbial wankery these days, so what should we expect?

[The Highway]

Originally Posted by Hayden

Heh, that's just the sort of reply I'd expect from you. And I don't necessarily mean that in the bad way .

Yep, I'm pretty anti-Lucasarts.
And speak my mind.

[apenpaap]

Originally Posted by Hayden

Heh, that's just the sort of reply I'd expect from you. And I don't necessarily mean that in the bad way .

Anyway, you do share the same opinion as many. I hate the fact that LucasArts decided to stop so many fan projects in their tracks. And they've all been non-profit games as well; games made by fans for fans purely for enjoyment on both ends. It's not as though the games would have affected the company even in the slightest. It wouldn't affect sales, which means that there'd be no financial problems for LucasArts, and because the games are unofficial, they're not even affecting the canon or timeline in any way either. I dunno, LucasArts are the masters of proverbial wankery these days, so what should we expect?

You know, I've noticed TellTale is a lot milder with copyright and stuff then LucasArts, so I wonder if a fangame starring Winslow or Morgan or DeSinge would have a better chance of not being taken down.

[Hayden]

Originally Posted by apenpaap

You know, I've noticed TellTale is a lot milder with copyright and stuff then LucasArts, so I wonder if a fangame starring Winslow or Morgan or DeSinge would have a better chance of not being taken down.

That's sort of what I've been thinking. I mean, they allowed the first IWWHIIWWHITOMI, so perhaps a few more may be allowed (as well as similar fan projects). It's still a risky thing, though. Especially seeing as how LucasArts still owns the license.

Also: What's the maximum penalty infringing upon copyright laws if the fan game is non-profit. Is the 'cease & desist' order the worst that could happen? (There's probably no straight answer to this question, as there are too many factors involved, but I'll just ask anyway).

Extra note: Oh, I also just realized that you only mentioned characters exclusively from Tales, meaning that they aren't owned by LucasArts. Or are they? Oh no, not this conversation/argument/debate again.

[tbm1986]

Originally Posted by Hayden

That's sort of what I've been thinking. I mean, they allowed the first IWWHIIWWHITOMI, so perhaps a few more may be allowed (as well as similar fan projects). It's still a risky thing, though. Especially seeing as how LucasArts still owns the license.

Also: What's the maximum penalty infringing upon copyright laws if the fan game is non-profit. Is the 'cease & desist' order the worst that could happen? (There's probably no straight answer to this question, as there are too many factors involved, but I'll just ask anyway).

Extra note: Oh, I also just realized that you only mentioned characters exclusively from Tales, meaning that they aren't owned by LucasArts. Or are they? Oh no, not this conversation/argument/debate again.

I think this is true, but the cease & desist manoeuvre can still be used if you use any character, location or item created by LucasArts.

[monkey_05_06]

The worst that LA could do to a nonprofit fan game project would be ultimately to file legal suite for copyright infringement. Digital copyright laws in the US include nonprofit infringement.

However, if the files were not publicly distributed (i.e., during development) then a C&D would likely be the most they could get away with. Of course, they can afford a much fancier lawyer (Stan!! ) than I can, so if they really ever wanted to press the issue, they probably would. Not necessarily that they would have a legitimate case, but they could tie it up in so much legal red tape that it would financially ruin me for life.

That is being a bit overly dramatic. If such a project were ever started and LA were to C&D it, development would be stopped instantaneously. I'm not one to try my luck on that front. I may consider trying to negotiate afterward, but development would be stopped until further notice.

As for TTG being more lenient, yes, they allowed this game, but don't forget that they C&D'd the ToMI 2D project. Even TTG has their limits on what they consider acceptable. One-time usage of their characters, referencing their storyline is apparently okay (in this particular instance); continuous usage of their copyrighted materials may not prove to be so.

Just some thoughts. Copyright is a very fickle thing at times, largely depending on arbitrary decisions whether it is acceptable or not. Lots of gray area.

[monkey_05_06]

I wouldn't want to give anyone the wrong idea, and I refuse to provide any further details than this, but I sent an email which by now is hopefully being reviewed by TTG's legal department. They haven't yet responded, which I want to believe just means they're developing an awesome legally binding response which will take centuries to draft, millenia to proof, and eons thereafter to print..I mean..wait, what?

If anyone asks directly about this post, there's a good chance I might blatantly deny everything contained therein, and indeed the post itself. Especially the last two statements (inclusively).

[Hayden]

I just had a thought. What if you were to create the fan game that you intend to make, but just change the names of all of the copyrighted characters and locations? That's what the team making 'Monkey Island: The Lost Years' resorted to in order to avoid infringement (the project now being called 'Picaroon: The Lost Years'). So what if you were to do the same? The names may not even need to be changed that much: 'Guybrusch Threepwhood', 'Skabb Island'... or perhaps that may still be getting a little too close for comfort. The names may need to be changed more to avoid infringement of any kind.

Or do you think that, if names were to be changed, that it would detract from the final product and make the games seem too distant from the MI series almost to the point that they wouldn't feel like fan games anymore? Or could you see it working?

Hmm... either way, though, it's still a risk.

Damn it, it would just be nice if all of this legal bullcrap didn't have to interfere and get in the way of innocent, harmless projects (I'm referring to all of the fan projects that have been ceased & desisted in the past, not just this potential project - which doesn't actually exist in any physical form as of yet). It's quite frustrating, really.