Tales of Monkey Island v. Original 4 [Inevitable Spoilers]

[-=[The_Razgriz_Ace]=-]

Originally Posted by Dinghy Dog

that you never go to monkey island or have anything to do with it, whats up with that?

Yeah I was thinking this throughout the whole series...I would have liked to have seen one or more of the more recognisable locations from the series...Certainly Monkey Island would have been a nice addition considering the title of the game... :P

As far as rating them goes, I think I should probably go back and replay the games as it really has been awhile...but I'd say right now it'd be this order...

1. LCR and CMI tie for first...LCR was just awesome and actually freaked me out as a kid (lol), plus I just found it funny as that by then Guybrush was a pirate, but he was still getting mocked for being a rubbish one...I hold a soft spot in my heart for CMI though, the art style and visuals made that game spectacular...plus, one of the funniest moments in my video game lifetime was when Guybrush dropped the tofu into his pants...good lord that was funny...Oh and this was the first time we heard Domonic Armato as guybrush in the series...

2. TOMI...Although rather easy by comparison, the episodic format works brilliantly for this series...plus some of the models were fantastic...Guybrush looked awesome, Elaine and Morgan were hot (>.>) and Lechuck looked killer as well...overall it was a great addition to the series...

3. SMI...Not far behind TOMI, this opened the series and therefore was awesome...I put it down to 3 though because I never really liked how Guybrush looked in the first game...much preferred his MI2 look...and to think, he looks EVEN WORSE in the special edition!

4 (By a long way). EMI...I never finished this game, and have no inclination to after watching my sister play through it...controls are bad, graphics are bad, puzzles were mostly boring (and in some cases annoying) and after the greatness of CMI and LCR, it just makes me want to throw the disc at the wall...

[Secret Fawful]

Well I'm going to reply to this but I'm not even going to try to rate one against the other.

SMI/LCR - It's ridiculous to compare these games to Tales now for me, and I'll say it now, Tales is NOTHING like them. I started out thinking it was a lot like LeChuck's Revenge but ended up thinking they are nothing alike at all. Tales is its own game and comes close to being its own MI universe almost, and SMI/LCR are very much their own game. They're still my favorites but how can that change.

Tales - Tales is a wonderful game. It isn't flawless but its got EVERY SINGLE element MI has always had, maybe minus a sense of scale, and has thrown them together into one big pot. I think each chapter is more like one MI game than another is. ROTPG is pretty much its own beast I'd say, with Trial being more like SMI, Lair more like Curse, Seige more like LCR and Launch more like EMI. But all in all its just a massive beast of its own filled with magic, demons, mysticism, mythical creatures, treasure, romance, tragedy, ghosts- and on and on and on. It's a great game and I'd love to see more.

Curse - This game is also to me, it's own game. I think of it as an alternate ending to LCR, with the possibility of a completely different ending we never saw and probably never will. The art style is beautiful and the game is just a ton of fun. It oozes charm in every pore and is just one reason why I love Bill Tiller's artwork.

EMI - This game, from what I HAVE played, is its own game like the other four. It's an underdog with fantastic humor but sloppy controls, beautiful backgrounds but dated characters. However I think some of the characters in this had more charm than Nipperkin for instance, but Galeb or Anemone had more charm than any EMI design. EMI is a diffeent type of humor and storytelling than the other MI games though, so it's seperate. Not many people like it but it does have its fans.

And that's my opinion.

[thin029]

My order:
1. Escape from Monkey Island
2. Secret of Monkey Island Special
3. Tales of Monkey Island
4. Curse of Monkey Island
With Curse being the worst. But I LOVE IT, don't get me wrong.
I never played LeChuck's Revenge, HOPE LUCASARTS WILL MAKE A SPECIAL EDITION FOR ME. Please?

[doggans]

I find it difficult to rank the games, because each one is a unique experience. Even SMI and MI2, which have the same graphics/gameplay/etc, have entirely different feels to me, and whichever my is favorite at the moment depends entirely on the mood I'm in.

Granted, like popular opinion, EMI is VERY RARELY what I'm in the mood for, but even it grew on me during my recent playthrough. The controls/camera angles are still infuriating, though.

[pluizig]

1. Lechuck's Revenge
2. The Curse of Monkey Island
3. The Secret of Monkey Island
4. Lair of the Leviathan
5. The Trial and Execution of Guybrush Threepwood
6. The Siege of Spinner Cay
7. Escape from Monkey Island
8. Launch of the Screaming Narwhal
10. Rise of the Pirate God

[S@bre]

My thoughts on TMI's greatest weakest in comparison to its predecessors is the music. It just doesn't grab you and build atmosphere in the same way as the others do - the worst parts was the music (and lack thereof) for the beginning and end of chapter 4. Even SMI, with its minimal tracks, still used them very effectively. All the other four games managed to stick at least one memorable melody in my head, but TMI just didn't.

[Secret Fawful]

Originally Posted by S@bre

My thoughts on TMI's greatest weakest in comparison to its predecessors is the music. It just doesn't grab you and build atmosphere in the same way as the others do - the worst parts was the music (and lack thereof) for the beginning and end of chapter 4. Even SMI, with its minimal tracks, still used them very effectively. All the other four games managed to stick at least one memorable melody in my head, but TMI just didn't.

I sort of agree with this. I liked the music but for me the only really memorable pieces were Winslow's theme, De Singe's theme (my favorite), and the Crossroads theme.

[eMKayeN]

1. LeChuck's Revenge
2. Curse
3. Secret
4. Tales
5. Escape

[eMKayeN]

The thing that let Tales down was the episodic nature which limits the locations and thus leaves less places and items to use on things meaning that the puzzles aren't overly challenging. I think I might have been stumped once throughout the whole of the 5 chapters. Generally the puzzles were pretty easy.

Think about Monkey Island 2 when you're tryin g to find the 4 parts of the map. You have 3 whole islands to explore with plenty of places within each island to explore too. That chapter is HUGE. Tales episodic nature couldn't allow for something like that.

[Fausk]

Originally Posted by S@bre

My thoughts on TMI's greatest weakest in comparison to its predecessors is the music. It just doesn't grab you and build atmosphere in the same way as the others do - the worst parts was the music (and lack thereof) for the beginning and end of chapter 4. Even SMI, with its minimal tracks, still used them very effectively. All the other four games managed to stick at least one memorable melody in my head, but TMI just didn't.

I thought the music was great in Rise of the Pirate God, oddly. Some of the ethereal quality of the ambient music that just barely seems like it is there. It reminded me a lot of Michael Land's work on The Dig, oddly. Sure it's not something that you'll be humming all the time, but it fits the mood and atmosphere well.

The rest of the series' music was rather forgettable though, I actually didn't remember it was Michael Land doing it til Rise of the Pirate God. Aside from the opening theme of course.

[eMKayeN]

I also agree about the music not being overly memorable. Nothing really jumped out at me like in the other 4 games. Only things like reused themes e.g. LeChuck's theme.

[adventureaddict]

1.CMI
2.SMI
3.TMI
4.LCR
5.EMI

Sorry guys, not that much of a fan of LCR Well, not as much as everybody else here, it seems. Still love it to death, don't worry!

[coolsome]

Tales is my fav monkey island ever!!! It has more emotional development then the others

TMI
CMI
LR
EMI
SMI

[Aise]

Right now I would say
TMI - CMI
SMI
LR
EMI

[Mataku]

I refrained from giving an opinion about TOMI games up until now because I think that the whole picture is important. for example, I love LCR, but if i had to judge just the first chapter of that game as a game of it's own i won't give it such a high score, but as a whole that game was the best. As for TOMI, as a whole, i found it a bit disappointing. Keep in mind that this is all fresh in our heads still. EMI also got praised and hailed when it just came out, only in retrospect people viewed it as bad, and I personally believe that TOMI will suffer the same fate 10 years from now. Personal opinion. I did enjoy the waiting and the theories and conversations in these forums, tho, and it made the game feel more immersive to me. That is all.

my list is
MI2
CMI
MI1
TOMI\ EMI

[thatdude98]

Originally Posted by PariahKing

I think if some of the more...notorious...LCR puzzles were instead placed first in TMI...I would complain about how stupidly hard they were. I like a challenge, but plain illogical sucks. The whole bit with the library was cruel.

I 100% agree.

[Wiggi]

I only have one thing to say...

More please.


*edit*

Plus my countdown ^^

1. LeChuck's Revenge
2. Curse of Monkey Island
3. Tales of Monkey Island
4. Secret of Monkey Island
5. Escape from Monkey Island

I really did enjoy most of TOMI more than SMI and I had it on the Amiga but I wish they avoided the map/forest parts.

[Katsuro]

It's really hard to rate them, but what I shall do is writing down my thoughts about the games themselves so people can see what I liked in the game and what I didn't like in the game.

Secret of Monkey Island:
It was the very first Monkey Island I played so especially with this one I have huge nostalgic glasses on. Seeing that as a little child I couldn't spent money for 2 or 3 games monthly (also there weren't that many good games) I played it VERY often. Because of that, I always had favorite parts and parts I would have loved to skip. The part I loved was of course the insult fighting and the stealing of the idol. Which made those 2 trials (stealing and beating the swordmaster) my favorites. The treasure hunting itself... well it was kind of a let down.
What I didn't like where riddles like "Remember the combination of the safe", "Use 5 billion grog mugs to get the grog to the prison" and "Talk 5 hours to stan until he dropped the price enough for you to buy the ship".
They always felt boring and needless for me.
I don't remember if, as a kid, it was clear to me that there was some kind of romance between Elaine and Guybrush, something many people find a turn off in later installments of the game. I think I was used to the idea that if a woman is kidnapped/threatened by something evil, the hero who rescues her is somehow in love with here, therefor they are having a romance...or something like that. So in short, I wasn't bothered by that at all.
The story wasn't that complicted either. There was only one twist in it, and it wasn't even a big one. Shinetop is Lechuck. There wasn't really much of an explanation why things are the way they are... They were simply a fact and you had to either accept it, or leave. Back then, that was totally fine. Nowadays I think a game would be kicked in the bin if it does a stunt like that.
The final showdown was a tiny bit... not lame, but it didn't feel like a showdown. I, as a player never felt that Lechuck was a big threat, maybe because the game itself was kind of comic-ish and didn't take itself serious to begin with (rubber tree safes Guybrush, Pot as helmet, survives falling down several hundret meters without any injury whatsoever).
Also, it was a nice change from all the Sierra/Lucasarts games I played before, that no matter what I tried, I couldn't die.

Lechucks Revenge:
There only were a few games I played until now, which managed to get me immersed so much, that I actually FEEL with the characters and that my heartbeat is getting excited and faster when something important or dangerous is happening. One is Fate of Atlantis (especially the ending in the chamber), another one is of course Lechucks Revenge.
I don't know wether it was the "new" art style I liked more or the feeling, that something more then just "Go there, safe that" is going on.
I always saw Monkey Island 1 and 2 a bit like Star Wars. For example, I don't believe Ron Gilbert that Monkey Island was planned as a Trilogy from the very beginning. I do believe however that he had ideas in his head how things COULD develop. Something that proofs my theory is that Secret of Monkey Island has no cliffhanger whatsoever. Lechuck dies, and you see the happy end. Just like in Star Wars and Back to the Future the Story could have been finished right there.
So Lechuck Revenge was actually the first Monkey Island game which used a darker theme. With a huge success in my eyes. I can't remember one place or one riddle I didn't like, or one situation I wanted to skip. Also, as much as I missed the insult fighting, I never missed it in that game for some reason. I was very happy without it. The thought "That game is good, but insult fighting would make it SO much better!" never came to my mind. I also liked that fact that there were 2 difficulties (and until now I seriously NEVER played through the easy one...) which I found interesting.
Lechucks Revenge also started to not make sense (in a good way though). It brought up questions without actually asking them, and I don't mean the obvious ones like "What is big whoop?".
I mean questions like:
- Are those pipe systems you sometimes see a joke of the designer team? Or was it already a hint to THE secret?
- Why does the elevator go to Melee Island? A Joke as well?
- Is Toothrots appearance only a coincidence?
You already see that all those questions could easily be answered with:
"Well its obviously the designers team idea of a good joke!". But we can't be 100% sure of that.
The final showdown between Guybrush and Lechuck is awesome. Basicly its a run and hide game again, but this time you have to find multiple things in order to defeat him (instead of just simply getting the root beer). Even though I KNEW I couldn't die in this game I really was IN the game. I could feel a sense of urgency and panic when Lechuck arrived only to use his voodoo doll again.

Curse of Monkey Island:
I. Love. The. Art style.
The only thing that would have made it better, is that they would have taken the Lechucks Revenge Version of Guybrush. I really missed his awesome coat and boots from back then.
But sadly that almost is everything that stuck in my mind. Apart from the art, I don't clearly remember anymore if I found some puzzles good or bad or if it was easy or not.
I do remember that I thought it was kind of a mixture between SoMI and LR. Also they brought back a insult fighting in a way I didn't like at all. Rhymes.
For me, the whole fun of the insult fighting were the witty comebacks! In Curse of Monkey Island though they sounded so forced and awkward. And because of that, the most important thing when trying to be funny was neglected.
Timing.
The showdown was not as strong as in Lechucks Revenge. It was again a hide and run thing, to find your weapons/traps of choice, but seeing Guybrush not having to deal with a great amount of effort or pain (unlike in Lechucks Revenge where he basically screams every time the Voodoo doll is used) makes it seem like there is no real threat.
This is also the game where both got married, which didn't bother me as well to be honest. It certainly didn't FEEL like a final game of a trilogy should feel, but if that was the ending they had in mind, it was still well performed.

Escape from Monkey Island:
I never got around in playing it sadly and now that I heard so many negative stuff about it I probably never will. However, I started to watch a walkthrough video from the game and here are the things I noticed:
I actually liked how they pulled off the 3D characters. It's outdated now, yes, but I can see how it worked when it was released, considering that it wasn't an FPS (which has to shine with physics engines and graphics).
What I didn't like about it though was the way the Chapter Cards looked.
Secret of Monkey Island had simple ones. I remember it was basically only the fonts, with a line separating Chapter from title.
Lechucks Revenge had awesome paper-like Chapter cards with beautiful artwork.
Course of Monkey Island had this as well.
Escape from Monkey Island had only simply font again with some 3D character being in the corner... which I really found boring.
Other than that, I'd love to give this game a chance, but I think I read to many bad stuff about it to be fair to that game.

Tales of Monkey Island:
Mind you, I'm still hyped about the whole thing.
I have to admit that Launch of the Screaming Narwhal was kind of... not dissapointing, but certainly not what I had in mind when I heard that Monkey Island will get ressurected.
LUCKILY each episode ended with a cliffhanger, keeping me interested in what happened next. And yeah, in my opinion the series got better and better which each game. Graphical as well as puzzles and overall presentation.
I don't know if I would have preferred a whole game, and therefor sacrificing the awesome discussions I had with people on how it might continue. To be honest I'm very glad that it was the way it was. For me it was a intense journey which got better and better each episode.
Also, and at least from my point of view, Tale of Monkey Island had the best showdown in all Monkey Island games I every played. I'm not talking about the puzzles (which I think were pretty awesome), I'm talking about the dramatic situation, the atmosphere...
Exhausted and injured Guybrush being the punching bag once again for Lechuck, you can almost FEEL that he is about to give up and simply pass out. But then, maybe one step before everythings lost, he finds a solution and BAM! he won.
There is something about the suffering but victorious hero I like. I admit it. I liked seeing Guybrush in this great amount of pain and agony, I liked seeing him giving up the only thing that kept him "alive". It made me care emotional for Guybrush. It made me look at him for a fragment of time not as a character from a game, but a role model, a hero.
Even Lechuck was in best form for episode 5! The last time I saw him so intense was in Lechucks Revenge. It made me think "Ok... this time Guybrush won't stop him. No way."
The other Characters made a HUGE step forward in development. While some of the original characters couldn't even be considered sidekicks in the old games, in Tales they had their time to shine. And shine they did!
But also the new characters brought into the story I felt connected to. Morgan was a great addition to the mix and with Guybrush's sidekick Winslow the whole game felt really soft and smooth. The thought "Hm... okay this one doesn't fit right now" never crossed my mind once.
I said it in other threads, but I'm not getting tired of saying it again.

After finishing Episode 5 (and sleeping, because we almost pulled of an alnighter) I felt contented and pleased, like I haven't felt in a long time after finishing a game.


Is Tales perfect and flawless? No, but neither were the other Monkey Island games. And while I not hope that this is the last time we see Guybrush, I would be (as many others here) happy if I'd remember him within Tales of Monkey Island.

[BinoX]

My order of preference is:

1. Secret, It was the first game I played on the first computer that was my own and it captured my imagination as a kid, so it holds a special place
2. Revenge, a very good game with an intricate storyline, very much like Secret, but extended with a more immersive "world"
3. Tales, This was a very good series, sticking to classic monkey island roots with a combination of simple puzzles and a few real tough ones and witty dialogue to go along with it. At the same time a few new types of puzzles thrown in for good measure
4. Curse, I never really got into curse. The artwork was quite nice but it took the "zanyness" of the characters to an extreme at times which spoiled it a little bit for me.
5. Escape, Never could get into that game to be honest. Played it from beginning to end, but it didn't really do anything to enhance the Monkey Island experience for me.

Overall I think that Secret and Revenge are realistically joint first. Tales is very close though and I'll probably play all the episodes back-to-back this weekend.

[Farlander]

For me, ToMI is the best in the series, hands down. I think it took the best from SMI/MI2 duo and CMI/EMI duo, added some things of it's own, and in the end a hell of a cocktail. ToMI has all these great character developments (which I just love, and which, frankly, SMI/MI2 almost miss and CMI/EMI just miss), story twists and story progression (really, all other four games were kinda pretty much calm with a fast big bam boom in the end which led to some excuses for an ending... which reminds me...) and FOR ONCE AN ENDING THAT DOESN'T DISSAPOINT. Yeah, it doesn't, really. As a whole.

Anyway, there ARE things I don't really like in ToMI. There are. But I still think it's the best MI game at the moment.