Did Curse destroy Monkey Island?

[Ghost82]

Originally Posted by MonkeyMania

CMI is my baby. Always preferred style of Monkey Island.

I agree with this. Also, CMI and LCR are both my favorites. I can understand people who can say thet Curse was a little... disconnected of the saga due to the end of LCR, but dude... the main 'problem' is just that, the rare LCR ending done by Mr. Gilbert. I mean, I never knew what the hell is going on, too much 'open' ending, too abstract and, too many options of interpretations... no coherence (or not explicit coherence).

The main problem of CMI and his relation with previous games was the 'yet not explained LCR ending' connected to the fact that Ron wasn't on the CMI team to explain it to connect it with the new adventure and argument.

Also, I must said that the solution the CMI team provided it's pretty succesfull on the goal of connect both arguments, having in mind the big trouble that should be to have an ending like the LCR was as first stone to build another chapter of the saga.

I don't know if I'. explaining myself correctly.

[guitarsareboring]

I recently put Curse on my PSP (not to be confused with putting A curse on my PSP)... tried it out for a bit and I hadn't noticed before how much of a cartoon villain LeChuck had become. It sort of reminded me of Robotnik in The Adventures of Sonic the Hedgehog.

[Chyron8472]

Originally Posted by Ghost82

I agree with this. Also, CMI and LCR are both my favorites. I can understand people who can say thet Curse was a little... disconnected of the saga due to the end of LCR, but dude... the main 'problem' is just that, the rare LCR ending done by Mr. Gilbert. I mean, I never knew what the hell is going on, too much 'open' ending, too abstract and, too many options of interpretations... no coherence (or not explicit coherence).

The main problem of CMI and his relation with previous games was the 'yet not explained LCR ending' connected to the fact that Ron wasn't on the CMI team to explain it to connect it with the new adventure and argument.

Also, I must said that the solution the CMI team provided it's pretty succesfull on the goal of connect both arguments, having in mind the big trouble that should be to have an ending like the LCR was as first stone to build another chapter of the saga.

I don't know if I'. explaining myself correctly.

Makes sense to me.

I was happy that CMI explained what happened at the end of LCR. Very happy. LCR's ending was terrible and I'm glad they addressed it.

[MonkeyMania]

Idea for Monkey Island 2.5

Goals:
1. Realize that a spell has been cast on you by LeChuck.
2. Break the spell
3. Shave your beard because you look too old to go on any of the rides.
4. Ride the bumper cars
5. Get pounded hard enough to bust through the wall, by taunting other riders
6. Escape the carnival

[Avistew]

Originally Posted by MonkeyMania

Idea for Monkey Island 2.5

Goals:
1. Realize that a spell has been cast on you by LeChuck.
2. Break the spell
3. Shave your beard because you look too old to go on any of the rides.
4. Ride the bumper cars
5. Get pounded hard enough to bust through the wall, by taunting other riders
6. Escape the carnival

Ok, now you make it

[Barnabus]

I basically see the Curse phenomenon as the gaming equivalent of commissioning Mulholland Drive's set designers to make a sequel to that movie that explains away all the ambiguities of the previous film and opens up a string of audience-friendly sequels, and then having the world treat it as the better film for not having a weird ending. The latter three Monkey Islands can be fun but as an artistic achievement the series would've been far better off left with just the two.

[SHODANFreeman]

Originally Posted by Barnabus

I basically see the Curse phenomenon as the gaming equivalent of commissioning Mulholland Drive's set designers to make a sequel to that movie that explains away all the ambiguities of the previous film and opens up a string of audience-friendly sequels, and then having the world treat it as the better film for not having a weird ending. The latter three Monkey Islands can be fun but as an artistic achievement the series would've been far better off left with just the two.

Comparing Mulholland Drive to Monkey Island 2 is the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. I don't remember Mulholland Drive being a comedy.

[VoodooDerina]

Originally Posted by Barnabus

I basically see the Curse phenomenon as the gaming equivalent of commissioning Mulholland Drive's set designers to make a sequel to that movie that explains away all the ambiguities of the previous film and opens up a string of audience-friendly sequels, and then having the world treat it as the better film for not having a weird ending. The latter three Monkey Islands can be fun but as an artistic achievement the series would've been far better off left with just the two.

Latter sequels seem to target much wider audience progressively, so they made more and more compromises.

[Barnabus]

Originally Posted by Pale Man

Comparing Mulholland Drive to Monkey Island 2 is the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. I don't remember Mulholland Drive being a comedy.

I'm comparing the situations, not so much the things themselves. I picked that film because it involves deliberate ambiguity. The only reason I didn't pick a comedy movie is because offhand I can't think of one that has an equivalent ending to MI2, which is a point in the game's favour I think.

[SHODANFreeman]

Originally Posted by Barnabus

I'm comparing the situations, not so much the things themselves. I picked that film because it involves deliberate ambiguity. The only reason I didn't pick a comedy movie is because offhand I can't think of one that has an equivalent ending to MI2, which is a point in the game's favour I think.

The game's ending is a joke, making fun of how ridiculous cliffhanger/twist endings are. It's not this ultra deep thing that has some meaning, it's a joke, and it was never meant to be more than that.

[Chyron8472]

Originally Posted by Pale Man

The game's ending is a joke, making fun of how ridiculous cliffhanger/twist endings are. It's not this ultra deep thing that has some meaning, it's a joke, and it was never meant to be more than that.

joke or not, it's still stupid.

[SHODANFreeman]

Originally Posted by Chyron8472

joke or not, it's still stupid.

I concur.

[Scrawffler]

Before actually playing it I remember thinking that Curse wasn't going to be very good (different mood, not sure where the storyline would go after LCR, new visual style, etc.) but it ended up being one of my favourite adventure games. Also, given the obscure/open-ended/abstract/jokey closing to LCR they had to work with, I think they did well with the continuity.

But I do think MonkeyMania's idea for MI2.5 needs to be made officially.

[Bagge]

Originally Posted by Chyron8472

joke or not, it's still stupid.

There wasn't anything stupid about the ending until CMI came around and decided LeChuck's evil scheme was to build and operate a theme park.

[plrichard]

Originally Posted by Bagge

There wasn't anything stupid about the ending until CMI came around and decided LeChuck's evil scheme was to build and operate a theme park.

Yes it was. The only way it could've been not stupid would've been the real Monkey Island 3 with Ron Gilbert's mind. Unfortunately, we didn't get that.

[Epic Kiwi]

The real Secret of Monkey Island: Dinghy Dog was really Herman Toothrot the whole time

[Bagge]

Originally Posted by plrichard

Yes it was. The only way it could've been not stupid would've been the real Monkey Island 3 with Ron Gilbert's mind. Unfortunately, we didn't get that.

No, I do agree that the carnival at the end of MI2 was only made stupid by CMI's explanation of it, but there were endless possibilities as to how you could resolve the cliffhanger. It wasn't a binary option of either Ron's idea or "LeChuck, the theme park tychoon of Monkey Island".

[Chyron8472]

Originally Posted by plrichard

Yes it was. The only way it could've been not stupid would've been the real Monkey Island 3 with Ron Gilbert's mind. Unfortunately, we didn't get that.

The real MI3? The end to MI2 was stupid and, aside from what CMI explained, neither Ron nor anyone else ever explained it more than to say it was a joke. Besides, CMI is the real MI3.

Originally Posted by Epic Kiwi

The real Secret of Monkey Island: Dinghy Dog was really Herman Toothrot the whole time

I would have liked this better than for Herman to be H.T. Marley (which doesn't make sense.)

Originally Posted by Bagge

No, I do agree that the carnival at the end of MI2 was only made stupid by CMI's explanation of it, but there were endless possibilities as to how you could resolve the cliffhanger. It wasn't a binary option of either Ron's idea or "LeChuck, the theme park tychoon of Monkey Island".

At least CMI gave an explanation. Ron did not. I was glad that CMI explained away that bullshit ending. It's much better than having a big-lipped-alligator-moment that no one ever explains or talks about ever again.

If you want to say that the MI universe is just a hallucination or a dream or a fantasy concocted by a child, then pardon me while I dropkick your severed head into a pit of lava.

[coolsome]

I liked the big whoop carnival and the idea lecuhck created it for world domnation (and everone knocks him but did make an army with it)

[Bagge]

Originally Posted by Chyron8472

At least CMI gave an explanation. Ron did not. I was glad that CMI explained away that bullshit ending. It's much better than having a big-lipped-alligator-moment that no one ever explains or talks about ever again.

If you want to say that the MI universe is just a hallucination or a dream or a fantasy concocted by a child, then pardon me while I dropkick your severed head into a pit of lava.

CMI gave an unsatisfactory explanation to a very interesting cliffhanger. To me, that is much worse than an open ending.

Some of the CMI-guys tend to get really riled up when talking about the ending of MI2, but yeah, it is quite possible that Ron Gilbert's original plan for the MI universe was that it represents a child's mind and imagination. The games hint at this at several occations, and getting agressive by the very notion that this could be the case seems weird to me. There are also, of course, tons of other possible explanations, but the way CMI resolved it was pretty weak, and did not fit smoothly into what was established at the end of MI2.