Back to the Future Platform Discussion

[HOKIEKC]

Originally Posted by RAnthonyMahan

In before the mods merge this into my platform discussion thread.

Anyway, welcome to the boards. To answer your question, Telltale deals in episodic gaming (releasing a short downloadable episode periodically, monthly in Telltale's case, that forms a full game when you look at all the episodes as a whole). Episodic gaming is comparatively easy on the PC, since with digital distribution services like Steam (or Telltale's own store) you can release a game whenever you're ready to. With consoles, it's not so easy. Nintendo, Sony, and Microsoft all get to decide what games appear on their systems, and all third-party games need to go through an approval process before being released. Not to mention that all three console makers get to regulate their console's downloadable gaming service. They decide when the game is released, how you buy the game, how big the game can be, and sometimes even how much the game costs. When they designed these services, they were never really expecting a third-party developer would want to release a new game every month.

Despite the problems of doing episodic gaming on consoles, Telltale has still tried on all three systems. When they released Strong Bad's Cool Game for Attractive People and Tales of Monkey Island on WiiWare, as well as Wallace and Gromit's Grand Adventures on Xbox Live Arcade...

-The episodes were delayed. (Wallace and Gromit was the worst offender, with Episodes 2, 3, and 4 all being released several months after the series finished for the PC. And Puzzle Agent still hasn't come out for WiiWare yet.)
-The episodes cost more money than their PC counterparts.
-You had to buy each episode individually, while with the PC you had the option of buying the entire season in advance.
-In Monkey Island's case, the episodes had to be severely toned down to fit WiiWare's 40 MB size limit.

While when Telltale released Sam and Max: The Devil's Playhouse for the PS3, they had none of these problems.

I know it sucks that BttF (probably) isn't coming to the 360, but at least understand it isn't Telltale's fault. Given all they've had to go through, consider yourself lucky they even bother with consoles at all.

I don't care if the game is 3-4 months late. Why isn't it coming period to the Xbox 360?

[RAnthonyMahan]

Originally Posted by HOKIEKC

But it's not true. CSI: Crime Scene Investigation: Fatal Conspiracy was released for the PC, Wii, PS3 and Xbox 360 on Oct. 26th, 2010.

1. The CSI games have Telltale working in a traditional publisher-developer relationship with Ubisoft, as opposed to developing independently like they usually do. If Ubisoft wants the CSI games on a certain system, Telltale has to develop them for that system.

2. The CSI games are not only not episodic, but exist purely as retail games, so whatever issues Telltale has with a console's downloadable game service is irrelevant there.

[jp-30]

Originally Posted by Shadowknight1

It's not an excuse. That's directly from TellTale themselves.

Really? Got a source for that?

[RAnthonyMahan]

Originally Posted by HOKIEKC

I don't care if the game is 3-4 months late. Why isn't it coming period to the Xbox 360?

Because developing the game for the 360 would probably cost Telltale more money than they could make from it.

Realistically, this game won't sell very well. It'll definitely meet, maybe even surpass Telltale's expectations, but point-and-click adventure games are niche market, and even with the newcomers who will be attracted by the BttF license this game isn't going to break any sales records when you look at the big picture.

Let's pretend Telltale released BttF for every system, including the 360 and the Wii. Let's also assume the 360/Wii versions have the same problems Telltale's earlier attempts at those systems have had. And now we have a (fairly small) pie of people who want the game.

Most people will buy the PC version. It's coming out first, and since Telltale's a PC-oriented developer, the majority of people buying it will want to play the game the way it was intended, if they can.

If somebody doesn't have a gaming-quality computer, or maybe just prefers console gaming, they'll usually get the PS3 version. Even if the PS3 isn't their preferred console, most console gamers who own a PS3 will choose it once they realize it has none of the disadvantages of the 360/Wii versions.

Then we have the people without a quality computer or a PS3. They'll be pretty divided. Some will go with the Wii version for its not-as-bad-as-the-360 delays, while some will go with the 360 for not having reduced graphics. Most people, however, when realizing how much longer they have to wait while the people with systems they don't own have long since beaten the episodes, will probably just go "Fuck it" and give up on the game entirely.

From a business sense, it's better for Telltale to not develop the game for the Xbox 360 than spend money they're not confident they can make back.

[HOKIEKC]

Originally Posted by RAnthonyMahan

Because developing the game for the 360 would probably cost Telltale more money than they could make from it.

That has to be one of the dumber statements I've read in a while. Do you know how many Xbox gamers there are and how profitable Xbox Live was in just the first 10 months of 2010?

You clearly have no clue.

[Vainamoinen]

Originally Posted by Shadowknight1

It could, very easily. Which is kind of a shame that it's not coming to the Wii, point and click would work very well for the system.

Originally Posted by HOKIEKC

Do you know how many Xbox gamers there are and how profitable Xbox Live was in just the first 10 months of 2010?

I'm one for the greatest possible system plurality, but don't you think that Telltale might know best what's easy and what not, what brings them money and what not, considering their past experiences?

I don't get when people start to assume that this decision could only be founded on stupidity. I don't get that!

[Alan Johnson]

Originally Posted by HOKIEKC

But it's not true. CSI: Crime Scene Investigation: Fatal Conspiracy was released for the PC, Wii, PS3 and Xbox 360 on Oct. 26th, 2010.

That game was published by Ubisoft. We developed the game.

[HOKIEKC]

Originally Posted by Alan Johnson

That game was published by Ubisoft. We developed the game.

So the reason there is no Xbox 360 version is because things get delayed with MS? So why not just release it 3-4 months from now?

I guess I don't understand why there isn't a Xbox 360 version period.

[Alan Johnson]

Originally Posted by HOKIEKC

So the reason there is no Xbox 360 version is because things get delayed with MS? So why not just release it 3-4 months from now?

I guess I don't understand why there isn't a Xbox 360 version period.

We would like to be on as many platforms as possible. At the moment, there are no plans for Back to the Future to be on Xbox 360 and Wii though. That's really all I can say.

[Shadowknight1]

Originally Posted by Vainamoinen

I'm one for the greatest possible system plurality, but don't you think that Telltale might know best what's easy and what not, what brings them money and what not, considering their past experiences?

I don't get when people start to assume that this decision could only be founded on stupidity. I don't get that!

I certainly don't assume that. I figured there was a reason it wasn't coming to the Wii, despite the idea that it would translate very well. Nor do I really care. I'd only really be upset if PC had been the only option.

[RAnthonyMahan]

Originally Posted by HOKIEKC

That has to be one of the dumber statements I've read in a while. Do you know how many Xbox gamers there are and how profitable Xbox Live was in just the first 10 months of 2010?

You clearly have no clue.

Again, you're looking at gaming in general without thinking specifically about Telltale and what they do.

Yes, there are a lot of Xbox gamers. However, only a small fraction of them would be interested in a point-and-click adventure game, and even less would stay interested after having to put up with XBLA's delays. Also, since you're playing the "more people own it" card, the Wii is the best-selling console of this generation, yet most third-party games ignore it. Why? Because those games aren't meant for the Wii, and they don't want to waste their time and money on a problematic (and most likely unprofitable) port. Same deal here.

Yes, Xbox Live is extremely profitable...because of games designed for use with Xbox Live. A game meant for the PC, given huge delays and raised prices, and released on another console without said delays and raised prices, won't be as profitable.

Anyway, this argument is starting to get ugly, so I'm going to drop out before it gets the chance to get worse. In the meantime, it's best to just accept that BttF isn't coming to the 360 (at least for the time being). Yeah, it sucks, but Telltale isn't doing it for the 360 because it'd be more trouble than it's worth, not because they want to screw 360 gamers over.

(Sheesh, the "Put BttF on the 360" complainers are almost enough to make me miss the "Bring back the Sam and Max Hit the Road voice actors" complainers.)

[Vainamoinen]

Originally Posted by RAnthonyMahan

(Sheesh, the "Put BttF on the 360" complainers are almost enough to make me miss the "Bring back the Sam and Max Hit the Road voice actors" complainers.)

Glad I missed THAT time!

[Zepton]

I'm conflicted:

Now, I feel lucky that BTTF is coming out on PS3 at all!

Now, I feel bad that people with only Xbox or Wii don't get BTTF at all!

I guess, I'm more happy that it's going to be on PS3 than sad for other people, though. I'm a bit selfish

[jp-30]

Telltale have put games on the Xbox download service (Wallace & Gromit), but it was a disaster, as has been mentioned before due to Microsoft not releasing the episodes in conjunction with the PC/Mac releases.

They've tried it, it doesn't suit their business model. Blame Microsoft, not Telltale for the situation.

[doggans]

Originally Posted by HOKIEKC

I don't care if the game is 3-4 months late. Why isn't it coming period to the Xbox 360?

Nobody said it was NEVER coming to Xbox. The first two seasons of Sam and Max came out on Xbox long after the other platforms.

[Shadowknight1]

Precisely.

Originally Posted by Alan Johnson

We would like to be on as many platforms as possible. At the moment, there are no plans for Back to the Future to be on Xbox 360 and Wii though. That's really all I can say.

That could easily mean that in the future, they may bring it to the other consoles. There are always possibilities.

[zmally]

people criticise Wallace & Gromit's performance on XBLA, but no-one criticises W&G's performance as a PC title do they? From what I understand, the game sold quite poorly on all platforms, TTG's own download service included, so why penalise the xbox gamers out there?

I used to try downloading my TTG games for the Wii, then I gave up and started getting them all as downloads for the PC - now I buy them all for Xbox 360 too, purely becuase I like the play the games on the sofa rather than a desk, given a choice. But as a die hard TTG fan I own two or more copies of nearly every release!

I have already paid for BttF download, but I'd much prefer the option to buy it for the Xbox too, either on xbla or at retail. I'd feel a lot better with some kind of "unofficial" "don't worry folks, we haven't forgotten the xbox 360 just yet "

[Forrest_GIMP]

Originally Posted by HOKIEKC

That has to be one of the dumber statements I've read in a while. Do you know how many Xbox gamers there are and how profitable Xbox Live was in just the first 10 months of 2010?

You clearly have no clue.

You're the one without a clue. You seem to think Live is the land of milk and honey for dev's. It's not.

Go ask Introversion, a great indy PC dev who's game Darwinia was ported to the xbox at great expense and sold so poorly the company was on the urge of going out of business until they were saved with a little help from Valve via a Steam sale and the addition of achievements into one of their old games.

A similar story was the one of ACE Team's "Zeno Clash", a brilliant PC indy game that was ported and sold pathetically on Live. Some games are suited better to some markets, and adventure games are always going to sell better on PC. When you factor in MS staggering the episodic release dates in a completely random way, then it just leads to frustration and the realization that it's not worth the effort of making a 360 port.

[WinterSnowblind]

Originally Posted by RAnthonyMahan

Again, you're looking at gaming in general without thinking specifically about Telltale and what they do.

Yes, there are a lot of Xbox gamers. However, only a small fraction of them would be interested in a point-and-click adventure game, and even less would stay interested after having to put up with XBLA's delays. Also, since you're playing the "more people own it" card, the Wii is the best-selling console of this generation, yet most third-party games ignore it. Why? Because those games aren't meant for the Wii, and they don't want to waste their time and money on a problematic (and most likely unprofitable) port. Same deal here.

Yes, Xbox Live is extremely profitable...because of games designed for use with Xbox Live. A game meant for the PC, given huge delays and raised prices, and released on another console without said delays and raised prices, won't be as profitable.

Anyway, this argument is starting to get ugly, so I'm going to drop out before it gets the chance to get worse. In the meantime, it's best to just accept that BttF isn't coming to the 360 (at least for the time being). Yeah, it sucks, but Telltale isn't doing it for the 360 because it'd be more trouble than it's worth, not because they want to screw 360 gamers over.

(Sheesh, the "Put BttF on the 360" complainers are almost enough to make me miss the "Bring back the Sam and Max Hit the Road voice actors" complainers.)

While I somewhat agree with what you're saying, why would the game perform any better on the PS3? Releasing the episodes in conjunction should certainly help, but that only goes against your argument. The fact Sam & Max, etc, sold so poorly on the 360 previously was because of the huge delays, not necessarily because there isn't an audience, but by that time anyone who might have been interested likely already would have played the games else where.

Perhaps it's Microsoft's fault for not handling the episodic format in the same manor as the PS3, but have Telltale ever said this is the problem? MS seem far better at keeping to release dates for XBLA and realising them worldwide in comparasion to the PSN, even if they wouldn't accommodate a subscription system for automatically getting each of the episodes, I find it hard to believe they wouldn't be willing to simply release one each month.

[Hangman522]

Except it's just common knowledge than 95 percent of multiplatform games sell better on 360 than PS3, also XBLA gets way more sales than the PSN. (Look at Pacman DX) Way more people bought it on 360 than PS3. The point is it's a dumb idea to not bring games to platforms the sell more titles.

As for this W&G stuff the series wasn't very interesting. That's why it didn't sell. ALSO I believe the remakes of monkey island have sold decently on XBLA so whoever said point and click games would never sell is wrong. Good ones will.

Originally Posted by Forrest_GIMP

You're the one without a clue. You seem to think Live is the land of milk and honey for dev's. It's not.

Go ask Introversion, a great indy PC dev who's game Darwinia was ported to the xbox at great expense and sold so poorly the company was on the urge of going out of business until they were saved with a little help from Valve via a Steam sale and the addition of achievements into one of their old games.

A similar story was the one of ACE Team's "Zeno Clash", a brilliant PC indy game that was ported and sold pathetically on Live. Some games are suited better to some markets, and adventure games are always going to sell better on PC. When you factor in MS staggering the episodic release dates in a completely random way, then it just leads to frustration and the realization that it's not worth the effort of making a 360 port.