2012 VGA's

[RingmasterJ5]

Originally Posted by Johro

Why do I get the feeling I can kiss Sam & Max Season 4 goodbye?

Same. Sorry to quote myself from only a few posts ago, but:

Originally Posted by RingmasterJ5

I just find myself getting paranoid because it looks a lot like the easier they make their games gameplay-wise, the more money TTG gets.

Right now, it seems that if they made a normal Sam and Max game with all the crazy adventure game logic and nonsensical storylines that entails, it'd be a monetary loss for them compared to TWD/JP/BTTF Season Two.

[Icedhope]

Originally Posted by Johro

Why do I get the feeling I can kiss Sam & Max Season 4 goodbye?

*Shrugs* I have no clue...

[MusicallyInspired]

Why are we cheering that they won? I mean, kudos, I guess. But let's just think about this. All this rewards show does is promote the games that were the most popular, not the ones that were actually any good. Gameplay means nothing in this sense. It's a pretty shallow award even more shallowly given. I'm not saying that TWD is a crap game (I'm not saying it isn't either, I'm just not going in that direction), I'm just saying they didn't win because it wasn't. So why are we celebrating? Because TTG is in the public eye? Well, good for them. Their business will certainly get better because of this. But receiving this award, even if it is the best game ever, isn't going to mean that good games will suddenly get the spotlight. It means that TTG is probably going to be making even worse games to appeal to the masses. Or at least games that are far different than what they started out as. And we all knew that anyway, I think. Also, receiving any award from the VGA's doesn't seem to mean very much as the whole thing is a joke. So again I ask, why are we celebrating?

I can't stand how Hollywood just can't get games. Even after all this time. Gamers are just not the same and can't relate equally in the same way to Hollywood movies, which are (were?) the center of pop culture. They think they know how to treat it and they just don't. VGAs are crap. Hollywood is crap. It's all crap. Crap.

[Shadowknight1]

Originally Posted by RingmasterJ5

I just find myself getting paranoid because it looks a lot like the easier they make their games gameplay-wise, the more money TTG gets.

Find me a truly difficult game nowadays that isn't made difficult by the guys you're playing against online.

[Secret Fawful]

Originally Posted by MusicallyInspired

Why are we cheering that they won? I mean, kudos, I guess. But let's just think about this. All this rewards show does is promote the games that were the most popular, not the ones that were actually any good. Gameplay means nothing in this sense. It's a pretty shallow award even more shallowly given. I'm not saying that TWD is a crap game (I'm not saying it isn't either, I'm just not going in that direction), I'm just saying they didn't win because it wasn't.

You're right.

After seeing how the awardees were treated in the pre-show, it's impossible to treat this award with any REAL favor. It's a really big deal that Telltale beat out games like AC3, though, in such a shallow show.

[MusicallyInspired]

Originally Posted by Secret Fawful

It's a really big deal that Telltale beat out games like AC3, though, in such a shallow show.

True. But again, to what end? It doesn't mean a better game won. It means a niche game developer turned some heads (from the wrong people, from a gamer's perspective, not for a business's) and is about to go full-throttle sell-out.

[Secret Fawful]

Originally Posted by MusicallyInspired

True. But again, to what end? It doesn't mean a better game won. It means a niche game developer turned some heads (from the wrong people, from a gamer's perspective, not for a business's) and is about to go full-throttle sell-out.

To exactly the end you just said.

[RingmasterJ5]

Originally Posted by Shadowknight1

Find me a truly difficult game nowadays that isn't made difficult by the guys you're playing against online.

Super Hexagon? Binding of Isaac? Spelunky? Stealth Bastard Deluxe? FTL? Hotline Miami? Super Meat Boy? XCOM? Trials Evolution? Ms. Splosion Man?

But, how does this have any relevance to the fact that TTG games have had barely any puzzle-based difficulty since BTTF? Are you trying to say that easy single-player games are just the norm now?

[MusicallyInspired]

Originally Posted by Secret Fawful

To exactly the end you just said.

Yes, I figured it out as I was talking. Narrating your mind is fun.

[der_ketzer]

Originally Posted by Shadowknight1

Find me a truly difficult game nowadays that isn't made difficult by the guys you're playing against online.

Hotline Miami. FTL. Super Meat Boy, The Binding Of Isaac. They Bleed Pixels. Legend of Grimrock.

[MusicallyInspired]

Originally Posted by Shadowknight1

Find me a truly difficult game nowadays that isn't made difficult by the guys you're playing against online.

Almost anything indie. Pretty much nothing AAA. Very very few exceptions.

[thestalkinghead]

Originally Posted by RingmasterJ5

Super Hexagon? Binding of Isaac? Spelunky? Stealth Bastard Deluxe? FTL? Hotline Miami? Super Meat Boy? XCOM? Trials Evolution? Ms. Splosion Man?

But, how does this have any relevance to the fact that TTG games have had barely any puzzle-based difficulty since BTTF? Are you trying to say that easy single-player games are just the norm now?

super hexagon is incredibly simple it's just twitch reaction based and doesn't appeal to me at all, FTL isn't hard it is just incredibly random, super meat boy is a platformer that relies on twitch reactions and repetition (not hard just irritating in my opinion), trials evolution is only hard if you love high scores, and XCOM has a save and load function and even without it is only punishing if you don't play conservatively.

you can describe a game as hard or easy depending on how you look at it eg. dwarf fortress is easy, the controls and the mechanics just take a while to learn so you could say it was hard.
you could say that TWD was hard because it would make you feel bad for doing things in the game, or you could say it was easy because you have infinite ammo, it really just depends on what you want out of a game and how you define "hard" or "difficult"

[Shadowknight1]

Ugh, I had a nice, long post about the declining difficulty versus the rising of complex narratives in games, but the forums ate it. So blah.

[RingmasterJ5]

Originally Posted by thestalkinghead

super hexagon is incredibly simple it's just twitch reaction based and doesn't appeal to me at all, FTL isn't hard it is just incredibly random, super meat boy is a platformer that relies on twitch reactions and repetition (not hard just irritating in my opinion)

The fact that they don't appeal to you doesn't invalidate their difficulty.

Originally Posted by thestalkinghead

trials evolution is only hard if you love high scores

Ah, so you just breezed through all those Extreme levels?

Originally Posted by thestalkinghead

and XCOM has a save and load function and even without it is only punishing if you don't play conservatively.

Iron man mode. I see that you've also selectively left out a few of the games I've mentioned, by the way.

Originally Posted by thestalkinghead

you can describe a game as hard or easy depending on how you look at it eg. dwarf fortress is easy, the controls and the mechanics just take a while to learn so you could say it was hard.

Some games do increase in difficulty, even after you've already learned the mechanics. Quite a few of them(like the ones I've mentioned) do.

Originally Posted by thestalkinghead

you could say that TWD was hard because it would make you feel bad for doing things in the game, or you could say it was easy because you have infinite ammo, it really just depends on what you want out of a game and how you define "hard" or "difficult"

If you feel bad for doing things in the game, that's much more story-related than it is gameplay-related.

If I wanted a visual novel with difficult puzzles, I'd play the Ace Attorney games or something.

Originally Posted by Shadowknight1(Quote format is odd because of site maintenance)

Ugh, I had a nice, long post about the declining difficulty versus the rising of complex narratives in games, but the forums ate it. So blah.

While this applies to some current AAA titles, I can't say things like Far Cry 3 are sacrificing gameplay for story. Hell, XCOM isn't, either. You'll find great gameplay if you know where to look, too, like indie releases.

But, at least things like Dishonored actually have gameplay, and they aren't morphing people's definitions of an entire genre into "CYOAs with QTEs". The amount of times I've seen TWD called an adventure game just amazes me.

Basically, what I'm trying to say is that while I'll be sort of content adventure-wise just moving on and playing things like Primordia, I don't want licenses like Sam and Max being held hostage by a company who's lost track of why they were founded in the first place. I don't want, and it's a bit too early to call it "selling out", but it's getting a bit close.

[corruptbiggins]

Typical of attitudes on here that a chance to celebrate a success is also used as a stick to beat the company with.

[thestalkinghead]

Originally Posted by RingmasterJ5

The fact that they don't appeal to you doesn't invalidate their difficulty.

Ah, so you just breezed through all those Extreme levels?

Iron man mode. I see that you've also selectively left out a few of the games I've mentioned, by the way.

Some games do increase in difficulty, even after you've already learned the mechanics. Quite a few of them(like the ones I've mentioned) do.

If you feel bad for doing things in the game, that's much more story-related than it is gameplay-related.

If I wanted a visual novel with difficult puzzles, I'd play the Ace Attorney games or something.

While this applies to some current AAA titles, I can't say things like Far Cry 3 are sacrificing gameplay for story. Hell, XCOM isn't, either. You'll find great gameplay if you know where to look, too, like indie releases.

But, at least things like Dishonored actually have gameplay, and they aren't morphing people's definitions of an entire genre into "CYOAs with QTEs". The amount of times I've seen TWD called an adventure game just amazes me.

Basically, what I'm trying to say is that while I'll be sort of content adventure-wise just moving on and playing things like Primordia, I don't want licenses like Sam and Max being held hostage by a company who's lost track of why they were founded in the first place. I don't want, and it's a bit too early to call it "selling out", but it's getting a bit close.

i left out the ones i haven't played, my point about twitch reaction based games (Super Hexagon,Super Meat Boy,Trials Evolution) is that they aren't difficult in my opinion because they don't require thought just reaction, just like a QTE.

and i would not play iron man mode because i dont enjoy mistakes ruining my entire game.

there are tonnes of games that ignore story and only concentrate on game play mechanics, but i think what TWD has done is prove that story can actually be a part of game play

[GaryCXJk]

Okay, so I've seen one or two being displeased that it took selling out to win a GOTY, but:

1) If it takes me selling out to earn hard cash, I'm all for it. Yes, I'm evil.

2) Can't we just be unambiguously, genuinely be happy that Telltale Games won? I mean, considering you can't call Telltale Games a triple A developer (no offense).

3) It was either this game or Journey. Which one would you prefer then? Journey? Really? Oh, okay then.

[Gman5852]

Congratulations Telltale! Totally deserved it.

[Gerudan]

I didn't thought, TWD would have any chance to win, but it actually did. Sure, TWD has a lot of flaws and many are quiet severe and obvious, but it also shows, what games can do on an emotional level, if they just try to. And I really hope, other developers well follow this and make games to what they could be: The most immersive and emotional media, we have.

[der_ketzer]

Originally Posted by thestalkinghead

i left out the ones i haven't played, my point about twitch reaction based games (Super Hexagon,Super Meat Boy,Trials Evolution) is that they aren't difficult in my opinion because they don't require thought just reaction, just like a QTE.

And you are still wrong.