Telltale Games

Crixus · 02/15/2013, 02:51 pm

In episode 1 there was no real leader of the group as they had all just met in the Drug Store.
In episode 2 both Kenny and Lily were battling for the leadership. Lee had to choose a side in the power struggle but there was no option where he could volunteer himself to be the leader.
In episode 3 it is still between Kenny/Lily for the leadership. After Lily's departure Kenny then pretty much becomes the leader saying that they are going to stick with his boat plan.
In episode 4 Kenny has withdrawn somewhat from his leadership role because of his families death,so Lee does slightly become more of a leader in the group. When Clem finds the boat Kenny's hope is restored and he becomes somewhat more of a leader again.
In episode 5 there is no clear leader because generally the group is working together to save Clem. Although you could argue in the attic Kenny becomes a bit more of a leader again when he is telling Lee how things are gonna be if he takes another turn for the worse.

I would have liked the opportunity for Lee to become the leader of the group, a thing which Carley thought he would be good at because as she said in episode 2 that people looked up to him. Rick had his RICKTATORSHIP, it would have been nice for Lee to have a LEEDERSHIP.

Hopefully in season 2 the protagonist will have this opportunity. Your thoughts?

double_u · 02/15/2013, 03:43 pm

I pretty much agree with all your observations. The only reason I think Lee had for holding back in 1-2 is that Larry knew about his past. If Lee tried to join the leadership fight then, Larry would've said something about that to help Lilly.

That said, I really think Lee should've step up to the plate more after episode 2 when it came to leadership roles. He was too much of a go-between at times trying to make peace between Kenny and Lilly. And when Kenny began pushing to go to Savannah even AFTER Duck died and Christa saying the cities are all screwed, Lee should've step up and taken over, for Clem's sake at least.

Riadon · 02/15/2013, 03:51 pm

Yes, I would have preferred it. I tried to take charge whenever possible, but the game just wasn't having it.

If we are put into a leadership position into the future, though, I hope that it is realistic and that other group members will not follow blindly. If I screw up as a leader, I want to be punished for it.

The Fallen · 02/15/2013, 03:52 pm

I liked the way they played to leadership issue in the game actually, you spent the first half of your time with that as the main issue, the big thing for you to think about, Kenny, Lilly or even yourself, then episode 3 did a great job of reminding you of whats really important.

There's never actually a clear leader of the group at any point in the game, Neither Lilly or Kenny ever have majority support, outside of them and their families the group is quite small, Lee, Ben, Mark for a little while, Carley (or Doug), Clem. Clem and Ben dont really have a big say, so the leadership votes pretty much looked like this,

Kenny: Himself, Katjaa, Possibly Lee
Lilly: Himslef, Larry, Possibly Lee
Lee: Carley, Mark, Possibly himself

Then in episode 2 and 3 we lose most of those people, ands only Kenny and Lee left with a serious say in things, we gain Christa and Omid, but they seem very independent of you, its probably only the seriousness of the situation towards the end that stops another power struggle breaking out with Christa.

Zeruis · 02/15/2013, 03:56 pm

No. I liked how Lee's character eventually developed to BE the leader. Even though it was not set in stone, I feel as if Lee became leader as soon as Lilly left the group.

Having said that, I don't want the protagonist in the second season to be the leader of the group AT ALL. We've seen Rick and Lee be leaders, so I think that the protagonist should be someone different: someone who has an active role in the group, but not the actual leader. (Like episodes 1-2 Lee.)

Crixus · 02/15/2013, 04:12 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by double_u

I pretty much agree with all your observations. The only reason I think Lee had for holding back in 1-2 is that Larry knew about his past. If Lee tried to join the leadership fight then, Larry would've said something about that to help Lilly.

That said, I really think Lee should've step up to the plate more after episode 2 when it came to leadership roles. He was too much of a go-between at times trying to make peace between Kenny and Lilly. And when Kenny began pushing to go to Savannah even AFTER Duck died and Christa saying the cities are all screwed, Lee should've step up and taken over, for Clem's sake at least.

Yeah thats a good point,Lee was pretty powerless while Larry was still alive but yeah like you said after episode 2 i would have liked to see him step up more.

AnnaSan · 02/15/2013, 05:17 pm

I guess they wanted us to be the kind of person who would want to please everyone, be as neutral as possible. I hated it though, I'm trying to be nice to everyone but there is always someone who would hate me for one mistake =.=

Mornai · 02/15/2013, 06:37 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by AnnaSan

I guess they wanted us to be the kind of person who would want to please everyone, be as neutral as possible. I hated it though, I'm trying to be nice to everyone but there is always someone who would hate me for one mistake =.=

Exactly, it's saying you can't please everyone, which is true. No matter the circumstances, there is always someone somewhere on the planet who will disagree with you. Probably even more so in a zombie apocalypse, because with no government everyone will be wanting to make their own rules and be their own boss.

Web Head · 02/15/2013, 07:12 pm

It's not about who's the god damn leader! It's about survival :c

CarScar · 02/15/2013, 10:33 pm

Lee did become the unofficial leader come episode four and five.

(These quotes aren't accurate).

"Everyone looks up to you."

"Okay guys, Clem and I going to check out this abandoned station back here. Come if you hear anything!"

"We'll do both, Ben scavenge whatever supplies you can find in the house. Kenny and I will go to the river."

"Okay guys, here's the plan: we sneak in, take what we can undetected and get out."

"Christa! Fortify the windows! Kenny! Check our weapons! Ben! Go upstairs! Omid! ... Everyone, the front doors!"

I really liked his role in the group and development into a pseudo-leader.

Crixus · 02/16/2013, 05:12 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Web Head

It's not about who's the god damn leader! It's about survival :c

True but a good leader can greatly increase the chances of survival.

Blossomed · 02/17/2013, 09:47 pm

I agree, I tried to take charge whenever I could but Lee was afraid of what Larry had knew about his past. Everyone looked up to Lee though, he was always the idea's man or the advice man, he was the person everyone looked up to when in doubt so I think he might of just taken on the leader role.

Fabrimuch · 02/20/2013, 09:33 pm

Well, personally I am more of a follower than a leader, so I never tried to take control of the group. I always felt as if Lee was happier staying at the sidelines instead of taking direct control.

In any case, considering how much influence he had on the rest of the group, he might as well be the "unofficial" leader.

Demonseed · 02/22/2013, 01:14 pm

Sometimes being the proclaimed leader of a group does not mean you are the one in charge. If you have a smart person who wants none of the blame when things go bad, you advocate to make a person in charge and control his/her decisions behind the scenes by placing a friend or easily coerced person in charge.

However, I always felt that Lee was the one in charge (even though Lilly seemed to always jump at the title of being in charge and Kenny would make his own decisions and argue with her) as he always was looked at to make (or sit on the fence) a decision in favor of one or the other. Once Lilly was out of the picture, everyone always looked to Lee as the decision maker (except Kenny with his boat idea that he wouldn't let go) on what to do.

I did like the way TTG allowed you to make decisions or just sit out and let the others fight it out which allowed people who wanted to make decisions do so (at the peril of angering others) or just sit back and watch the fireworks.

Bidoof · 02/28/2013, 02:19 pm

Yeah, I felt like lee was just along for the ride, he took none of the opportunities to take control and he didn't even bother to be assertive really. Your observations are pretty good and they clearly show lee's can't be bothered attitude. I realise that lee probably didn't want to step on anyone's toes but I felt like he trod too carefully and took no risks in the leadership department, he could have tried harder to get control on the group and take charge...

02/15/2013, 02:51 pm	#1
Crixus Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2012 Location: Not in Kenny's boat anyways! (Thanks alot Vernon....) Posts: 285	Would you have liked for Lee to take more of a leadership role in season 1? In episode 1 there was no real leader of the group as they had all just met in the Drug Store. In episode 2 both Kenny and Lily were battling for the leadership. Lee had to choose a side in the power struggle but there was no option where he could volunteer himself to be the leader. In episode 3 it is still between Kenny/Lily for the leadership. After Lily's departure Kenny then pretty much becomes the leader saying that they are going to stick with his boat plan. In episode 4 Kenny has withdrawn somewhat from his leadership role because of his families death,so Lee does slightly become more of a leader in the group. When Clem finds the boat Kenny's hope is restored and he becomes somewhat more of a leader again. In episode 5 there is no clear leader because generally the group is working together to save Clem. Although you could argue in the attic Kenny becomes a bit more of a leader again when he is telling Lee how things are gonna be if he takes another turn for the worse. I would have liked the opportunity for Lee to become the leader of the group, a thing which Carley thought he would be good at because as she said in episode 2 that people looked up to him. Rick had his RICKTATORSHIP, it would have been nice for Lee to have a LEEDERSHIP. Hopefully in season 2 the protagonist will have this opportunity. Your thoughts? __________________ Lee: What the fuck Kenny?! Kenny: Lee, Lee, it's okay. Lee: No, KEN! NO, It's not! Kenny: It's just somethin' I gotta do. You know that.

02/15/2013, 03:43 pm	#2
double_u Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2012 Location: Over the Hills and Far Away Posts: 316	I pretty much agree with all your observations. The only reason I think Lee had for holding back in 1-2 is that Larry knew about his past. If Lee tried to join the leadership fight then, Larry would've said something about that to help Lilly. That said, I really think Lee should've step up to the plate more after episode 2 when it came to leadership roles. He was too much of a go-between at times trying to make peace between Kenny and Lilly. And when Kenny began pushing to go to Savannah even AFTER Duck died and Christa saying the cities are all screwed, Lee should've step up and taken over, for Clem's sake at least. Last edited by double_u; 02/15/2013 at 03:53 pm. Reason: spelling

02/15/2013, 03:52 pm	#4
The Fallen Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2013 Posts: 207	I liked the way they played to leadership issue in the game actually, you spent the first half of your time with that as the main issue, the big thing for you to think about, Kenny, Lilly or even yourself, then episode 3 did a great job of reminding you of whats really important. There's never actually a clear leader of the group at any point in the game, Neither Lilly or Kenny ever have majority support, outside of them and their families the group is quite small, Lee, Ben, Mark for a little while, Carley (or Doug), Clem. Clem and Ben dont really have a big say, so the leadership votes pretty much looked like this, Kenny: Himself, Katjaa, Possibly Lee Lilly: Himslef, Larry, Possibly Lee Lee: Carley, Mark, Possibly himself Then in episode 2 and 3 we lose most of those people, ands only Kenny and Lee left with a serious say in things, we gain Christa and Omid, but they seem very independent of you, its probably only the seriousness of the situation towards the end that stops another power struggle breaking out with Christa. __________________ BFF's: Lee, Clem, Carley and Kenny Although the forever in BFF should be taken loosely

02/15/2013, 10:33 pm	#10
CarScar Scar and Gun Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: The Roadside Posts: 609	Lee did become the unofficial leader come episode four and five. (These quotes aren't accurate). "Everyone looks up to you." "Okay guys, Clem and I going to check out this abandoned station back here. Come if you hear anything!" "We'll do both, Ben scavenge whatever supplies you can find in the house. Kenny and I will go to the river." "Okay guys, here's the plan: we sneak in, take what we can undetected and get out." "Christa! Fortify the windows! Kenny! Check our weapons! Ben! Go upstairs! Omid! ... Everyone, the front doors!" I really liked his role in the group and development into a pseudo-leader. __________________ "Don't call me small."

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02/15/2013, 03:51 pm	#3
Riadon Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2013 Posts: 297	Yes, I would have preferred it. I tried to take charge whenever possible, but the game just wasn't having it. If we are put into a leadership position into the future, though, I hope that it is realistic and that other group members will not follow blindly. If I screw up as a leader, I want to be punished for it.

02/15/2013, 03:56 pm	#5
Zeruis Mundy Join Date: Jun 2012 Posts: 1,943	No. I liked how Lee's character eventually developed to BE the leader. Even though it was not set in stone, I feel as if Lee became leader as soon as Lilly left the group. Having said that, I don't want the protagonist in the second season to be the leader of the group AT ALL. We've seen Rick and Lee be leaders, so I think that the protagonist should be someone different: someone who has an active role in the group, but not the actual leader. (Like episodes 1-2 Lee.)

02/15/2013, 05:17 pm	#7
AnnaSan Super Weenie Hut Jr. Join Date: Oct 2012 Location: California Posts: 344	I guess they wanted us to be the kind of person who would want to please everyone, be as neutral as possible. I hated it though, I'm trying to be nice to everyone but there is always someone who would hate me for one mistake =.=

02/15/2013, 07:12 pm	#9
Web Head I miss you Lee Everett :/ Join Date: May 2012 Location: Canada Posts: 177	It's not about who's the god damn leader! It's about survival :c

02/17/2013, 09:47 pm	#12
Blossomed Junior Member Join Date: Feb 2013 Location: North-East, England Posts: 9	I agree, I tried to take charge whenever I could but Lee was afraid of what Larry had knew about his past. Everyone looked up to Lee though, he was always the idea's man or the advice man, he was the person everyone looked up to when in doubt so I think he might of just taken on the leader role.

02/20/2013, 09:33 pm	#13
Fabrimuch Senior Member Join Date: May 2012 Posts: 139	Well, personally I am more of a follower than a leader, so I never tried to take control of the group. I always felt as if Lee was happier staying at the sidelines instead of taking direct control. In any case, considering how much influence he had on the rest of the group, he might as well be the "unofficial" leader.

02/22/2013, 01:14 pm	#14
Demonseed Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2012 Posts: 164	Sometimes being the proclaimed leader of a group does not mean you are the one in charge. If you have a smart person who wants none of the blame when things go bad, you advocate to make a person in charge and control his/her decisions behind the scenes by placing a friend or easily coerced person in charge. However, I always felt that Lee was the one in charge (even though Lilly seemed to always jump at the title of being in charge and Kenny would make his own decisions and argue with her) as he always was looked at to make (or sit on the fence) a decision in favor of one or the other. Once Lilly was out of the picture, everyone always looked to Lee as the decision maker (except Kenny with his boat idea that he wouldn't let go) on what to do. I did like the way TTG allowed you to make decisions or just sit out and let the others fight it out which allowed people who wanted to make decisions do so (at the peril of angering others) or just sit back and watch the fireworks.

02/28/2013, 02:19 pm	#15
Bidoof Junior Member Join Date: Feb 2013 Posts: 21	Yeah, I felt like lee was just along for the ride, he took none of the opportunities to take control and he didn't even bother to be assertive really. Your observations are pretty good and they clearly show lee's can't be bothered attitude. I realise that lee probably didn't want to step on anyone's toes but I felt like he trod too carefully and took no risks in the leadership department, he could have tried harder to get control on the group and take charge...