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People finally starting to wake up and accept that working on 4 games at once is hurting TWDSeason2?

posted by Clem_is_awesome on - last edited - Viewed by 26.7K users
"Third time's a charm" -- What i said a couple of days after beating episode 2. I was so happy knowing that we'll go to a camp, the PERFECT place to have tons of hubs and people to talk to. What made me even more hyped about going to the god damned camp? the fact that all the playable 400 days characters were confirmed in the game files. What did i get instead? Probably the most rushed episode in the history of TWD.

Now i'm seeing a lot of threads popping up with a good amount of thumbs up where people are actually agreeing that the episode felt super rushed and had very poor writing for what we expected.

Now let's talk about the biggest problems with this episode.

My biggest issue with this episode is Carver. From episode 1 we're being hyped about this super bad dude "Carver" going around killing LOTS of people we already know from the past(Roman and the scavengers at the river). Episode 2 trailer comes out and there we have Telltale hyping up this character again, played by Michael Madsen and also putting "Who is Carver?" in their Playing Dead vids and all. They even got Anadel to compose an insanely amazing track just named "Carver". On episode 2 we're told in some parts that Carver is a very intelligent man. We get descriptions like "Clementine and her group learn what it’s like to live under the heel of a leader whose intelligence is rivaled only by his propensity for brutal violence." and that leads us to believe that this guy is some genius mastermind with a really dark agenda that we'll get to see in episode 3. The episode comes out and it turns out he really isn't that smart and that the camp really isn't that safe. Then Carver dies and that's it. He had no character development in the episode. Even Bonnie and Troy had more lines and screen time than him. Super disappointed.

Second issue. 400 days characters. We play the 400 days DLC and we end up loving most of the characters. By the end of it we're left with this cliffhanger that we're going to some community. Tons of speculation and hype start building up as we find out Tavia's community might be Carver's community. SO MANY QUESTIONS START COMING UP. "How are we going to interact with the 400 days characters?" , "Was Tavia's community good from the start? did Carver eventually take over after some time?" ,"Becca will be older, how is she going to interact with Clem? "I can't wait to interact with all my favorite characters from 400 days!". All this twitter hype about "YOU NEED TO PLAY 400 DAYS" then the episode comes out and every single 400 days character has either 1 or 2 lines and they're all assholes now. It's very very unlikely that we'll see them again and i don't even wanna see them again to be honest.

Third problem. Some of the writing. There are tons of stuff left unexplained after Carver's death and it's stuff that will probably never be explained. We didn't know what happened to the people who got shot at the river and the ties they had with Carver. We never got to know who was George and why Alvin killed him. Rebecca's complete change of personality. We're being led to believe that the Cabin Group can't really be trusted and that they're hiding something. It turned out the Cabin Group didn't really have any skeletons in the closet and there really is no reason to believe there will be any more trust issues in episode 4 or 5 since most of the cabin group is dead now. Telltale made a big emphasis on this Luke vs Kenny thing that started in episode 2 but as of now there really is no way that anyone will pick Luke over Kenny after how bad Luke screwed up in episode 3. It's all a mess.

It's clear how this huge workload of working on 4 games at once and the constant switch of writers, directors and designers between all games is hurting season 2's quality. The 90 minute per episode formula just doesn't work for this game.

Don't get me wrong, episode 3 was great by itself but i don't like settling down for something like this knowing that Telltale can do better and has done better in the past with season 1. All i can hope now is that Telltale gets a reality check some day and they go back to working only on Season 3.
362 Comments
  • 1:You don't know what the last 2 episodes have in stall so who know's where it will lead to. Also, Carver was a classic example at telltale showing how delusional some people in a zombie apocalypse. Much like the St Johns in Season 1, Carver thought that where they were located was safe and would never fall and in the end, it did fall. While Carver was build up to being this cunning man, he was really just an insane guy who thought his way was the only way. Bonnie is part of the group now, so Telltale was building her up to see how people would react to her bringing Carvers group to the lodge and having Walter and Alvin be killed. It's a smart way to see if people will forgive her or continue to despise her and as for Troy, well he was build as someone you'd hate and want to see him die. Being shot in the dick was a pretty good even though i liked Troy's character.

    2: They told you to play 400 days because they want you to play their games. I do agree that it was a lot of hype then just them being so shallow but what do you expect? We have a big enough group as it is. If they were to join the group, telltale would have to kill a dozen of people off and given that there was 3 episodes left, Don't you think it's too far gone to bring them in?



    3: Like i said earlier, there's still 2 episodes left so anything can happen. Personally, i've never trusted Luke. I just think there is something seedy about him. And as before, Having Kenny being bashed to a pulp and then having Luke screw up is wanting you to pick Kenny over Luke. This is why telltale is so successful. Because they make you think and believe/support things or people. Like Ben in Season 1 with all his screw ups, they did it to make you hate the kid and then at the end of episode 4 you have a chance to put away your hate towards him and save his live or let him go. Could be the same thing with Luke although not to the extent of Ben.

    I agree about the time of the episodes. 90 minutes is too short for such a long release dates. Seems to be as soon as Episode 5 of Season 1 came out, that the time duration of episodes went downhill. I mean from S1 Episodes 2-4 they were about 100 minutes, 110 minutes and Episode 4 was 2+ hours and people complained about that being to long yet, i'd rather a long episode worth the wait then short episodes.



    I think it's unfair on Season 2 because Season 1 will always be the best. It was almost flawless apart from episode being too short. It's like movies, you RARELY see sequels out do the originals. And FYI, i thought Episode 3 was the best of Season 2 so far, in fact, they're getting better as they go on in Season 2 and this is coming from someone who prefers Season 1 over Season 2.
    • 5 months ago "don't worry there's still 4 episodes left

      3 months ago "don't worry there's still 3 episodes left"

      today "don't worry there's still 2 episodes left"
      • Yup. Soon there will be no time left; the season will conclude and we will be left wishing Clementine had a season worthy of her.
        • ...and then modern fathead TTG will release "The Walking Dead Season 2" on disc, then "The Walking Dead Season 2: GOTY" on disc, and then a ton other editions to cash in.

          I have a feeling that the digital version of the PS3 game won't get a platinum trophy. TTG will probably force us to buy the disc if we wan't it. Execs probably met and said: "Haha those trophy hunters will buy the entire season digitally and not get the platinum! How about we make them pay AGAIN just to get it? HAHAHAHAHA!"
      • User Avatar Image
        Vainamoinen Moderator
        > 5 months ago "don't worry there's still 4 episodes left
        > 3 months ago "don't worry there's still 3 episodes left"
        > today "don't worry there's still 2 episodes left"


        True, absolutely. A bit like my experience with Harry Potter ("It gets better with book 2!" "It gets better with book 3!"). A good story has to interest you from minute one, not from part 4 on. Then again, I think I have an inkling of what Telltale tries to establish as the guiding lines / overarching idea of Season 2, and in that mindset, wouldn't say all is lost already.
  • I like ep3, it's great, as a game.
    But I'm spending more time on Wolf Among US than TWD S2....

    I can't relate to nearly any characters in S2 except Clementine.
    Even Clementine, sometimes I feel like I'm playing a soldier in FPS.

    In S1, from hotel marsh scene to finale, I felt genuine heartache. (and I was ashamed that I felt heartache while playing a game.)
    In S2, there are so many shocking scenes but it was...like I was watching a horror movie with popcorn and soda.

    Maybe I'm being a bit harsh to a great game, but TWD S1 was Too great I guess.
    Especially the emotional attachment...where did it go?
  • I personally enjoyed the episode. Yeah, the hub's are great, and I'm pretty sure we might get some next episode. As, from the preview it seems to be a very "reflective" episode on what happened and searching for Sarah. In Telltales defence, I'm pretty sure you all mentioned story branching, how much you wanted it? I believe they're trying this- and to improve certain parts they need to get rid of others, and you can't say there isn't story branching because otherwise Nick would've just died this episode. You're focusing on the 400 Days characters that are with Carver, what about all the ones that didn't go with him? I'm pretty sure we'll run into them and get to interact with them. The episode was good and some of you are just being a bit too critical, I agree we could use hubs, but it's the story is what should always matter- and the story was quite good, and we've been introduced to two new characters: Mike and Jane, who seem pretty cool.

    People just need to look at the positives too:)
  • I wouldn't blame 1 bad episode on them working on multiple games. It just comes down to writing. Usually telltale makes hits with everything they do but this time they missed. If it was a good episode you would be complaining.
  • How are people only realising now that telltale is strugling? I knew they was going to struggle as they said their creating the walking dead season 2 and the wolf amonst us and what make's it worse for them is they have bordaland's and game of thrones to do yet.

    Also the short lenth of each episode in season 2 and lack of hub's could be considered proof of this
    Due to lack of each episode lenth, It effect's the quality and the character's development in season 2 is bad
  • I'm sorry but I can't agree with the majority in this argument for many reasons.

    First, "the most rushed episode" actually took almost as long to come out as the previous one, and it's really odd for you to say rushed if you also based your hype on game files and not what actually happened in the game itself. And just because people agree that the episode 'felt super rushed' doesn't mean it was, as I'm sure nobody who agreed works for TTG.

    As for Carver, it was assumed he'd be the main villain, but this went against a lot of people's expectations, so I can see why people would complain about that. However, saying no character development makes me wonder if you even listened to his speeches. And to say he really isn't that smart makes me think that he simply didn't demonstrate his intelligence for you with some clever ruse, even though it was clear that his discussions with Clem and Kenny revealed how right and therefore intelligent he will probably be in hindsight. In other words, he was a great thematic device, not a 'final boss'.

    The twitter hype I think you're referring to talked about how "The 'butterfly effect' of choices & deaths from S1/400 Days & S2 is QUITE present in #TheWalkingDead S2 Ep 3", and is actually quite true. Although, from what you said, it seems like you didn't get what you expected, and so that's reason enough to complain (it's not). "Every single 400 days character has either 1 or 2 lines and they're all assholes now" is also not true, as Vince and Tavia had more than 2 lines, and to call them all assholes is pretty strange considering you weren't even able to respond to 6 of them in order to determine what they're like now. Further, we don't know how the 400 Days characters got along with Carver, so if they seemed like assholes, then maybe they were just acting tough to toe the line and protect themselves.

    Lastly, I can't really comment on the writing because it's not meant to satisfy everyone, and I didn't have much of a problem with it, so that's more of a difference of opinion. But really, if you're going to say "that working on 4 games at once is hurting TWDSeason2" at least put together a reasonable argument to support that claim instead of just talking about what you personally didn't like.
    • You cannot really prove that working on more games at once hurts TWD development but you can clearly see that people are GENERALY more disappointed with this episode meaning, that something was wrong. Its still best game around without any competition BUT again... TTG can do better, so why they are lowering their standards??
      • No, I can't prove that working on more games at once hurts TWD development, but you can't disprove it, either. However, I just don't think it's reasonable to argue that it does when you don't have the facts about what's going on. And even though you can see general disappointment with episode 3, that doesn't mean something's wrong. There're also unanswered questions of how many people actually like or dislike the episode, and to say they're 'lowering their standards' is unfounded. There's a reason 'appeal to popularity' is a logical fallacy.
    • I think that "most rushed episode" more refers to the pacing and duration of the episode, not the amount of time it took to release. This episode only took about an hour and a half to explore everything, and a LOT happened. It felt a bit crowded.
  • I agree.

    This was first episode I was not mind blown afterwards.
  • I don't think you can blame Carver's death or any supposed bad writing on working on 4 project at once. However, I can't be sure if we could've had more from the 400 days characters if there were more people working on TWD. I get the time between episodes is a pressure and I did like this episode, but I just wanted to see more of them.
  • I agree with you, they can do better, and they should do better. A lot of the things you're complaining about seem kind of nitpicky though.

    Except for totally failing to utilize the 400 Days characters, and Carver maybe being a little lame, the writing wasn't bad. It seems like you're simply surprised that the story didn't go in the direction that you were expecting it to.
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